How to improve an undead grappler?

[Chyrone]

Hello,

I'm trying to puzzle together an undead grapple based undead. Medium sized, has improved and greater grapple, along with Kraken style.
Lvl 8, of which 3 lvls are set, leaving 5 open.

Cmb stands at +17, but with prospect of a longer campaign, i'll need to keep a fair chance of grappling tougher foes, beasts perhaps even.

What would be a decent approach?

[Philippe Lam]

If you can provide the statblock for the character, that might better help point out what to boost

Unchained monks, brawlers would be the easiest to build around (in my POV), but it's up to you ultimately

[Chyrone]

Str -- Dex 20 Con -- Int 18 Wis 16 Cha 20.
It's a ghost that can hold corporeal things, using Dex instead of Str for CMB & dmg.

It's mainly the CMB i would like to keep track with.

I have taken a look at both monks and Brawlers. Monk i'd spend the Adopted trait on, to get aasimar option of being a non-lawful monk. (This undead is TN)

[LordKailas]

In terms of traits if you can swing it Adopted-> Final Embrace might be a better option.

As for classes I would suggest any of the following.

Brawler (Verdant Grappler)
Fighter (Unarmed Fighter)
Barbarian (Deepwater Rager)
Monk (Tetori)
Witch (White Haired Witch) with a a level dip in Hamatulatsu Master (for weapon focus hair, feral combat training, and flurry)

I agree that monk and brawler give you the most flexibility in that those classes/archetypes come pre-loaded with feats you were already planning on taking.

[Secret Wizard]

Well, first question:

Why is this creature grappling?

You could build them to grapple to disable while dealing chip damage, or burst grapples with the goal of dealing hard hitting conditions or a lot of quick damage.

[VoodistMonk]

Hopefully it's for Throat Slicer...

[Chyrone]

LordKailas wrote:

Suggestions

Verdant grappler looked interesting, true.

Barb is a pass, undead don't have Con scores.
WhW, was a maybe, though my unarmed strike deals much more than her hair would, as the ghost will have a locked gestalt class added, which provides unarmed 1d10 + dex & Int in this particular build.

@ Secret Wizard,
Grappling because hugging things into submission is amusing a concept i now had a chance to try produce something for. :P

Also, it could make a fun NPC to toss at players.

[Scott Wilhelm]

Chyrone wrote:

Str -- Dex 20 Con -- Int 18 Wis 16 Cha 20...

It's mainly the CMB i would like to keep track with.

I have taken a look at both monks and Brawlers. Monk i'd spend the Adopted trait on, to get aasimar option of being a non-lawful monk. (This undead is TN)

Chyrone wrote:

It's a ghost that can hold corporeal things...

So, this ghost is wearing an Amulet of Natural Armor or Mighty Fists with Ghost Touch? Or is wearing Ghost Touch Armor?

Chyrone wrote:

, using Dex instead of Str for CMB & dmg.

So it's taking Agile Maneuvers.

There are lots of ways to increase your Grapple Mod to shockingly high amounts.

Improved Grapple: +2
Greater Grapple: +2
Enlarge Person: +2
Weapon Focus Grapple: +1

King Crab Familiar: +2
Grab Ability (I like the Alchemist Tentacle Discovery): +4

Armbands of the Brawler: +1
Gauntlets of the Skilled Maneuver: +2
Adhesive Armor Enchantment: +2
Brawling Armor Enchantment: +2

Belt of Giant Strength
Alchemist Mutagen
True Strike

I like the Hamatula Strike Feat.
I like White Hair.
I like Armor Spikes.

[Chyrone]

Scott Wilhelm wrote:

So, this ghost is wearing an Amulet of Natural Armor or Mighty Fists with Ghost Touch? Or is wearing Ghost Touch Armor?

Not quite, it's made of ectoplasm. Hence able to hold material thing.

Also, those are some interesting items, indeed. :)

[Artofregicide]

Chyrone wrote:

Barb is a pass, undead don't have Con scores.

That's been errated, undead barbarians get a bonus to their CHA. I've created a graveknight Barbarian who is absolutely terrifying...

[Chyrone]

*blink*,

Wait what?

Hmm....that opens up reviewing barb again.

[EldonGuyre]

Artofregicide wrote:

Chyrone wrote:

Barb is a pass, undead don't have Con scores.

That's been errated, undead barbarians get a bonus to their CHA. I've created a graveknight Barbarian who is absolutely terrifying...

Fascinating possibilities...undead Skald, maybe?

Edit: LOL! Skalds already get theirs based on Cha. NVM.

[Chyrone]

Further question that pops up,

I know the White haired witch doesn't get grappled when doing so with her hair, as stated on her page.
The strangler brawler doesn't get the penalties from lvl 2 onwards, the tetori doesn't suffer penalties from lvl 4 onwards.

What ways are there to avoid my grappler from getting the grappled condition's penalties?

Thanks in advance. :)

[Scott Wilhelm]

I gave you my best suggestion for that with White Haired Witch.

With Grab, you can Grapple someone without taking the Grappled Condition yourself, but you take a -20 on your check.

If you can Grapple and Tie Up your opponent in 1 Round, you don't have the Grappled Condition.

The Web Spell, Strangling Hair, and Black Tentacles all Grapple opponents without Grappling the Caster.