| KevinM1 |
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Hey all, like others I'm someone finally making the commitment to PF/Paizo because of license shenanigans. I bought last year's PF 2e Humble Bundle, and it's great. However, even with the campaign setting info from the soon-to-be-outdated Core Rulebook and various Lost Omens books that were in that bundle, I still don't feel like I have a good grasp of the setting. Of how it looks and feels in practice.
So, with that said, what could you recommend - novels, comics, whatever - that you feel really nails down the setting? The tone, the politics, the living, breathing Golarion?
Thanks in advance!
| Totally Not Gorbacz |
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
The thing is, Golarion is a kitchen sink, so no one specific place or topic "nails down the setting". Unlike, say, Warhammer's Old World, which everything is pretty much consistently a) dark b) bleak c) not-Reneissance Europe, Golarion has so much variation in themes and locales that you can hardly paint it all with one brush. If you'd share what area/theme you're after, nailing down good sources to get a feel about that place would be much easier.
| Sibelius Eos Owm |
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
When it comes to Brevoy, there's this obscure little book series that the region was more or less directly inspired by and created as an homage to. I'd bet these books could give you something of the right idea--the series is called A Song of Ice and Fire :P
(I am being a little silly, but it's true that when Brevoy was designed, ASoIaF didn't have nearly the renown it does today and showed no signs that Game of Thrones would soon become a household name)
But not-Gorbacz is right, each region could have its own reading list, so depending the tone you're looking for will depend what you'd want to read. Ustalav is every gothic horror trope from mountainous countryside haunted by lingering dead and woods filled with werewolves to cities where the cutting edge of science creates flesh golems and the catacombs are host to vampires.
Varisia meanwhile is a typical adventurer's land of ruins and adventure--it's really kind of the jumping off point for classic adventuring tropes.
On the other hand, you could go to the other side of the Inner Sea and have some good old knights and castles fighting dragons with the kingdoms around Taldor, where dwarves live in the moutnains and elves in the forest.
This isn't even getting into the whole Mwangi Expanse or little Egypt in Garund, right next to a technological city in a magic-starved wasteland.
And I would be remiss not to mention how Numeria provides everything you might need for a barbarians and robots sci-fantasy feel.
zimmerwald1915
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The thing is, Golarion is a kitchen sink, so no one specific place or topic "nails down the setting". Unlike, say, Warhammer's Old World, which everything is pretty much consistently a) dark b) bleak c) not-Reneissance Europe, Golarion has so much variation in themes and locales that you can hardly paint it all with one brush. If you'd share what area/theme you're after, nailing down good sources to get a feel about that place would be much easier.
I think OP is asking for Paizo products that give a feel for the setting, not extra-setting or setting-inspirational works. More along the lines of "read Nightglass if you want a feel for Nidal," not "read The Scarlet Pimpernel if you want a feel for Galt."
That said, OP, pick a nation if you want to get recommendations for setting material that will be applicable to your needs, as they are hermetically sealed boxes rather than parts of a cohesive world.
| Perpdepog |
| 4 people marked this as a favorite. |
Two works I'd recommend, both because they focus on some more Golarion-centric stuff and because they're good novels, are Death's Heretic and The Redemption Engine, both by James L. Sutter. He's written lots of stuff for Pathfinder and Starfinder.
The books take place in some pretty Golarion-focused locales, have an iconic Pathfinder deity as the nominal focus of both novels, and are a good time to boot.
I'd also recommend Hellknight, written by Liane Merciel. The novel deals with the Hellknights, unsurprisingly, which are an iconic Golarion organization. It's also a fun read.
| KevinM1 |
Totally Not Gorbacz wrote:The thing is, Golarion is a kitchen sink, so no one specific place or topic "nails down the setting". Unlike, say, Warhammer's Old World, which everything is pretty much consistently a) dark b) bleak c) not-Reneissance Europe, Golarion has so much variation in themes and locales that you can hardly paint it all with one brush. If you'd share what area/theme you're after, nailing down good sources to get a feel about that place would be much easier.I think OP is asking for Paizo products that give a feel for the setting, not extra-setting or setting-inspirational works. More along the lines of "read Nightglass if you want a feel for Nidal," not "read The Scarlet Pimpernel if you want a feel for Galt."
Yes, this. Apologies for not being clearer. But, yes, I'm looking for in-setting material beyond the various Lost Omen books themselves.
That said, OP, pick a nation if you want to get recommendations for setting material that will be applicable to your needs, as they are hermetically sealed boxes rather than parts of a cohesive world.
Ah... that's interesting. My TTRPG background is mostly Forgotten Realms, and (IMO) that setting is large and detailed, but a lot of it feels same-y. Adventures in the Sword Coast don't feel all that different than adventures in Cormyr, or The Dalelands, or.... That's not to say that it's completely uniform (looking at you, Thay). But there's definitely a sort of standard FR feel that permeates most of the setting.
So, it's really interesting to hear that each nation (or... region?) of Golarion is really its own thing with its own flavor.
To hone in a bit more, I'm specifically looking for more info to flesh out a couple potential character backgrounds:
1. Orc Inventor. The idea is that he got injured defending Belkzen from the most recent lich incursion. As I'm a physically disabled from birth person, the idea of having a character with both a visible physical disability as well as the assistive technology to (in part, anyway) overcome it is incredibly appealing. That said, I have 0 idea about Golarion Orc culture, specifically about Belkzen Orcs. So, anything that goes into their culture, religion, outlooks on someone using tech to remain a warrior would be great.
2. Elf Magus. Specifically, a Laughing Shadow. This one is a much more nebulous concept, mostly because I know nothing about Golarion Elves. The basic character sketch is that he's the black sheep of the family. Essentially dropped out of Wizard school and uses his magic gifts to... be a menace, really. Steal, spy, do dumb and dangerous things. Problem is, I don't know where to place him... what city/nation/region, what kind of elf, etc. I don't know where he fits.
Once again, thank you all for your help! And apologies for not being specific the first time.
| KevinM1 |
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Two works I'd recommend, both because they focus on some more Golarion-centric stuff and because they're good novels, are Death's Heretic and The Redemption Engine, both by James L. Sutter. He's written lots of stuff for Pathfinder and Starfinder.
The books take place in some pretty Golarion-focused locales, have an iconic Pathfinder deity as the nominal focus of both novels, and are a good time to boot.I'd also recommend Hellknight, written by Liane Merciel. The novel deals with the Hellknights, unsurprisingly, which are an iconic Golarion organization. It's also a fun read.
Thanks so much for the recommendations! I'll consume all the lore I can get my hands on, regardless if it ties into my potential characters or not.
| Dancing Wind |
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
You may find the Pathfinder Wiki a useful tool for figuring out which resource materials to read/buy.
For example, the entry for Belkzen, Hold of the Orc Hordes, a Pathfinder Campaign Setting sourcebook, gives you an overview of that publication.
In addition, many of the articles about specific topics have a list of references at the bottom that will lead you to relevant products
Laughing Shadow
Edit:
Golarion has not changed all that much since the first setting books were published. You'll find that setting materials from PF1 are still extremely useful and relevant.
zimmerwald1915
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Golarion has not changed all that much since the first setting books were published. You'll find that setting materials from PF1 are still extremely useful and relevant.
This is entirely incorrect. Both Orcs of Golarion and Belkzen, Hold of the Orc Hordes have been superseded by radical reformations, and just about everything published about elves in 1E was done so in actual error.
| Perpdepog |
Perpdepog wrote:Thanks so much for the recommendations! I'll consume all the lore I can get my hands on, regardless if it ties into my potential characters or not.Two works I'd recommend, both because they focus on some more Golarion-centric stuff and because they're good novels, are Death's Heretic and The Redemption Engine, both by James L. Sutter. He's written lots of stuff for Pathfinder and Starfinder.
The books take place in some pretty Golarion-focused locales, have an iconic Pathfinder deity as the nominal focus of both novels, and are a good time to boot.I'd also recommend Hellknight, written by Liane Merciel. The novel deals with the Hellknights, unsurprisingly, which are an iconic Golarion organization. It's also a fun read.
Glad to help! David Gross is another Pathfinder Tales author I would recommend. He was the first novelist, I believe, and he's written a fair few books, Prince of Wolves, Master of Devils, Queen of Thorns, King of Chaos, and Lord of Runes, all with the same characters, Count Jeggare and his bodyguard Radovan. They're members of the Pathfinder Society, so the pair wander all over the place getting into trouble.
1. Orc Inventor. The idea is that he got injured defending Belkzen from the most recent lich incursion. As I'm a physically disabled from birth person, the idea of having a character with both a visible physical disability as well as the assistive technology to (in part, anyway) overcome it is incredibly appealing. That said, I have 0 idea about Golarion Orc culture, specifically about Belkzen Orcs. So, anything that goes into their culture, religion, outlooks on someone using tech to remain a warrior would be great.
I'm not sure how orcs would feel about using things like assistive items. They are proud, scarification and battle-scars are big with them for example, but I don't know how they feel specifically about someone using outside items to overcome a disability. Notably the inventor iconic Droven uses a prosthetic arm and is a half-orc, or a dromaar as they will be known after the remaster.
Some places your orc could have gone during their travels to get such a prosthetic would be Alkenstar, perhaps the Clockwork Cathedral in Absalom, or possibly somewhere in Ustalav or Numeria.| Dancing Wind |
Dancing Wind wrote:Golarion has not changed all that much since the first setting books were published. You'll find that setting materials from PF1 are still extremely useful and relevant.This is entirely incorrect. Both Orcs of Golarion and Belkzen, Hold of the Orc Hordes have been superseded by radical reformations, and just about everything published about elves in 1E was done so in actual error.
Everything about drow is now claimed to be "actual error", but all elves? Any links for that? And yes, orcs have been rehabilitated spectactularly.
None the less, much of the setting material from PF1 is still relevant. Some of it was published just weeks before PF2 launced (Druma, Profit And Prophecy) and was deliberately designed to work with future APs.
Among other things, Thursty and I put a lot of consideration into ensuring that Druma's adventure potential was robust enough to support a Druma-centric Adventure Path should the opportunity and interest arise.
Unlike DnD there was no setting-shattering event between PF1 and PF2. The history of the world was advanced to account for the outcomes of the previous adventure paths, but no-one pushed a 'reset' button to nullify what had gone before. So yes, the world has changed and it has stayed the same. Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.
| Sibelius Eos Owm |
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
zimmerwald1915 wrote:Everything about drow is now claimed to be "actual error", but all elves? Any links for that?Dancing Wind wrote:Golarion has not changed all that much since the first setting books were published. You'll find that setting materials from PF1 are still extremely useful and relevant.This is entirely incorrect. Both Orcs of Golarion and Belkzen, Hold of the Orc Hordes have been superseded by radical reformations, and just about everything published about elves in 1E was done so in actual error.
Zimmerwald likely refers to how, in a time with less creative directorial oversight, Elves of Golarion ended up being published with a lot of material that made elves out to be more like the better-than-thou xenophobic elves common in fantasy (sometimes ascribed to Tolkienian inspiration), where the intent for Golarion elves had been to make them more truly befitting of the "usually CG" alignment tag as a free-spirited and benevolent people who travel widely and whose aiudara network was intended as a way to bring different peoples closer together.
zimmerwald1915
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Dancing Wind wrote:Zimmerwald likely refers to how, in a time with less creative directorial oversight, Elves of Golarion ended up being published with a lot of material that made elves out to be more like the better-than-thou xenophobic elves common in fantasy (sometimes ascribed to Tolkienian inspiration), where the intent for Golarion elves had been to make them more truly befitting of the "usually CG" alignment tag as a free-spirited and benevolent people who travel widely and whose aiudara network was intended as a way to bring different peoples closer together.zimmerwald1915 wrote:Everything about drow is now claimed to be "actual error", but all elves? Any links for that?Dancing Wind wrote:Golarion has not changed all that much since the first setting books were published. You'll find that setting materials from PF1 are still extremely useful and relevant.This is entirely incorrect. Both Orcs of Golarion and Belkzen, Hold of the Orc Hordes have been superseded by radical reformations, and just about everything published about elves in 1E was done so in actual error.
Not just Elves of Golarion reinforced those vibes, but also A Memory of Darkness. Elves of Golarion also referred to elves not sleeping, when that has never been the intent for the setting.
| keftiu |
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
It’s worth saying that the lore and perspective of folks writing it has evolved over 15 years in print, and that the 2e vision of things hasn’t had a chance to be supported by any novels. A lot of 1e was a fair bit edgier in how it presented itself (including on things like non-European cultures), which likely shines through in the old fiction.
| Perpdepog |
It’s worth saying that the lore and perspective of folks writing it has evolved over 15 years in print, and that the 2e vision of things hasn’t had a chance to be supported by any novels. A lot of 1e was a fair bit edgier in how it presented itself (including on things like non-European cultures), which likely shines through in the old fiction.
I want a new wave of Pathfinder Tales novels so much.
| Bokavordur |
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I will second the wiki for most things.
I have said before that I am a newbie to this world, but I dive into lore as it is my favourite part about a fantasy game. I have really found a lot of use from reading the wiki on different regions and such, and when those are only stubs (ie fetchlings, one of my favourite ancestries), I turn to the blurbs on Archives of Nethys and the books that have a bit more. Not perfect, but it helps.
There are definitely sections that I personally would love more info and details.
As to your example characters:
1 - Belkzen is really cool and excellent, and with the recent push to change their scattered ways, it is possible that group of orcs would be more willing to accommodate one of their own using assistive technology which would likely be brought over from Ustalav. But that said, orcs are all over the place in the Inner Sea (yay common now!), so it might make more sense, culturally, for this character to hail from Alkenstar, Ustalav, Numeria, Absalom, or another region that is more prone to tech and adjustments. That said, orcs in Golarion will likely see a shift in their religion, I foresee, with the fact that the orc gods have all been evil (at least the ones named and mentioned), but they also worship the main 20 gods as well.
2 - Elves are also all over the world, so it depends on how invested into their elven-ness you want this character to be. Are they from the elf capital of the Inner Sea? Kyonin is the bet there, which is really fascinating and leans into the alienness of elves on Golarion. But if you want more of "academic student" there is the big school in the Mwangi Expanse, The Magaambya, which is kind of like a huge university in Sub-Saharan Africa, and there are local elves in Mwangi as well if they are from the area (Lost Omens Mwangi Expanse and the player's guide for Strength of Thousands would be excellent tools). But there are other universities as well, I think Nethys has a university in The Golden Road, and there is a formal university (less magic more regular uni) in Ustalav (I think in the Palatinates). That said though, it would make sense for that kind of character to find a home in Absalom, as a huge mega city with opportunity, as well as the nation of Andoran (from a free spirit perspective), but also might find a place on the High Seas. I could see a Laughing Shadow magus fitting right in up in the River Kingdoms as well!
Rysky
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| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Sibelius Eos Owm wrote:Not just Elves of Golarion reinforced those vibes, but also A Memory of Darkness. Elves of Golarion also referred to elves not sleeping, when that has never been the intent for the setting.Dancing Wind wrote:Zimmerwald likely refers to how, in a time with less creative directorial oversight, Elves of Golarion ended up being published with a lot of material that made elves out to be more like the better-than-thou xenophobic elves common in fantasy (sometimes ascribed to Tolkienian inspiration), where the intent for Golarion elves had been to make them more truly befitting of the "usually CG" alignment tag as a free-spirited and benevolent people who travel widely and whose aiudara network was intended as a way to bring different peoples closer together.zimmerwald1915 wrote:Everything about drow is now claimed to be "actual error", but all elves? Any links for that?Dancing Wind wrote:Golarion has not changed all that much since the first setting books were published. You'll find that setting materials from PF1 are still extremely useful and relevant.This is entirely incorrect. Both Orcs of Golarion and Belkzen, Hold of the Orc Hordes have been superseded by radical reformations, and just about everything published about elves in 1E was done so in actual error.
Elves of Golarion was a DND 3.5 book, not Pathfinder. Elves did not sleep in 3.5.
Archpaladin Zousha
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| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
zimmerwald1915 wrote:Elves of Golarion was a DND 3.5 book, not Pathfinder. Elves did not sleep in 3.5.Sibelius Eos Owm wrote:Not just Elves of Golarion reinforced those vibes, but also A Memory of Darkness. Elves of Golarion also referred to elves not sleeping, when that has never been the intent for the setting.Dancing Wind wrote:Zimmerwald likely refers to how, in a time with less creative directorial oversight, Elves of Golarion ended up being published with a lot of material that made elves out to be more like the better-than-thou xenophobic elves common in fantasy (sometimes ascribed to Tolkienian inspiration), where the intent for Golarion elves had been to make them more truly befitting of the "usually CG" alignment tag as a free-spirited and benevolent people who travel widely and whose aiudara network was intended as a way to bring different peoples closer together.zimmerwald1915 wrote:Everything about drow is now claimed to be "actual error", but all elves? Any links for that?Dancing Wind wrote:Golarion has not changed all that much since the first setting books were published. You'll find that setting materials from PF1 are still extremely useful and relevant.This is entirely incorrect. Both Orcs of Golarion and Belkzen, Hold of the Orc Hordes have been superseded by radical reformations, and just about everything published about elves in 1E was done so in actual error.
Not to mention so was the whole of Second Darkness as an AP. Pathfinder was still just a Campaign Setting at the time, and wouldn't be its own game until two APs later, when Council of Thieves started.
Arcaian
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| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
Yeah, in my experience most of the PF1-era setting content is still applicable to PF2, but often presented in a different (and in my opinion, better) light in PF2. Much of the 3.5-era content is simply non-canonical at this point, or changed so significantly that it's not really worth going back to if you want to understand the current setting.
zimmerwald1915
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| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Elves of Golarion was a DND 3.5 book, not Pathfinder. Elves did not sleep in 3.5.
Elves were equally immune to magic sleep effects in D&D3.5 and in PF1. Whether that immunity to a magical compulsion meant that they slept naturally was a separate matter, and left to the campaign setting to determine. Elves did not sleep in Forgotten Realms, but were always meant to sleep in Golarion.
| KevinM1 |
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I will second the wiki for most things.
I have said before that I am a newbie to this world, but I dive into lore as it is my favourite part about a fantasy game. I have really found a lot of use from reading the wiki on different regions and such, and when those are only stubs (ie fetchlings, one of my favourite ancestries), I turn to the blurbs on Archives of Nethys and the books that have a bit more. Not perfect, but it helps.
There are definitely sections that I personally would love more info and details.
As to your example characters:
1 - Belkzen is really cool and excellent, and with the recent push to change their scattered ways, it is possible that group of orcs would be more willing to accommodate one of their own using assistive technology which would likely be brought over from Ustalav. But that said, orcs are all over the place in the Inner Sea (yay common now!), so it might make more sense, culturally, for this character to hail from Alkenstar, Ustalav, Numeria, Absalom, or another region that is more prone to tech and adjustments. That said, orcs in Golarion will likely see a shift in their religion, I foresee, with the fact that the orc gods have all been evil (at least the ones named and mentioned), but they also worship the main 20 gods as well.
2 - Elves are also all over the world, so it depends on how invested into their elven-ness you want this character to be. Are they from the elf capital of the Inner Sea? Kyonin is the bet there, which is really fascinating and leans into the alienness of elves on Golarion. But if you want more of "academic student" there is the big school in the Mwangi Expanse, The Magaambya, which is kind of like a huge university in Sub-Saharan Africa, and there are local elves in Mwangi as well if they are from the area (Lost Omens Mwangi Expanse and the player's guide for Strength of Thousands would be excellent tools). But there are other universities as well, I think Nethys has a university in The Golden Road, and there is a formal university...
This is exactly what I’m looking for! Thank you!
Yeah, I have the Lost Omens World Guide pdf, and as great as it is, it doesn’t dive as deep as I want in certain respects (which isn’t meant as a slight to the authors).
Take Belkzen: it feels like there’s a concerted effort by the devs to make the orcs more interesting and fleshed out than the stereotype, especially when it comes to actually becoming a nation and not just various infighting clans. Evidence of this is with the book mentioning that other kinds of people - artisans, merchants, etc. - are now welcome. That the leadership realizes that in order to become an actual nation (especially one that can successfully build alliances to fend off the Whispering Tyrant) their society needs to offer more than just warriors.
To me, that’s super interesting and has a lot of potential for both adventure hooks and character moments. That said, I’d like to know more. What are the clans in the Hold? What are the points of contention between them? Are any of the clans good (in terms of ethics/morality rather than the soon-to-be-jettisoned mechanic)? Where can I fit a character I would like to play within that setup? Your reply answers a lot of those questions, so, again: thanks!
From a lore POV I feel like I have a very top level, Reader’s Digest idea of the setting and people, even with the Wiki(s). And then I’m not sure how much of this kind of information is provided by the devs, and how much is left to players to figure out at the table. Being a lore nerd in general, I want to learn as much as possible.
Set
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2. Elf Magus. Specifically, a Laughing Shadow. This one is a much more nebulous concept, mostly because I know nothing about Golarion Elves. The basic character sketch is that he's the black sheep of the family. Essentially dropped out of Wizard school and uses his magic gifts to... be a menace, really. Steal, spy, do dumb and dangerous things. Problem is, I don't know where to place him... what city/nation/region, what kind of elf, etc. I don't know where he fits.
So here's some thoughts for the antisocial elf magus. (The character, like pretty much everyone, might not be a reliable narrator, so I've phrased what follows with an editorial slant!)
Elves in Golarion are from another world entirely, having arrived via magical portals.
When an age of darkness fell upon the land, the majority of them ****ed off through their magic gates and left Golarion and her peoples to burn. A minority remained behind. Some chose to do so, to fight for their new home and alongside the other races who couldn't leave. Some just didn't make it to the gates in time to catch the last evacuation boat. And it's entirely possible that some were just unpopular with the ruling regime and their invitations to the big evacuation were 'lost in the mail' and they got left behind deliberately... Elves aren't always nice.
Eventually the age of darkness ended, and the elves-who-ran came flitting back to reclaim their abandoned communities and place on Golarion. The 'Forlorn elves' who stayed behind have their own cultures now on Golarion, the Snowcaster elves of the frozen north, the Ekujae of the Mwangi jungles, etc., etc.
Some of them aren't terribly impressed with the elves who have come back 'now that it's safe,' while the elves who spent so long on their home world seem to think that the elves who stayed are a sad broken remnant of their proud people, sunk into some sort of primitive uncultured state, and regard them with pity (as the title 'forlorn' suggests). Some 'Forlorn' even buy into this. Others think the elves-who-left when the going got tough should have stayed gone, rather than flounce back when the smoke cleared and acted all superior because they ran away.
As a result, an elf with a MASSIVE chip on his shoulder, all about being tough and independent, but *also* quite willing to ally with other races, like humans, dwarves, etc., races who *didn't* run away when the going got tough, while having some bitter opinions about the renewed elven nation of Kyonin (which is mostly populated by new arrivals from the home world), could be very on-theme.
Almost any of the elven groups that remained on Golarion would be suitable for generating an 'angry elf' who is out to prove he can outfight anyone (even if he has to use magic to even the odds) turning what turned out to be an unexceptional wizardly bent into a more 'magic enhanced martial' direction, so that he could instead of being a sub-par wizard *or* a sub-par swordsman, he could be an *exceptional* magus, combining the two skillsets.
Check out words like Snowcaster, Ekujae, Mordant Spire, etc. to google up some 'forlorn' elves to get some ideas about cultural details (Mordant Spire elves wear masks), skin tones (Ekujae elves are darker skinned), hair colors (Snowcasters look like the blonder half of Abba), etc. (The elves of Kyonin, the elven capital, on the other hand, tend to be the hoity-toity sorts that he'd despise.)
Arcaian
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From a lore POV I feel like I have a very top level, Reader’s Digest idea of the setting and people, even with the Wiki(s). And then I’m not sure how much of this kind of information is provided by the devs, and how much is left to players to figure out at the table. Being a lore nerd in general, I want to learn as much as possible.
It sounds like you could be interested in the Travel Guide! :) It's a book that is meant to explain a lot more of the down-to-earth parts of the setting - the holidays people celebrate, the food they eat, different lifestyles, what housing looks like across the setting, and so on. It's a very lore-focused book, with not much in the way of mechanics, so if you want to get away from a top-level idea of the setting, I think it'd be a great book!
| KevinM1 |
So here's some thoughts for the antisocial elf magus. (The character, like pretty much everyone, might not be a reliable narrator, so I've phrased what follows with an editorial slant!)
Elves in Golarion are from another world entirely, having arrived via magical portals.
When an age of darkness fell upon the land, the majority of them ****ed off through their magic gates and left Golarion and her peoples to burn. A minority remained behind. Some chose to do so, to fight for their new home and alongside the other races who couldn't leave. Some just didn't make it to the gates in time to catch the last evacuation boat. And it's entirely possible that some were just unpopular with the ruling regime and their invitations to the big evacuation were 'lost in the mail' and they got left behind deliberately... Elves aren't always nice.
Eventually the age of darkness ended, and the elves-who-ran came flitting back to reclaim their abandoned communities and place on Golarion. The 'Forlorn elves' who stayed behind have their own cultures now on Golarion, the Snowcaster elves of the frozen north, the Ekujae of the Mwangi jungles, etc., etc.
Some of them aren't terribly impressed with the elves who have come back 'now that it's safe,' while the elves who spent so long on their home world seem to think that the elves who stayed are a sad broken remnant of their proud people, sunk into some sort of primitive uncultured state, and regard them with pity (as the title 'forlorn' suggests). Some 'Forlorn' even buy into this. Others think the elves-who-left when the going got tough should have stayed gone, rather than flounce back when the smoke cleared and acted all superior because they ran away.
As a result, an elf with a MASSIVE chip on his shoulder, all about being tough and independent, but *also* quite willing to ally with other races, like humans, dwarves, etc., races who *didn't* run away when the going got tough, while having some bitter opinions about the renewed elven nation of Kyonin (which is mostly populated by new arrivals from the home world), could be very on-theme.
Almost any of the elven groups that remained on Golarion would be suitable for generating an 'angry elf' who is out to prove he can outfight anyone (even if he has to use magic to even the odds) turning what turned out to be an unexceptional wizardly bent into a more 'magic enhanced martial' direction, so that he could instead of being a sub-par wizard *or* a sub-par swordsman, he could be an *exceptional* magus, combining the two skillsets.
Check out words like Snowcaster, Ekujae, Mordant Spire, etc. to google up some 'forlorn' elves to get some ideas about cultural details (Mordant Spire elves wear masks), skin tones (Ekujae elves are darker skinned), hair colors (Snowcasters look like the blonder half of Abba), etc. (The elves of Kyonin, the elven capital, on the other hand, tend to be the hoity-toity sorts that he'd despise.)
This is great! I knew/read about the exodus and return, but figured it would be ancient history even for the elves. I need to pay more attention to the dates.
And it works well because I've actually been in something of a similar position personally. 20+ years ago, my family went through some trying times. One of my older brothers left during the worst of it, and only came back once the dust settled. It definitely created some animosity. We all love my brother, and things are better now, but it was... tense for a few years. I can imagine the time frame of such feelings extending far longer for an elf.
It sounds like you could be interested in the Travel Guide! :) It's a book that is meant to explain a lot more of the down-to-earth parts of the setting - the holidays people celebrate, the food they eat, different lifestyles, what housing looks like across the setting, and so on. It's a very lore-focused book, with not much in the way of mechanics, so if you want to get away from a top-level idea of the setting, I think it'd be a great book!
Woohoo! Another one to add to the rapidly growing list!
Thanks again, everyone!
| Dancing Wind |
The Raven Black
|
This is exactly what I’m looking for! Thank you!
Yeah, I have the Lost Omens World Guide pdf, and as great as it is, it doesn’t dive as deep as I want in certain respects (which isn’t meant as a slight to the authors).
Take Belkzen: it feels like there’s a concerted effort by the devs to make the orcs more interesting and fleshed out than the stereotype, especially when it comes to actually becoming a nation and not just various infighting clans. Evidence of this is with the book mentioning that other kinds of people - artisans, merchants, etc. - are now welcome. That the leadership realizes that in order to become an actual nation (especially one that can successfully build alliances to fend off the Whispering Tyrant) their society needs to offer more than just warriors.
To me, that’s super interesting and has a lot of potential for both adventure hooks and character moments. That said, I’d like to know more. What are the clans in the Hold? What are the points of contention between them? Are any of the clans good (in terms of ethics/morality rather than the soon-to-be-jettisoned mechanic)? Where can I fit a character I would like to play within that setup? Your reply answers a lot of those questions, so, again: thanks!
From a lore POV I feel like I have a very top level, Reader’s Digest idea of the setting and people, even with the Wiki(s). And then I’m not sure how much of this kind of information is provided by the devs, and how much is left to players to figure out at the table. Being a lore nerd in general, I want to learn as much as possible.
LO Legends has excellent recent info on several key places (and movers and shakers) of the setting, including Belkzen.
For the latter, of exceptional note is the Burning Sun tribe, worshippers of Sarenrae. The most recent news about them is that their latest leader Mahja Firehair died in glorious battle and ascended to defy and kill a deity.
| KevinM1 |
KevinM1 wrote:This is exactly what I’m looking for! Thank you!
Yeah, I have the Lost Omens World Guide pdf, and as great as it is, it doesn’t dive as deep as I want in certain respects (which isn’t meant as a slight to the authors).
Take Belkzen: it feels like there’s a concerted effort by the devs to make the orcs more interesting and fleshed out than the stereotype, especially when it comes to actually becoming a nation and not just various infighting clans. Evidence of this is with the book mentioning that other kinds of people - artisans, merchants, etc. - are now welcome. That the leadership realizes that in order to become an actual nation (especially one that can successfully build alliances to fend off the Whispering Tyrant) their society needs to offer more than just warriors.
To me, that’s super interesting and has a lot of potential for both adventure hooks and character moments. That said, I’d like to know more. What are the clans in the Hold? What are the points of contention between them? Are any of the clans good (in terms of ethics/morality rather than the soon-to-be-jettisoned mechanic)? Where can I fit a character I would like to play within that setup? Your reply answers a lot of those questions, so, again: thanks!
From a lore POV I feel like I have a very top level, Reader’s Digest idea of the setting and people, even with the Wiki(s). And then I’m not sure how much of this kind of information is provided by the devs, and how much is left to players to figure out at the table. Being a lore nerd in general, I want to learn as much as possible.
LO Legends has excellent recent info on several key places (and movers and shakers) of the setting, including Belkzen.
For the latter, of exceptional note is the Burning Sun tribe, worshippers of Sarenrae. The most recent news about them is that their latest leader Mahja Firehair died in glorious battle and ascended to defy and kill a deity.
Awesome! Another one added to the list! Thanks so much!