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Hey everyone,
I'm currently playing in a PFS campaign (with a fixed group of the same party members). We are are currently level 14, set to do a module (tomb of the iron medusa) soon and going into the all for immortality arc afterwards (at high tier, level 15). After that, there's been some talk of playing the characters further to level 20 with what I presume will be more module play, though that isn't entirely set yet. So, the character will reach at least level 15, possibly more. I expect the future modules to be upscaled in some way as to be significantly threatening; the same happened with our EoTT playthrough which featured mythic levels and other upscales to the final boss, the same of which happened (I presume) to the final boss of the season 9 final adventure.
The reason I'm asking for a bit of help is because as the tank/heavy melee dude, I am really feeling the rocket-tag starting to kick in. I'd like to not end with single digit hp before my first turn comes up, as happened in the above two instances and some others too. I also feel like the to hit bonusses of enemies are so high that even good ac doesn't seem to matter much anymore, which is why I'm looking for other layers of protection on top of just ac + lay on hands with sanctuary mercy (targeted).
I play an oath of vengeance paladin of Iomedae x/ urban anger bloodrager 1 atm. The other party members are a rogue/brawler sneak attacker/debuffer, a save or suck cleric and a control arcanist. We will supposedly be joined by a teleportation focussed unchained monk soonish as the final party member. Everyone else is an expert at what they do.
Adol, level 13 human oov paladin, urban anger bloodrager 1.
Stats: str 20, dex 12, con 16, int 10, 9 wis, 27 cha.
Base stats: 18,12,14,10,7,15. All level up increases were cha, uses +6 cha headband, +2 str/con belt, a +2 profane cha boon and a +1 cha inherent boon. +2 wis from socketed Ioun stone in wayfinder which gives blind-fight as a bonus feat.
Hp 155, Ac: 33 (when having the buckler out), touch 14, FF 32. Saves: Fort +30 (+2 profane boon), reflex +19, will +21.
Feats: feywild foundling, noble scion (cha to init), encouraging spell, extra rage, power attack, vision mastery, quick draw, improved critical (nodachi), blind fight (bonus feat from wayfinder), skill focus: survival (Bonus feat from anger Id rager).
-Standard prepared spells: 2 x divine favor, 3 x hero's defiance, shield other x 3, energy resistance x 1, good hope x 3, greater angelic aspect x2.
Divine bond: weapon bond (+3 bonus, 3x/day for 13 minutes per use).
Traits: dangerously curious, Wayang spell hunter (good hope metamagic cost -1. I tend to reflavor this to something like 'inspiring leader').
Relevant skills: Fly +12, diplomacy +25, perception +23/25 (normal/sight), UMD +27/29 (normal/scrolls).
Items: Crusading fullplate +3, quickdraw buckler +4, cloak of resistance +5, amulet of natural armor +2, ring of protection +2, ring of evasion, Helm of the mammoth lord, str/con belt +2, charisma headband +6, furious nodachi +2, eyes of the eagle, lesser rod of reach, wayfinder wirth icandescent blue Ioun stone, bracers of the merciful knight. Aside from this a number of utility scrolls, most used are scroll of heal, displacement and dimension door.
Currently left with roughly 5500 gold. I am considering buying a pair of gloves of arrow-catching for 4 k.
The idea of the build is to buff the party with encouraging good hope (As an Iomedae paladin, this is a level 3 spell added to my list. I use the encouraging metamagic feat/-1 metamagic cost trait to boost it to +3 effectiveness for no added level cost. With no bard, only I have natural access to this.) and to use the metamagic rod of reach to have a reached shield other on all other party members at the same time. Then, I move adjacent to enemies and use LoH on myself after attacking each turn. This leaves the targeted mercy's sanctuary effect on myself during the enemy turn, which is a DC 24 willsave due to the high charisma. In order for the enemy melee to get full attacks, they have to then try making that save to attack me. Otherwise, they either have pounce someone else (their best case, which would still redicrect half the damage to me) or need to walk to an ally and get only 1 attack.
Regarding the threat of AOE attacks, both the rogue and I have evasion and a very high dex save. Also, both the cleric and the wizard are focussed on counterspelling and dispelling. This has allowed the shield other strategy to work flawlessly so far.
I also draw the quickdraw shield as a free action at the end of the turn after attacking with the nodachi. This means I do not threaten enemies other than with the headbut from my helm or spiked gauntlet outside of my own turn, but the idea is to put the sanctuary to good use so I'm not currently looking to make AoO's yet.
While the strategy above works fairly well, there are a number of things that more or less still instantly kill me and that I need some help with. From actual play these are:
-Mythic bosses winning initiative and wrecking me with huge to hit bonusses before my turn comes up (yeah, I know. Good luck fixing that, right?). Or just high accuracy + high willsave enemies.
-Touch attacks in general, but specifically:
-Level draining touch attacks by incorporal enemies.
-Ranged touch attacks, such as musket fire or disintegrate and enervation spam.
I am currently considering training out the feats improved critical (nodachi) and vision mastery upon reaching 15, selling the nodachi and buying a keen inheritor's longsword. Then, branching into weapon master fighter for 3 levels. Upon reaching level 15, this would free up 4 feats for martial focus, combat reflexes, slash from the air and smash from the sky. These feats would allow me to make 2+ (depending on dex buffs if any) AOO's each round against incoming spells or projectiles to counter that weakness, at least. I was then considering adding a level of swashbuckler for parry to fix melee touch attacks and just sticking with 9 panache for the day without an option to regain it naturally. Finally, with the last feats I would receive I was thinking about selecting the orc bloodline feats so I'd have greater eldritch heritage at level 17 and a large inherent bonus to strength. The level 17 ability to grow to large and get huge str/con/natural armor bonusses of that seems like it would help, and would free up the shoulder slot for a cloak of displacement maybe.
Does anyone have any advice or critique on this build and/or plan going forward? Anything would be greatly appreciated.
You could try a 1 level dip in Scaled Fist Monk (Unchained to keep up full BAB).
Gets you CHA to AC if not wearing armour. Take Dodge as your bonus feat and Crane Style as your regular feat. Your AC bonus would go down, but your touch AC would go up (+8 from CHA, +1 from dodge) and it gives you the option to fight defensively at -2 attack for another +4* AC.
This raises your Touch AC by 13 in total, and ends with your regular AC almost in tact, but at a slight offensive penalty. Obviously you'd have to lose your armour, which would make you slightly more vulnerable to enemies winning initiative (the CHA to AC works flat-footed, but Dodge & Crane Style obviously wouldn't).
*To get +4AC when using Crane Style you also need to put 3 ranks in Acrobatics.
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You could try a 1 level dip in Scaled Fist Monk (Unchained to keep up full BAB).
Gets you CHA to AC if not wearing armour. Take Dodge as your bonus feat and Crane Style as your regular feat. Your AC bonus would go down, but your touch AC would go up (+8 from CHA, +1 from dodge) and it gives you the option to fight defensively at -2 attack for another +4* AC.
This raises your Touch AC by 13 in total, and ends with your regular AC almost in tact, but at a slight offensive penalty. Obviously you'd have to lose your armour, which would make you slightly more vulnerable to enemies winning initiative (the CHA to AC works flat-footed, but Dodge & Crane Style obviously wouldn't).
*To get +4AC when using Crane Style you also need to put 3 ranks in Acrobatics.
That's a pretty good idea. But wouldn't it conflict with the rule that no stat bonus can be applied to the same stat twice? In the case of charisma, If I were to go scaled fist monk, would that mean I'd no longer gain an armor bonus from smite evil since I already have charisma to AC?
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The monk AC bonus is untyped, the smite gives a deflection bonus. They will stack.
That's a pretty good idea. But wouldn't it conflict with the rule that no stat bonus can be applied to the same stat twice? In the case of charisma, If I were to go scaled fist monk, would that mean I'd no longer gain an armor bonus from smite evil since I already have charisma to AC?
The monk AC bonus is untyped, the smite gives a deflection bonus. They will stack.
Even if this doesn't work you can take the dip & feats and keep all your armour. You wouldn't get the CHA bonus to AC bud Dodge + Crane Style would still net you +5 to your touch/regular AC. If you're worried about getting caught in the surprise round you could go Sohei so you always act in the surprise round and can hopefully get some kind of buff off before they target you. It's not as good for the touch AC that you wanted but I'm not sure a 1 level dip in anything else will help much more ...
Actually if you're really keen you could get a +4 INT belt before you level up and take UNSANCTIONED KNOWLEDGE. There are a lot of options there, but I'm not sure it helps if you're surprised.
(High will-save enemies? I don't get it. Are you casting saving-throw magic as a paladin?)From actual play these are:
-Mythic bosses winning initiative and wrecking me with huge to hit bonusses before my turn comes up (yeah, I know. Good luck fixing that, right?). Or just high accuracy + high willsave enemies.
-Touch attacks in general, but specifically:
-Level draining touch attacks by incorporal enemies.
The problem, as I see it, is that the PC is massively invested in a 5' weapon and possesses low dexterity (and the non-mithral fullplate armor that goes with it, despite gaining a nice dex bump from urban bloodrager --but as far as I can tell that is 100% truly and utterly wasted: he doesn't get the bump to INIT because he's not raging before his first turn in the encounter, doesn't get the AC because his armor is already "full", doesn't get extra AoOs without Combat Reflexes, and isn't using the stat for attack rolls with Weapon Finesse...although there's the occasional archery shot, I suppose, as well as not being any worse AC while raging as per normal anger-management issues). This results in continually being flat-footed and eating full-attacks without the ability to take AoOs with a reach-weapon and/or while enlarged.
Taking a second level of Bloodrager would at least give you Uncanny Dodge so you won't be flatfooted...which unfortunately only saves you one point of AC in the surprise round in this build. Taking a level of fighter (or spending a feat on Tower Shield proficiency) would at least you blow some in-bound, but I get the impression that flat-footedness is what's nailing you.
-- The higher you go, the more important dexterity gets for martials. The happy days of 3rd edition dwarves stomping around in stone-plate without a care in the world have been over for quite some time. Speaking on which:
-Ranged touch attacks, such as musket fire or disintegrate and enervation spam.
Off-topic rant time: This is why I detest gunslingers (and I'm far from alone, as they're probably the most despised class in the game at a conceptual level), and think they have no place in fantasy RPGs. Aside from wrecking medieval verisimilitude, their mere existence in the game makes the second-most expensive piece of equipment that most characters buy completely worthless, as firearms are the only effects --aside from +4 Brilliant Energy weapons--capable of full-attacking while ignoring armor bonuses. The moment they became PFS-legal many years ago, I retired all of my fullpate non-fighter(w/Armor-Training) builds, because I knew it was just a matter of time before I was blown away or turned in a walking bag of frag-my-life. Giving 1st-level characters the equivalent of ranged lightsabers was the worst mistake that Paizo ever made with 1e. Because someday they'll be CR 17 opponents with umpitty-ump attacks. Yoy! I'm a marilith; only reason I'm not firing six guns (no, not six-guns, *six* guns) is the module-author told me not to! </rant>
You CAN retrain ability score bumps (unfortunately you can't retrain the starting statistics). For most raging martials hitting on anything but a 2 at this level, it's easy enough to retrain some spots worth of strength into dex, and chuck to fullpate for mithral BP -- but you're a paladin making charisma do quadruple duty, and it's a dream-crusher to haul back any of that.
Secondary problem: You are a front-liner shock-troop martial, and should not be frittering actions buffing the party if you can at all help it -- the party should be buffing you. If the party wants to be buffed by you, they can stand in your auras.
Retrain out of Oath of Vengeance, and get that biggest boatload of swag in the game known as Aura of Justice! "...At 11th level, a paladin can expend two uses of her smite evil ability to grant the ability to smite evil to all allies within 10 feet, using her bonuses. Allies must use this smite evil ability by the start of the paladin’s next turn and the bonuses last for 1 minute. Using this ability is a free action...." -- Why, hello there, sweet action-economy! Where have thee been all my life?
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Silver-lining: if you're always failing initiative anyway, you might as well retrain Noble Scion to something that actually helps you dish it out faster. Like Deadly Aim, or ?
I am currently considering training out the feats improved critical (nodachi) and vision mastery upon reaching 15, selling the nodachi and buying a keen inheritor's longsword. Then, branching into weapon master fighter for 3 levels. Upon reaching level 15, this would free up 4 feats for martial focus, combat reflexes, slash from the air and smash from the sky.
"Named" magic items (that inheritor's sword) cannot be upgraded in PFS. (What you want is an ordinary adamantine keen weapon to smash through DR and resist breakage. And see more boldface below.)
Feats: Find something (Encouraging Spell or Vision Mastery) to dump, and snarf Greater Mercy. --If a combat lasts N rounds, there's no reason to being forfeiting Nd6 free healing off LoH during it, and [(LoH uses)-N]d6 additional OoC self-healing per day. That stuff really racks up. (Any feat that saves you the cost of Raise Dead + 2 Restorations in PFS is worth more than its weight in gold.) At 14th level, your allies are at the point they can afford cracking open potions of good hope like soda-pop; they don't need you for that.
Skills: "...perception +23/25 (normal/sight)..."[/i] --You are a paladin, not a Skill Mastery or ranks+levels/etc type class or a wizard with a hawk familiar. Despite a superficially good score, you have little to no chance to see anything pimpin' Stealth to the nines. Retrain that junk to a flat zero and move every point into something actually viable at 14th level, like Intimidate, and then check out the Enforcer feat and Merciful weapon enhancement (or the cost of an ordinary sap popped out fast with Quick Draw). If you're find yourself going late in surprise rounds, you don't need Perception anyway. --If your buddies saw the thing before you, they told you about it on their turn; if they didn't (with bonuses running +5 to +15 higher than your wis-dumped/no-class-skill paladin), you're not going to either. Likewise, if the enemy ran up and smacked you before you pull your thumb out. --Your grabbing Blind Fight via ioun is already a concession that you're not perceiving things.
If you are playing in a mythic campaign than you have access to mythic smite, which gives you the ability to use a mythic point to regain smite evil. This should usually give you enough smite evil that you don’t need Oath of Vengeance. Retraining this into an Oath against Undeath would take care of the incorporeal touch attacks. If you end up going the sword and board route you will have no problem with incorporeal undead.
Getting spell dodging armor would take care of most of the other touch attacks except the guns.
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Hey everyone, thanks for all the suggestions!
Giving up armor and shield hurts a lot, and touch AC is probably still not going to be good enough to help.. Consider a ring of blinking. Snake style can also help dodge one touch each turn. If you are getting targeted with more than 2 or 3 energy drains a turn, there’s not a lot of options.
Ring of blinking might be a good idea, i'll add it to the list of possible solutions. Snake style requires making sense motive checks, which I currently suck at. I don't think that will work for this reason.
Actually if you're really keen you could get a +4 INT belt before you level up and take UNSANCTIONED KNOWLEDGE. There are a lot of options there, but I'm not sure it helps if you're surprised.
I know of the feat, but considering I have a +6 charisma headband, adding +4 (6) int to this will be extremely expensive (54000 gold). For that price, I could simply buy a cloak of displacement to have it more or less always on. That asside, mirror image and displacement as prepared spells would be nice, but the level is at a point where true sight or alternative senses to sight start becoming common to enemies (from my limited experience and what I've been told). Also, I am short on both spellslots and feats.
I played a tank-ish alchemist up to 20 in PFS, you are correct that its basically modules/adventure paths in the upper teens. I would strongly recommend that you look into a Ring of Inner Fortitude. One (of the two) times my alchemist died post level 14 was due to taking 2d6+ Con Drain per round from touch attacks, no save, while the creature used flyby attack to stay within a wall. And triggering Harm and Slay Living spells from the same attacks. After that fight I started prepping Delayed Consumption->Restoration extracts every adventure.
Noted, I'll start saving up for one. I can probably miss the ring of protection considering I have both greater angelic aspect and smite evil, and a cleric who could cast shield of faith.
If you are playing in a mythic campaign than you have access to mythic smite, which gives you the ability to use a mythic point to regain smite evil. This should usually give you enough smite evil that you don’t need Oath of Vengeance. Retraining this into an Oath against Undeath would take care of the incorporeal touch attacks. If you end up going the sword and board route you will have no problem with incorporeal undead.Getting spell dodging armor would take care of most of the other touch attacks except the guns.
I'm not playing in a mythic campaign. It's just that the endbosses of the modules seem to regularly get mythic levels added to them (this happened to the endboss of eyes of the Ten and the endboss of unleashing the untouchable, the season 9 final module. AFAIK at least the last one is not homebrew.) So the BBEG's have access to mythic stuff while I don't.
Spell dodging armor is nice, I'll add that to the list of things to get.
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I don't get it. Are you casting saving-throw magic as a paladin?)
> To this, I'd ask if you read the tactics spoiler in the main post. But to elaborate, I am using the mercy that gives a target a scaling sanctuary effect, after I'm finished attacking (the targeted mercy). of course, if I know the target is evil and I can full attack it, I will instead smite evil + full attack. But this is not always the case.
The idea is, again, to protect the rest of the party. I do this with shield other on all other party members and placing myself next to the enemy with the sanctuary mercy and other defensive buffs I might have. this effectively puts the enemy in a catch-22 scenario. They either try to full attack me and need to make the save and hit the paladin tank, or ignore me, walk away, only get one attack on an ally of which half damage is done to me. Other ways to protect the party is using oath of vengances 'ONE' SE cost level 11 feature to give them +8 deflection bonusses to ac and another one is boosting everyons's saves by +3 with good hope, along with all their other offensive stats.
"The problem, as I see it, is that the PC is massively invested in a 5' weapon and possesses low dexterity (and the non-mithral fullplate armor that goes with it, despite gaining a nice dex bump from urban bloodrager --but as far as I can tell that is 100% truly and utterly wasted: he doesn't get the bump to INIT because he's not raging before his first turn in the encounter, doesn't get the AC because his armor is already "full", doesn't get extra AoOs without Combat Reflexes, and isn't using the stat for attack rolls with Weapon Finesse...although there's the occasional archery shot, I suppose, as well as not being any worse AC while raging as per normal anger-management issues). This results in continually being flat-footed and eating full-attacks without the ability to take AoOs with a reach-weapon and/or while enlarged."
> Ok, there is a lot here. First, not having mythril armor is a leftover from levelling this character, my first PF character, up during PFS. Back then, I was a noob and didn't know of the existence of Urban Bloodrager (or that it stacked with Id Rager). I retrained into this to avoid the -2AC penalty from a normal rage and since the con save bonus from normal rage was extremely superfluous. However, since no spell or ability exists to fix the armor to mythril this I am simply out of luck here. Maybe I could ask if the group agrees with me buying 9 k worth of mythril and asking the wizard to limited wish the steel from the fullplate into the mythril.
I agree that the extra point of dex currently doesn't get me anything else other than +1 reflex and +1CMD. However, that is also why I explicitely stated that my current Idea for the next level is to train into the combat reflexes/martial focus/slash from the air/smash from the sky combo. This would allow me to deflect at least 3 spells or ranged attacks each round. Regarding your other points, yeah, it would be nice to be large. So that's also why I stated I was planning on going for the orc bloodline after this which acquires large form and reach at level 17. So... I guess these are good points but I can't fix those/already knew that/suggested more or less the same things in my initial post.
"I hate gunslingers since ranged touch attacks at will are OP and they break immersion."
> I agree more with the second part than the first. Though, having been on the receiving end of chain musket fire it does feel a bit unfair, so I understand why you feel that way.
"Secondary problem: You are a front-liner shock-troop martial, and should not be frittering actions buffing the party if you can at all
help it -- the party should be buffing you. If the party wants to be buffed by you, they can stand in your auras."
> Except that good hope can be extended by a cheap rod and is really easy to cast pre-combat, especially if there is a rogue with stealth +70 and permanent invisibility out there who can do part of the scouting. And then still, the encouraging version adds +1 over potions which is a huge deal when applied to almost everythign everyone does.
"Retrain out of Oath of Vengeance, and get that biggest boatload of swag in the game known as Aura of Justice! "...At 11th level, a paladin can expend two uses of her smite evil ability to grant the ability to smite evil to all allies within 10 feet, using her bonuses. Allies must use this smite evil ability by the start of the paladin’s next turn and the bonuses last for 1 minute. Using this ability is a free action...." -- Why, hello there, sweet action-economy! Where have thee been all my life?"
> Oath of vengeance's version costs only 1 use of smite evil and is thus a lot more spammable than the normal one. It is true that the normal one is better, but a +8 deflection bonus and to hit bonus against a target is good enough on its own IMO. Especially when it allows me to retain the ability to get out more smites when needed.
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"Silver-lining: if you're always failing initiative anyway, you might as well retrain Noble Scion to something that actually helps you dish it out faster. Like Deadly Aim, or ?"
>: I am not always failing initiative. I am usually fairly high on the order. And going sooner is always useful as it gives you more actions per combat before it ends.
""Named" magic items (that inheritor's sword) cannot be upgraded in PFS. (What you want is an ordinary adamantine keen weapon to smash through DR and resist breakage. And see more boldface below.)"
> Ok, that is good to know, thanks.
"Feats: Find something (Encouraging Spell or Vision Mastery) to dump, and snarf Greater Mercy. --If a combat lasts N rounds, there's no reason to being forfeiting Nd6 free healing off LoH during it, and [(LoH uses)-N]d6 additional OoC self-healing per day."
> I'm sorry, but I could not disagree harder here. A free DC 24 (actually, 10 +half level + cha) sanctuary on LoH as a mercy is much, MUCH more valuable than 5,5 hp extra healing. There's also the added utility of using it on a party member to give them the sanctuary shield, for instance if they are being grapped by a dinosaur and about to be eaten. poof: dinosaur needs nat 20 willsave to swallow/rake/do anything else. This thing has saved my life even in extremnely brutal encounters such as the one in 'King of the Storval Stairs', if you played that adventure.
> I like the idea of intimidate-focus and using merciful weapon/enforcer. However, all three of my skills have been vital to the party and I don't think I could train that away easily. Also, given how feat starved we are I don't think I can spare the feat. And given how many other userful things we could buy I think the gold is better spent elsewhere, even thoug shaken would have some synergy with the cleric. He plays a fear spam channel build that tends to solo encounters that can be feared.
Maybe I could ask if the group agrees with me buying 9 k worth of mythril and asking the wizard to limited wish the steel from the fullplate into the mythrilThere are no "permanent" spells (i.e., effects that carries over from one session to the next) in PFS, so, unfortunately, you wouldn't be able to morph your armor like that even though it'd be perfectly reasonable in a home-game.
The feat Greater Mercy does not prevent your LoH "Targeted" Mercy's Sanctuary effect from working, and there's no reason you can't LoH twice in the same round due to the way it works: once on yourself as a swift, and once on your dino-chow ally (assuming you can touch them without eating AoOs from Mr. T-Rex).Feats: Find something (Encouraging Spell or Vision Mastery) to dump, and snarf Greater Mercy. --If a combat lasts N rounds, there's no reason to being forfeiting Nd6 free healing off LoH during it, and [(LoH uses)-N]d6 additional OoC self-healing per day."> I'm sorry, but I could not disagree harder here. A free DC 24 (actually, 10 +half level + cha) sanctuary on LoH as a mercy is much, MUCH more valuable than 5,5 hp extra healing. There's also the added utility of using it on a party member to give them the sanctuary shield, for instance if they are being grapped by a dinosaur and about to be eaten.
Hold the thought....Retrain out of Oath of Vengeance, and get that biggest boatload of swag in the game known as Aura of Justice! "...At 11th level, a paladin can expend two uses of her smite evil ability to grant the ability to smite evil to all allies within 10 feet, using her bonuses. Allies must use this smite evil ability by the start of the paladin’s next turn and the bonuses last for 1 minute. Using this ability is a free action...." -- Why, hello there, sweet action-economy! Where have thee been all my life?"> Oath of vengeance's version costs only 1 use of smite evil and is thus a lot more spammable than the normal one. It is true that the normal one is better, but a +8 deflection bonus and to hit bonus against a target is good enough on its own IMO. Especially when it allows me to retain the ability to get out more smites when needed.
"...Powerful Justice (Su)
At 11th level, an oathbound paladin may spends one use of her smite evil ability to grant her allies within 10 feet the ability to smite evil, except they only gain the paladin’s bonus to damage, not her smite’s attack bonus or ability to bypass DR......"
Your allies are NOT getting your bonus to hit from your OoV paladin's "Powerful" Justice smite. Meanwhile, the core paladin, although deploying Aura of Justice costs him an additional use, is not only granting the bonus to hit that you thought you were getting (but shouldn't have been), but also the ability to bypass DR (which almost everything in the nosebleed seats has). Core paladins are every archer's BFF.
But here's the worst part for OoVPs: Depending upon how RAW-strict your GM is, he may construe that Powerful Justice's conspicuously lacking of Aura of Justice's "Using this ability is a free action" phrasing means that it costs the OoV paladin a standard action to deploy his archetype's replacing Su ability. --Because Paizo archetype writers are neutral-evil, donchya know, and nerfing-in-the-fine-omitted-print is how they roll.
However, all three of my skills have been vital to the party and I don't think I could train that away easily. Also, given how feat starved we are I don't think I can spare the feat.<nod> I understand. Paladins are arguably the most feat-starved class in the game (especially if they have a mount), and you have to short-list like no one else. --I wouldn't take anything that isn't used multiple times per encounter.
Going from basically nothing in sense motive to +35 is a pretty cheap shopping trip at level 15. And d20 + 35 is generally adequate touch AC.Could you elaborate?
Lelomenia is referring to Snake Style, which is right dandy in a monk-dipper build, although its swift/immediate action-economy (the former to engage the style's "stance", the latter to actually use it) requirements will pour sand into a paladin's Smite & LoH gearing, and it'll ward off only one attack per round. (But if you do do it, Sense Motive is a cozy new home for those Perception points, no ioun necessary.)
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The feat Greater Mercy does not prevent your LoH "Targeted" Mercy's Sanctuary effect from working, and there's no reason you can't LoH twice in the same round due to the way it works: once on yourself as a swift, and once on your dino-chow ally (assuming you can touch them without eating AoOs from Mr. T-Rex).
> I guess I remembered the exact text incorrectly, though there's still the point of the fatigued mercy being able to remove fatigue at the end of our turn, which can save rounds of rage. Without the feat space for 2 x extra rage they need to be conserved.
On oath of vengeance, it is really strange the free action phrase is missing from the ability when the action is is directly replacing is designed around being a free action. It's always been accepted in the group I almost always play with as a free action, which consists of all really experienced players. I guess no one knew this. If it is a standard action then it will have to be retrained out of. Looking back on my notes, I seem to have always used the +cha deflection/+ paladin level to damage during actual play with the exception of the last session in Germany, so apologies German players since I seem to have cheated with +cha to hit during a seeker level adventure. I guess that is the drawback of high level play being so rare - you can forget things like this.
On the enforcer feat, it still has drawbacks. It requires a decent amount of gold invested from buying a +2 int stone for the skill ranks, then buying the merciful enchantment and training into the feat itself. Even if we do, there are a number of enemies immune to nonlethal damage or fear, or both. So while it might be used multiple times during an encounter, it doesn't have full reliability and is a significant investment.