Bad Touch Cleric


Classes

Scarab Sages

Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Help me out here and please clarify if I am missing something.

My 14th level cleric of Calistra can do 21d8 + 15 damage per round with Harm.

She has to hit 3 times with a melee touch attack, each casting of the spell being one action.

Since she is using the channel energy ability, the castings are all heightened to her highest spell level (7th), thus 7d8 per attack with +5 for her wisdom on each attack.

These attacks are against touch AC.

There is no iterative penalty, as Harm does not have the "Attack" trait and does not use the "Strike" action. Many spells reference these, but Harm does not, and melee touch attacks in the spell attack section (p197) does not reference this as having the "Attack" trait or "Strike" action.

And there is no save against the one-action Harm spell.

So with +5 (wisdom) +2 (spell mastery) +14 (proficiency) +2 (item - spell duelists gloves) = +23 to hit TAC, the hit is not guaranteed at this level, but each hit will do 7d8 + 5 damage and there is no iterative penalty to the attack.

Before my GM throws dice at me - what am I missing?

Designer

When you use it to make an attack, it would have the attack trait, though the spell (and also heal) doesn't default to that trait because you don't necessarily make an attack (see page 414 for the attack trait). So MAP would apply. Other than that, you can definitely do this. Or triple heal, which can usually get all but the beefiest barbarians from 0 to full.

Scarab Sages

Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

TY

I will tell my GM he should let me do it without the iterative unless he feels it is a combat event, in which I should be more stressed with each attack, and have the penalty.

I will still push for the alluring cleric of Calista convincing the targets of their need for pain long before the spell...but that is the game, not the rules.

Dark Archive

Mark,

So to clarify (since I'm the GM in question): the spell essentially gains the "Attack" trait under certain circumstances? i.e. In the case of "Heal" when you use the Somatic Casting action to make "melee touch attack to damage an undead target" (or the inverse for Harm)?

If so, I think the confusion comes from a more fundamental problem: it's not the "Attack" trait that triggers the MAP, it's the fact that you're making any form of a second attack. I think the suggestion at hand is that that could be made clearer, as it seems by the RAW only actions that explicitly have the "Attack" trait trigger a MAP and in this (above) example, the "Attack" trait seems to be lacking.


Sanctus Spinatus wrote:

Help me out here and please clarify if I am missing something.

My 14th level cleric of Calistra can do 21d8 + 15 damage per round with Harm.

She has to hit 3 times with a melee touch attack, each casting of the spell being one action.

Since she is using the channel energy ability, the castings are all heightened to her highest spell level (7th), thus 7d8 per attack with +5 for her wisdom on each attack.

These attacks are against touch AC.

There is no iterative penalty, as Harm does not have the "Attack" trait and does not use the "Strike" action. Many spells reference these, but Harm does not, and melee touch attacks in the spell attack section (p197) does not reference this as having the "Attack" trait or "Strike" action.

And there is no save against the one-action Harm spell.

So with +5 (wisdom) +2 (spell mastery) +14 (proficiency) +2 (item - spell duelists gloves) = +23 to hit TAC, the hit is not guaranteed at this level, but each hit will do 7d8 + 5 damage and there is no iterative penalty to the attack.

Before my GM throws dice at me - what am I missing?

Whya re you using your Wis for your attack roll?

Melee touch attacks are finesse strikes, so it should be either Str or Dex, not Wis.

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