Pathfinder Starfinder Society Subscriber
Hello there,
I am currently building a Sprite Fey Summoner for Strength of Thousands and have two rules questions:
1. Sprite and Fey Eidolon both give me Sylvan as a language. Am I out of luck here or can I select another language instead, like it is with skills most of the time?
2. The Eidolon gets 2 cantrips right away, which lead to me looking into Eidolon spellcasting a bit. The rules state that it uses my proficiency and spell attack rolls. But there is no mention about anything else. So it uses its own Charisma modifier for things like the damage on the Gale Blast Cantrip? That would be a pity. It seems like it was tailor made for something like a Fey Eidolon.
Yeah, #2 seems like it should also use the summoner's CHA, because very few eidolon stat lines have anything above a +1, and for the most part the cantrips that make sense would otherwise be offensive.
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Eidolons use their own stats for everything else, so spellcasting would be the same without specific language to the contrary
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Yes re: language, as unlike other elements, there's no wording (that I've read) about duplicates letting you choose an alternative. But ask your GM, as I'm pretty rigorous and I'd let you have a different language that fits the "fey" or "sprite" motif, i.e. Elvish.
Yes, you use the Eidelon's stat for Cantrip damage, making only a few Eidelon choices work w/ spellcasting (at least if relying on damaging Cantrips). One of the Fey options does come with 16 Charisma, so it's only -1 damage, and that'll go away with stat increases for 5th-9th & 15th-19th.
That said, Cantrips cannot be your main contribution to battle if you want to carry your own weight. The Eidelon would likely only use them when positioned better since you can't both cast in a round (though there easily could be a Tandem feat I missed that gets around that).
I think there's good cases for an eidolon to use some of the newer cantrips - Haunting Hymn or Gale Blast with their close range AoEs, or the always-nice Electric Arc.
Pathfinder Starfinder Society Subscriber
Castilliano wrote: Yes, you use the Eidelon's stat for Cantrip damage, making only a few Eidelon choices work w/ spellcasting (at least if relying on damaging Cantrips). One of the Fey options does come with 16 Charisma, so it's only -1 damage, and that'll go away with stat increases for 5th-9th & 15th-19th.
That said, Cantrips cannot be your main contribution to battle if you want to carry your own weight. The Eidelon would likely only use them when positioned better since you can't both cast in a round (though there easily could be a Tandem feat I missed that gets around that).
The mentioned Gale Blast would be a perfect example for the positioning, since it is centered on the caster and the Eidolon is much more likely to be in the thick of battle.
As far as the Fey with +3 to Cha: Yes, that is an option, but the strength mod is only 1, so the already bad melee damage goes down even further. And Con and Wis are 2 worse as well, reducing the saves. I am currently unsure if the whole concept of that Eidolon can really work...
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IMO the Fey Eidelon is only worthwhile for the casting, and maybe for ranged attacks (but not really).
If you want a melee Eidelon, every other option is better perhaps.
Keep in mind that gouging claw is an option for melee spellcasting.
Castilliano wrote: IMO the Fey Eidelon is only worthwhile for the casting, and maybe for ranged attacks (but not really).
If you want a melee Eidelon, every other option is better perhaps.
I wouldn't be that sure.
Stats is what counts mostly for an eidolon ( and being able to start with 14 str, 18 dex, 14 const is realyl good, though not good as 14 str, 18 dex, 16 const ), and what's left is
- Summoner Magic Tradition ( different spells ). For example, I prefer divine because of the heroism and vital beacon spell, but fey gift allows a primal spellcaster to also get heroism, which make them extremely cool.
- Eidolon attacks. Unfortunately, there's little which does better than strike x2. For example, draconic frenzy gives 3 attacks. Nice. Unfortunately, it doesn't allow the summoner to cast daze or electric arc, leaving apart that the 3rd attack is very unlikely to hit.
A fey might benefit from spells to enhance itself. For example, longstrider would allow the eidolon to get +10 feet status movement speed withtou the need of the lvl 2 class feat. True strike or see invisibility would help with specific enemies, and so on.
It became my favorite type because it's too efficient in terms of possibilities.
HumbleGamer wrote: Castilliano wrote: IMO the Fey Eidelon is only worthwhile for the casting, and maybe for ranged attacks (but not really).
If you want a melee Eidelon, every other option is better perhaps.
I wouldn't be that sure.
Stats is what counts mostly for an eidolon ( and being able to start with 14 str, 18 dex, 14 const is realyl good, though not good as 14 str, 18 dex, 16 const ), and what's left is
- Summoner Magic Tradition ( different spells ). For example, I prefer divine because of the heroism and vital beacon spell, but fey gift allows a primal spellcaster to also get heroism, which make them extremely cool.
- Eidolon attacks. Unfortunately, there's little which does better than strike x2. For example, draconic frenzy gives 3 attacks. Nice. Unfortunately, it doesn't allow the summoner to cast daze or electric arc, leaving apart that the 3rd attack is very unlikely to hit.
A fey might benefit from spells to enhance itself. For example, longstrider would allow the eidolon to get +10 feet status movement speed withtou the need of the lvl 2 class feat. True strike or see invisibility would help with specific enemies, and so on.
It became my favorite type because it's too efficient in terms of possibilities. Fey gift only give enchantment and Illusion from the Arcane tradition that does not have Heroism.
Eidolon attacks ends better than your cantrips, if the casting of the cantrips makes the Eidolon only attack once that turn, it's better to actually Strike twice with boost eidolon.
Kyrone wrote: HumbleGamer wrote: Castilliano wrote: IMO the Fey Eidelon is only worthwhile for the casting, and maybe for ranged attacks (but not really).
If you want a melee Eidelon, every other option is better perhaps.
I wouldn't be that sure.
Stats is what counts mostly for an eidolon ( and being able to start with 14 str, 18 dex, 14 const is realyl good, though not good as 14 str, 18 dex, 16 const ), and what's left is
- Summoner Magic Tradition ( different spells ). For example, I prefer divine because of the heroism and vital beacon spell, but fey gift allows a primal spellcaster to also get heroism, which make them extremely cool.
- Eidolon attacks. Unfortunately, there's little which does better than strike x2. For example, draconic frenzy gives 3 attacks. Nice. Unfortunately, it doesn't allow the summoner to cast daze or electric arc, leaving apart that the 3rd attack is very unlikely to hit.
A fey might benefit from spells to enhance itself. For example, longstrider would allow the eidolon to get +10 feet status movement speed withtou the need of the lvl 2 class feat. True strike or see invisibility would help with specific enemies, and so on.
It became my favorite type because it's too efficient in terms of possibilities. Fey gift only give enchantment and Illusion from the Arcane tradition that does not have Heroism.
Eidolon attacks ends better than your cantrips, if the casting of the cantrips makes the Eidolon only attack once that turn, it's better to actually Strike twice with boost eidolon. God, you are right about heroism ( gonna move back to divine eidolons or occult ones, I guess ).
As for the attacks, exactly.
Even by lvl 1 you'll be able to extend boost for 3 rounds, resulting into 2x strikes + electric arc.
By lvl 5, haste provided, you'll be able to do it every round without the need to expend a focus point ( which you could use on round 1 to cast lifeboost = Stride + lifeboost + haste ).
From the 2nd round on it would be strike x2 ( 1 action + quickened ) + electric arc + boost eidolon.
Pretty straightforward.
It appears that the wording for eidolons copies from the familiar Spellcasting ability. But that ability can't do cantrips.
Which actually led me to an equivalent rules conundrum. If a familiar casts Dispel Magic, what happens? It doesn't have any ability modifiers at all for a counteract check!
So, presumably, it has to use either the PC's modifier by default? It doesn't have a 0, it has a NaN, undefined, null, etc.
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