If a monk for instance was to multiclass into a spellcasting Archetype, which one would grant the most spell slots?
I'm figuring Wizard, even without a ring.
What do you think?
I'm not concerned with high level spells or attacking with the spells, just utility and buffing.
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They are all the same as far as I am aware: One slot per spell level, 3 spell levels per feat, plus 1 more slot per spell level for spell levels at least 2 below your max if you take the appropriate 'Breadth' feat.
Basic Spellcasting Feat: Available at 4th level, these feats grant a 1st-level spell slot. At 6th level, they grant you a 2nd-level spell slot, and if you have a spell repertoire, you can select one spell from your repertoire as a signature spell. At 8th level, they grant you a 3rd-level spell slot. Archetypes refer to these benefits as the “basic spellcasting benefits.”
Expert Spellcasting Feat: Taken at 12th level, these feats make you an expert in spell attack rolls and DCs of the appropriate magical tradition and grant you a 4th-level spell slot. If you have a spell repertoire, you can select a second spell from your repertoire as a signature spell. At 14th level, they grant you a 5th-level spell slot, and at 16th level, they grant you a 6th-level spell slot. Archetypes refer to these benefits as the “expert spellcasting benefits.”
Master Spellcasting Feat: Upon reaching 18th level, these feats make you a master in spell attack rolls and DCs of the appropriate magical tradition and grant you a 7th-level spell slot. If you have a spell repertoire, you can select a third spell from your repertoire as a signature spell. At 20th level, they grant you an 8th-level spell slot. Archetypes refer to these benefits as the “master spellcasting benefits.
The difference is going to be type of casting [prepared or spontaneous], spell list and casting stat. Number of spells isn't a factor.
And how you regain focus. Sorcerer's "do nothing" method is worth mentioning.
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All Caster Archetypes sharing Basic Spellcasting Feats mean they are equal there. But that isn't necessarily entire story.
Class Feats offering Focus spells are major source of spells, albeit not "slots" in same sense. Cleric is especially diverse in ability to take all four Deity Domain spells if you wish. Some of these can directly duplicate "real" slot spells so are especially relevant: Force Bolt (Magic Missile) and Wild Shape (X Form spells) off the top of my head, polymorph forms often offering some utility feature.
Sorceror Divine and Primal Evolution give bonus slot for Heal/Harm or Summons, latter interesting in that Summons are inherently non-Stat/Proficiency dependent spell like buffs, but the summoned creatures can also have own utility/buffs.
Sorceror/Wizard/Druid also have access to Familiar which includes ability to gain bonus spells (Spell Battery).
Wizard while have the disadvantage of being a prep spellcaster foes have the advantage of being able to collect a wide range of spells.
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We should not be so quick to dismiss prepared casters. While they have a uniform number of spell slots, their spells known has the potential to be so much higher than prepared casters that you'll be able to form a much more expansive list of options.
No matter what, assuming taking all the feats, you'll get:
Cantrips: (2)
1st: (2)
2nd: (2)
3rd: (2) / (3)*
4th: (2) / (4)*
5th: (2)
6th: (2)
7th: (1)
8th: (1)
Ring of Wizardry* only works for Arcane spells, so that would favor an Arcane Sorcerer, Wizard or Witch.
Clerics have a lot of access to different focus spells, but this requires a lot of feat investment.
Druids have access to the best healing spells in the game, including Goodberry now that its been errattaed.
You have options! It really depends on what you want out your casting.
Thanks for all the ideas!
Looks like the ring makes Arcane casters the winner at least for me.
The Arcane Focus spells seem to mostly suck, TBH.
I like some of the druids focus spells and a few of the clerics,but anathemas are usually a unwelcome distraction.
The bard is exceptional,all the composition cantrips are great,and the focus spells seem mostly great as well,even though they are not available via Archetype till 6th level.
The only drawback of the Bard Archetype seems to be that it's not Arcane, so no ring.
Arcane sorcerer with Arcane Evolution might be some prepared casting along with spontaneous casting, though think I do prefer Intelligence as the casting stat, for more skills.
Wizards can get Scroll Savant for daily free use or lose scrolls-close enough to slots for me.
There is no way to multiclass into an Arcane bond that I can see, so no need to take Bond related feats into consideration.
The Arcane Witch Archetype might include a Familiar from the first feat, plus Intelligence for casting.
The Spell Battery ability seems great, can it be taken more than once?
I've written elsewhere about choosing an Ability free Familiar to free up Ability choices.
I previously thought Spell Battery (and other Familiar abilities) could be taken more than once, but a Developer explicitly confirmed it (and all Familiar Abilities) can't be, sharing implicit restriction against taking Feats more than once (unless explicitly allowed to).
Yeah, picking a Slug that does nothing but sits in your component pouch for Cantrip Connection / Spell Battery / Familiar Focus is legit usage, although inability to repeat Familiar Abilities constrains it's scaling. (either you don't have more than 2 abilities, or have more than 3 sooner or later)
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Wizards can get Scroll Savant for daily free use or lose scrolls-close enough to slots for me.
Note that, in order to get Scroll Savant on a Multiclass character, it would need to be taken as a 20th level feat.
Generally your classes capstones are worth more than 4 spells!
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Very true. Multiclassing is very distinct from actually having that base class.
Low level Feats, sure. Approaching Level 10 feats, you are paying out the nose for it after a looong wait.
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Staffs are really great for extending a milticlass character's spellcasting options too.
https://paizo.com/threads/rzs42ve5?Ancestral-Paragon-feat-selection#10
This was tangent on thread discussing similar situation re: Feat repeatability. Mark Seifter's response focused on particular language I identified in one ability that seemed congruent with default allowance of repeat ability instances (although that example didn't per se justify such, it was atop general lack of ban). But his broader point was that despite lack of explicit ban, Familiar Abilities LIKE Feats cannot be repeated by default (unless explicitly allowed, like armor proficiency).
I don't know if they will Errata that to be explicit, issue a FAQ or whatever, but that's clearly official design intent, no ambiguity.
Now I see somebody replying "hopefully now you'll believe it" to me, after I asked Mark and repeated back my understanding of no-repeat Familiar Ability or Feats.
Weirdly I never actually replied to or engaged with that person. Bonus points for the "lol", of course. /facepalm