Build opinion - elf fighter / ranger multi class

[Bobbert~H]

hi all

this character will be my first Elf, only been playing about 18months. starting ROTRL (NO SPOILERS PLEASE!)

STR 16 DEX 16 CON 13 INT 12 WIS 12 CHA 7 (after racials)

planning to be a switch hitter using shield and longsword/ javelins

LVL1: ranger : feat = toughness
LVL2: fighter : bonus feat = power attack
LVL3: fighter : feat + bonus feat = quick draw + deadly aim
LVL4: fighter : (no feat but full movement in medium armour)
LVL5: ranger : bonus feat(archery style) rapid shot + feat = dodge
LVL6: ranger : bonus feat = endurance (not optional)
LVL7: ranger : vital strike

why fighter? movement in medium armour - which allows acrobatics ( hoping to get this as a class skill with traits

why ranger? my last character was a rogue and i'm quite attached to skill points.

what next? despite not being core my gm will allow stalwart defender. i realise the movement penalty sucks but i'm planning to use the defensive stance on big bad to lock them down vs me.

basically im thinking i have this pretty finished. what i want to know is if you would tweak it, where and why?

thanks for your time

[avr]

Levels 2-4 as an elven fighter with 12 Int means 3 skill points each level. This seems like it goes against your attachment to them. This also applies to any levels in stalwart defender that you may take.

Vital strike is usually a bad idea, especially for a medium size character attacking with only one hand. With two-handed weapons and an easy way to get to large size, maybe.

In one line there you implied that you were allowed core-only material + stalwart defender. (A note on stalwart defender; while it locks you down, it in no way stops an enemy walking around you. They may have to take an attack of opportunity, but this character doesn't have especially good AoOs.) Assuming core, those stats & a desire to do the switch hitter thing I might make an elven ranger this way:

1: Quick draw
Combat style 2: Two-weapon fighting
3: Combat reflexes
Ranger 3: Endurance
5: Dodge (or whatever)
Combat style 6: Improved two-weapon fighting
7: Two-weapon defense (or whatever)

Using a couple of thrown weapons TWF gives you the equivalent of rapid shot. Combat reflexes gives you a little ability to lock down the battlefield, though not a great deal admittedly it is more than the first character. Without the fighter levels you can get full skill points, favored enemy increases on time and ranger spellcasting from 4th level - while not much it's better than nothing.

& no, I wouldn't aim for stalwart defender. If you want the d12 HD and some combat bonuses try a level or two in barbarian, possibly with the extra rage feat. The barbarian fast movement can cancel out the medium armor speed penalty without needing to take fighter levels too.

[Slim Jim]

Bobbert~H wrote:

STR 16 DEX 16 CON 13 INT 12 WIS 12 CHA 7 (after racials) ...planning to be a switch hitter using shield and longsword/ javelins

So...16,14,15,10,12,7 pre-racial = 20pt.

Contrary to what fantasy literature would seem to suggest, elves don't do particularly well as melee rangers, at least with 3e/Pathfinder racial adjustments. A dwarf fighter or raging human barbarian are going to be enjoying almost twice as many hitpoints relatively quickly, even with you having Toughness. And your AC isn't going to be better enough to keep you from just being bashed into greasy paste.

Suggestions: be a half-elf instead of an elf. (As a ranger without arcane casting, the elven INT bonus will go largely to waste, while the CON-penalty will threaten your life in every combat. You enjoy most of the elven racial bonuses, pick up a free feat, and don't forfeit a hitpoint/level multiclassing.)

STR: 14 or 17
DEX+ 17 or 14
CON: 14
INT: 12
WIS: 14 (half-elf 20pt, post-racial)
CHA: 7

alternative racial traits: Fey Thoughts (pick Acrobatics, Escape Artist for class skills)
character traits: Deadeye Bowman, Magical Knack(Ranger)

01 Barbarian [savtech], Skill Focus:Perception, Mounted Combat

...Get a heavy-horse ASAP and train it for combat. Ride with a lance. Don't forget your elevation bonus. This is the biggest bang for the buck at low level for a martial.

02 Ranger1
03 Ranger2 [Archery:Rapid Shot], Quick Draw
04 Ranger3
05 Ranger4, [spellcastling], Boon Companion

So long as you dip out only one level, your animal companion is maxed out at your character level with Boon Companion. Retrain Mounted Combat to something else (probably Deadly Aim) if you choose to no longer ride.

06 Ranger5
07 Ranger6 [Manyshot]

[Meirril]

One thing to consider is if you are allowed the full rules of the game there are different combat styles available to rangers.

Faithful:Kurgees is especially appropriate since it has feats that encourage a 'throw and charge' combat style. But taking just the Throwing Weapon or Shield Fighter combat styles would change a lot. Faithful: Desna is very appropriate for ROTRL. Erastil is universally acceptable and a decent set of feats for what you're describing.

Umm...small spoiler? At the start of the campaign mounted combat isn't going to be too practical. But the further into the AP you move the more you'll be able to use it. While you shouldn't kill yourself doing it, you'll want to arrange for a flying mount as soon as possible. Or if one with climb speed is available before that climb speed. Riding a large creature won't be a problem 90% of the time.

Actual Spoiler:

Also rangers should take Giant as their first favored enemy. The payoff is going to be huge.

[Bobbert~H]

HI all

Apologies for not replying, didn't realise Paizo was back up, and i have no idea how to get notifications on for post i create ( feel free to tell me how xD )

thanks for the feedback, its definitely has given me food for thought

at the moment elf is the only race i've not played, so i'm definitely running with that, and the 4th level boost to Con and toughness i hope will keep me up.

as for stalwart, i agree the not moving sucks, it may change dependant on how the battles go. i may stay fighter if i think the pay off is there, of even multi-class barbarian (role play option as my friend is playing and elf rogue who is my characters wife - she dies - i riot)

skill points; i'm hoping that 8 1 level and 3 the next balances me out with about 5/level with is definitely work able.

thank you all for responding

[Hellz]

Go full Fighter for Core(that's what you're playing right?)
I don't know anything about ROTRL.

14,16,15,12,10,7 stat, for 20 pt buy.

14,18,13,14,10,7 for an Elf.

Reason for this, is you don't get much damage from STR from going higher, and melee weapons are just a backup. You will suffer a bit on Will saves like this. Could get Iron Will on 7 instead of Quickdraw, to shore up. Or the Endurance you want.
Melee weapons HAVE to be a backup, since you don't have that much CON. d10 +2 HP SHOULD be fine for a ranged, since your AC should be good.

This is, obviously, a more Ranged focused approach. Building Ranged is just too feat intensive, but since it's Core only, you pretty much got all of the feats by lvl 6. You could go further and get Grt. Weapon Focus/Grt. Weapon Spc, but I don't know how good that is.

1.Point Blank Shot. Precise Shot.
2.Rapid Shot.
3.Weapon Focus.
4.Weapon Specialiation. (Boost con to 14)
5.Deadly Aim. Pick Bows Weapon Training
6.Manyshot.
7.Quickdraw.(Iron Will/Endurance)

2+2(int) skill points should get what you want, or you can just spend the favored class bonus to hit those 5 skill points.(since you said 5/level is fine)

Use a Buckler, it doesn't penalize your Longbow if you're wearing while shooting, so it's easy to switch up if you get surrounded.

Quickdraw on 7 let's you do a full attack when you need to drop the bow.

[Name Violation]

Slim Jim wrote:

Bobbert~H wrote:

STR 16 DEX 16 CON 13 INT 12 WIS 12 CHA 7 (after racials) ...planning to be a switch hitter using shield and longsword/ javelins

So...16,14,15,10,12,7 pre-racial = 20pt.

Contrary to what fantasy literature would seem to suggest, elves don't do particularly well as melee rangers, at least with 3e/Pathfinder racial adjustments. A dwarf fighter or raging human barbarian are going to be enjoying almost twice as many hitpoints relatively quickly, even with you having Toughness. And your AC isn't going to be better enough to keep you from just being bashed into greasy paste.

Suggestions: be a half-elf instead of an elf. (As a ranger without arcane casting, the elven INT bonus will go largely to waste, while the CON-penalty will threaten your life in every combat. You enjoy most of the elven racial bonuses, pick up a free feat, and don't forfeit a hitpoint/level multiclassing.)

STR: 14 or 17
DEX+ 17 or 14
CON: 14
INT: 12
WIS: 14 (half-elf 20pt, post-racial)
CHA: 7

alternative racial traits: Fey Thoughts (pick Acrobatics, Escape Artist for class skills)
character traits: Deadeye Bowman, Magical Knack(Ranger)

01 Barbarian [savtech], Skill Focus:Perception, Mounted Combat

...Get a heavy-horse ASAP and train it for combat. Ride with a lance. Don't forget your elevation bonus. This is the biggest bang for the buck at low level for a martial.

02 Ranger1
03 Ranger2 [Archery:Rapid Shot], Quick Draw
04 Ranger3
05 Ranger4, [spellcastling], Boon Companion

So long as you dip out only one level, your animal companion is maxed out at your character level with Boon Companion. Retrain Mounted Combat to something else (probably Deadly Aim) if you choose to no longer ride.

06 Ranger5
07 Ranger6 [Manyshot]

Never get a horse. Always get a bison. A bison cost 24gp and has better stats and hp.