| Edge93 |
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As per the title, I'm looking to make an altered version of the Cleric's channel energy, one that offers more options but is changed to be more in line with school slots and bloodline spell slots than being several top-level spells per day.
A preemptive note, this is being designed to be used with a houserule of mine that spells whose purpose is solely to counteract a specific thing (Such as Remove Paralysis and Remove Fear) make their counteract attempts with a counteract level 1 higher than the spell level. However this houserule is not required for this channel system.
Channel Energy:
Clerics are powerful divine agents, capable of channeling divine power to bring healing or harm to their allies or enemies, depending on their divine source.
Each Cleric gains the ability to channel positive or negative energy, determined by their deity (some deities provide a choice between the two, this choice must be made at 1st level and can only be changed by retraining). This grants the Cleric one extra spell slot of every level of spell he can cast. However, instead of preparing a spell in this slot as with his other slots this slot is used to spontaneously cast spells from a select list, depending on which type of energy the Cleric channels.
The Cleric may cast a spell of a lower level using a higher level channeling spell slot, in which case the spell is heightened to the level of the slot used to cast it.
The spells the Cleric can use with their channel energy slots are as follows:
(Note here, some of the spells here will have a ? after them, these are ones I was unsure if it would work out well to put in. The others I am fairly sure of my choices on, but these are on the fence. Most or all of these spells will have a quick note on why I quastion them and/or why I am considering them.)
(Also note, this does provide access to some Uncommon spells. This is not unheard of for a class feature as some bloodlines provide access to one or more uncommon spells but it still should be noted as this is a bit more widely accessed within its class.)
Positive Channeling:
Level 0: Stabilize.
Level 1:Heal, Bless(?) (A buff rather than a cure, but a classic support spell).
Level 2: Calm Emotions, Remove Fear, Restoration, Restore Senses.
Level 3: Neutralize Poison, Remove Disease, Dispel Magic (?) (The reason this one is on for consideration is because there are a lot of debuffs that would only be removable by Restoration or Dispel Magic, but are too short in duration to use Restoration on. It feels proper for positive channeling to be able to take a shot at negating short term debuffs like this, but the issue is that Dispel also has a host of other uses that fall outside of my intentions for Channeling, which is why it's in question.).
Level 4: Remove Curse.
Level 5: Death Ward (?) (It's a buff rather than a cure, but one that suppresses a powerful debuff and does some very Cleric-y things), Breath of Life (?) (In question because it's a very strong option, but a fitting one, and I suppose it isn't likely to come up too often but always having a death-save as long as you have channel slots of level 5+ may be a bit much.).
Level 6: Raise Dead, True Seeing (?) (A buff, but one that is essentially a cure for illusions.), Stone to Flesh (?) (Only iffy because it is an auto-cure for its niche rather than any kind of counteract attempt.), Divine Inspiration (?) (Seems like a nice support option, but may lie outside of the intended use of Channel. If incorporated would also come with houserule that heightening increases the level of regained spell accordingly.).
Level 7: Regenerate.
Level 8: Moment of Renewal.
Level 9: Revival.
Negative Channeling:
(As may become readily apparent, a lot of spells here are picked as antitheses of spells on the positive list, or as things that cause effects that are counteracted by spells on positive channel's list. They aren't all mirror-picks, but many are. Just noting this.)
Level 0: Daze.
Level 1: Harm, Fear, Ray of Enfeeblement, Bane (?) (Incorporation depends on whether or not positive channel gets Bless, as it's intended as a counterpart spell.).
Level 2: Deafness, Ghoulish Cravings, Death Knell (?) (Seems fitting but I wonder if it's a bit early level to hand out a finisher move like this. But then again any Cleric can just prepare this, it's not even marked as Evil anymore, so maybe I'm just being paranoid.), Silence (?) (A nice debuff but it seems a bit out of place among some of the others.).
Level 3: Blindness, Crisis of Faith (?) (More of a damage spell than a debuff, but can potentially hamper divine casting which is fitting.), Dispel Magic (Similar deal to Dispel on Positive, this can nix buffs which seems negative channel-worthy, but hass a lot of options outside of that scope.).
Vampiric Touch (Certainly not a debuff, but negative channel-y as all heck.).
Level 4: Enervation, Outcast's Curse.
Level 5: Abyssal Plague.
Level 6: Spellwrack, Repulsion (?) (Seems like a Negative bringer-of-woe thing to do, but also seems out of place. Especially since a lot of what you want to do with negative channeling involves someone coming close enough to curse or debuff or what have you.).
Level 7: Leng's Sting, Finger of Death (?) (Fittingly Negative, and an antithesis of sorts to revival magic, but also more of a direct attack than almost anything on here, and I'm not sure about anything beyond Harm that's more of just a direct attack than a debuff or an affliction.).
Level 8: Spiritual Epidemic. (Antimagic Field was on here as an iffy spell as it's like the ultimate hampering spell but also bones you, but then I realized just before tying it that it's Rare, so it can't rightly be granted by a class feature like this.)
Level 9: Wail of the Banshee, Bind Soul (?) (VERY negative-y, but also kinda useless as a debuff, it's really just a posthumous Screw You.)
And lastly one other thing for consideration. I like the idea of bringing in some spells from other lists for negative channeling, mostly spells that cause poisons, diseases, or curses. This would give Negative channel decidedly more spell options than Positive channel, but this makes sense as there is kind of only one way to nix a poison, disease, or curse, but there really should be more than one way to cause such. The divine list has only 1 poison spell and it's level 7. There are 2 diseases and 3 curses which is decent, but more would be nice IMO. So what follows is a list of spells from other lists I am considering adding to negative channeling. Some of these spells may have less merit than ones previously listed, as this is a lot more of a maybe list than a seriously considered one. For this spot I figured it was better to list more ideas even if they're bad than to hold in reserve ideas that may have been good. I also won't be listing reasons for all of them because it's late, I'm tired, and I don't have time for that. XD
Though I will put an asterisk by any options I consider as particularly worthwhile candidates.
Level 1: Goblin Pox*, Spider Sting*, Phantom Pain.
Level 2: Sound Burst, Touch of Idiocy*.
Level 3: Paralyze*.
Level 4: Confusion, Phantasmal Killer.
Level 5: Mariner's Curse*.
Level 6: Flesh to Stone*, Purple Worm Sting*, Feeblemind*, Synthesia.
Level 7: Mask of Terror*, Warp Mind.
Level 8: Polar Ray.
Level 9: Unfathomable Song*, Weird.
Alright, if you made it this far then thank you so much for looking over all of this! I am looking for feedback on any aspect of this idea, but in particular the merits or demerits of the spell choices, especially the ones I put into question as well as the cross-class spell potential.
Oh, and one last bit, this system decouples Channel from Cha and IDK how big of a deal that is for people. But I was considering making it so having a Cha score of 16 or higher gives you an extra channel slot of your highest level (Or second highest with level 1 minimum if highest would be too much). This seems reasonable as it can be gotten out of the gate with focus or at mid levels fairly casually, and it keeps a connection to Cha but by not having an effect that increases directly with modifier you aren't pressured to super-pump Cha to get more.
Thanks again in advance for the feedback!
| Ediwir |
Sounds like an expansion of my own version, which I’m using in my 2e campaign.
For me, I had the list only include spells with the Positive/Healing trait or the Negative/Curse trait, and then gave my Cleric player a few optional feats that expanded that list depending on where he wanted to bring his character concept (for example, Domain Channeling [earth] gives him the option to add a few spells such as Stone to Flesh to the options, and access to Stone Tell as a regular spell, and Inquisitor would allow him to channel a few divinations and get access to Discern Lies).
My ‘cha is relevant’ bit was to use Cha as requirement for the higher channel feats. Not sure if that’s something you want to look at.
| Mathmuse |
This sounds very similar to the spontaneous casting of the Cure spells granted to clerics in Dungeons & Dragons 3rd Edition. They could expend any prepared spell slot in order to cast the Cure spell of that level instead. The extra variety in Edge93's version adds more flavor.
Edge93 gives the cleric one more spell of each level in order to compensate for the loss of channeling. That means that a Cha 14 cleric would lose two channeled 1st-level Heals in exchange for a 1st-level slot that could be used for anything and could be spontaneously converted to Heal. As the cleric levels up, he gains more additional spell slots while still just losing the two channelings, which would have been at his highest casting level. That seems balanced.
I played an elf archer cleric from 1st to 13th level in D&D 3.5, and a few other clerics for shorter campaigns. Half of the cleric's spell slots would be converted to healing, and I usually prepared specialized spells, such as condition removal, in the slots that I expected to use for healing. At 1st through 3rd level, the cleric used almost all his spell slots for heaiing. I made him an archer to give him something to do during combat, and I made him an elf to give him proficiency in longbow. At 4th level, he cast Summon Monster II during combat, because summoning a few animals to aid in combat prevented more damage than those spells would have healed.
The spontaneous casting of Cure spells also caused the PCs to walk around slightly damaged because the clerics spells were too valuable to be used for healing when the PC had 80% or more of their hit points. At bedtime, when the day's adventuring was over, the cleric used up all his spells in healing to top off the party for the next day. This made the cleric mostly useless during nighttime attacks on the camp.
Paizo introduced channeling in Pathfinder 1st Edition. I think its purpose was to allow the cleric to do something in combat with his spells because the channeling would handle the post-combat healing. That did reduce the pressure to have the cleric save all his spells for healing, which as known as the healbot role. In Pathfinder 2nd Edition, the cleric has full BAB, so serving as a frontline combatant without self-buffing is more feasible. But do we want the cleric to revert to the D&D 3.5 role of a 2nd-rate fighter who also heals?
| Edge93 |
A small note here, the extra slot each level was not intended to be a slot with a regular spell prepared that could be spontaneously converted, but rather a blank spontaneous slot that could be used only to cast from the channel list (Essentially a spontaneous caster's slot on a prepared caster). I was trying to stray away from spontaneous conversion as it feels like PF2 has purposefully stayed away from that concept. Admittedly this does decrease the versatility of the ability slightly but the idea was to ensure that you aren't having to choose between using a normal spell or healing the party (Well, for positive channelers. For negative channelers there is an entirely different dynamic).
But yeah, you pretty much have the right of it that I am trying to make it so that a positive channeler Cleric does not feel compelled to prepare healing and status removal spells because they think the party MIGHT need them badly, the classic "This spell is vital if we need it and a waste of space if we don't". The hope is that Clerics can use their prepared slots to explore the various other aspects of the Divine spell list more freely since they already have a resource allocated to healing and status removal that can be adapted to specific needs during the day.
I'm hoping it will be a boon to both fighter Clerics, caster Clerics, and anything in between.
| Ediwir |
Yes, it makes clerics into hybrid prepared/spontaneous casters, perfect for countering debuffs/statuses and calls down their healing potential to comparable levels (still higher than other classes but now just by a specialist’s amount).
I would suggest to integrate the feat mechanics and let the potential scale withhow much you invest ;) Cleric also badly needs a spell list update, but it’s garder to do so fia houserules.
| Edge93 |
I will have to consider putting feats to it as you suggest. Admittedly I was trying to avoid feat requirements as there are already a notable number of feats that augment channeling, but it may need to be done.
Maybe the questionable options on the channel list could come via feats while the rest are available automatically, or something like that. Definitely will need tweaking.