Wings and Armor

[metatheurgist]

So what's the ruling on Wings and other external appendages and armor?

I think the rule is armor reduces fly speed but what about environmental protection?

In a standard fantasy the convention is that armor has wing holes and everything else just works but armor isn't just armor in Scifi. It's also the thing keeping vacuum, radiation, heat and other nasty effects off your character.

It'd be fair to say everything still works normally with a tail or an extra arm but wings are a bit different. Maybe with something like Second Skin I could buy that a winged character just functions normally but what about everything else? Hard to imagine Golom armor encompassing a PC's wings and everything just working.

I know what I'd rule but are there official interpretations?

[Wingblaze]

If armor can deal with having four arms, I can't see why it can't deal with wings. I don't remember seeing anything about armor reducing fly speed aside from the speed adjustment which impacts all movement types. Where are you seeing that rule?

I feel like you may be looking for problems that don't exist?

From CRB p. 196

ARMOR SIZE
Armor comes in different sizes for different creatures, and you might have to adjust a suit of armor to fit you if it wasn’t made for your race. A ysoki can’t effectively wear armor made for a human, and a kasatha needs to adjust armor that was made for a two-armed creature. If it’s in doubt whether a creature can fit the suit, the GM decides whether the armor needs to be adjusted. When you buy armor new, the purchase price includes any adjustments.

Adjusting Armor
If you get secondhand armor that wasn’t tailored for you, you can have it adjusted, which requires a successful Engineering check (DC = 10 + 2 × the armor’s level). Alternatively, you can spend 10% of the armor’s purchase price to have it adjusted by a professional—typically an armorsmith or anyone with multiple ranks in Engineering.

[Claxon]

I been working under the premise that since there's all kinds of weird anatomy out there, and they don't get called out as costing more, that having wings is kind of lumped in and work just fine without any extra cost to the armor.

Now, armor does reduce movement speed, regardless of whether it's burrow, fly, reglar ground, etc.

But wings have no effect on environmental protections in armor.

There are rules for re-purposing armor found on someone else that is of a different size category or race than you. But that's about it. And that's free if you have the ranks in engineering to do so (which it's very likely that someone in the party will have the ability to do so).

[whew]

Several of the armor descriptions mention force fields. Since there are no rules for environmental seals failing when armor gets hit, all of the armors must already have force fields or something to keep them airtight when they get punctured in combat. Those force fields can also protect the wings.

[Ascalaphus]

Yeah I think the underlying idea is "we want to have a cantina full of weird aliens". As a consequence, they've made the rules for odd size/shape equipment much milder than they are in Pathfinder.

[HammerJack]

I figure if armor can be modified to accommodate a barathu changing the length of its limbs, wings are no big challenge.

[metatheurgist]

There's a massive difference in function between extra limbs (which I pointed out I was fine with in my OP) and Wings which require a drastic range of rigorous motion and need to retain their shape and surface area for aerodynamics to work properly.

Seems the answer is there is no official interpretation.

[Claxon]

metatheurgist wrote:

There's a massive difference in function between extra limbs (which I pointed out I was fine with in my OP) and Wings which require a drastic range of rigorous motion and need to retain their shape and surface area for aerodynamics to work properly.

Seems the answer is there is no official interpretation.

There isn't a massive difference, not according to the rules. The rules don't treat things differently. Just because there is a lack of rules to say they're different and you don't like it doesn't mean that there is "no official interpretation". It means they didn't want to make rules to make it different.

Considering you can be an Astrazoan with the ability to change shape into any other medium creature, and there's no special mention here. Despite having a wide variety of body shapes you could change into.

You're trying to make up rules and restrictions that the designers didn't want to be there.

[Pantshandshake]

Starfinder basically runs on the "Everyone's got different body types, and that's OK" plan. All the weapons work regardless of what you call 'hands.' All the armor fits regardless of how many segments you have, or if instead of legs you roll around on ball shaped biological tires.

Got wings? No problem.

[Garretmander]

metatheurgist wrote:

There's a massive difference in function between extra limbs (which I pointed out I was fine with in my OP) and Wings which require a drastic range of rigorous motion and need to retain their shape and surface area for aerodynamics to work properly.

Seems the answer is there is no official interpretation.

The official interpretation is, that if you try to wear armor made for a race without wings you:

Adjusting Armor wrote:

can have it adjusted, which requires a successful Engineering check (DC = 10 + 2 × the armor’s level). Alternatively, you can spend 10% of the armor’s purchase price to have it adjusted by a professional—typically an armorsmith or anyone with multiple ranks in Engineering.

That IS the official interpretation.

[metatheurgist]

Claxon wrote:

You're trying to make up rules and restrictions that the designers didn't want to be there.

Yeah, the primary rule of any RPG is the rules are a guideline. If as GM I find that ridiculous I am free to interpret it as I see fit, especially in the absence of any clarification.

I'd have the same problem with shapeshifters. It's clearly covered in fantasy rules - all equipment is subsumed by the new form and non-functional. Nice and clear.

[Ravingdork]

You're welcome to house rule, just be sure to discuss it with your players well in advance. Saves on the heartache later.

Manufacturers in Starfinder go out of their way to make things rather universal. If they didn't they would go out of business against those competitors who did.

Xenophobia just isn't a good business model in such a large and varied universe.

[BigNorseWolf]

Re fitting armor you got off a shobad to fit on a ysoki is easier than hot wiring a car. Just fire up your angle grinder , put a few metal pieces out along your wing bones and program the force field to cover the leather.

Also, armored dragon says rar

[WatersLethe]

Official Rules: This works

metatheurgist: Seems like there's no official interpretation

[metatheurgist]

BigNorseWolf wrote:

Also, armored dragon says rar

Yeah, I totally see the lack of armor covering the wings. ;)

[BigNorseWolf]

metatheurgist wrote:

BigNorseWolf wrote:

Also, armored dragon says rar

Yeah, I totally see the lack of armor covering the wings. ;)

Do you see the force fields?

[Ravingdork]

What I see are bullet holes; indicative of the lsck of force fields on the wings.

[Pantshandshake]

That's just your brain trying to process an image Mankind wasn't meant to see. BNW played a good trick, I'm thankful only some of us went violently homicidal because of it.

[Garretmander]

Judging by the amount covered by that armor, I'm assuming that dragon is female.

[Xenocrat]

Ravingdork wrote:

What I see are bullet holes; indicative of the lsck of force fields on the wings.

That's just indicative of accurate fire that avoided deflection by the force fields.

[BigNorseWolf]

Garretmander wrote:

Judging by the amount covered by that armor, I'm assuming that dragon is female.

wipes coffee off of screen in no small part because he's right