Whedon describes THE NEVERS as his "most ambitious narrative to date", a serialised story about a group of young women in the Victorian era who have strange and unusual powers (so far, so Whedon).
Whedon apparently presented the project (which started life as a comic book he had planned a few years ago) to several studios, starting a bidding war between HBO and Netflix that ended with HBO victorious. HBO have given a straight-to-series order, without even having to go through the pilot stage.
This continues HBO's aggressive move into genre television, following their greenlighting of the GAME OF THRONES: THE LONG NIGHT pilot, their development of a second GAME OF THRONES spin-off (called EMPIRE OF ASH), their commissioning of a third season of WESTWORLD, their pilot order for the WATCHMEN sequel series, their Jordan Peele horror collaboration (THE LOVECRAFT DIARIES) and their collaboration with J.J. Abrams on a new TV series (DEMIMONDE), although this may be delayed due to his commitment to STAR WARS EPISODE IX.
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NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
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NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
I had the odds on the first person/reply being this at around 8 in 10. Sadly, no one was going to bet against that.
RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16
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I was excited about the summary when I read it. I hope their powers are occult/steampunk/mad science themed, and not just modern day super hero stuff.
I'm somewhat thinking the show might be like an all female version of League of Extraordinary Gentlemen. Interested to see how it compares to that and to Penny Dreadful.
My feelings exactly.Whedon describes THE NEVERS as his "most ambitious narrative to date", a serialised story about a group of young women in the Victorian era who have strange and unusual powers (so far, so Whedon).... I have a bad feeling about this.
At first I was excited about an HBO SF series, even with Wheddon. Then, I read that first paragraph and wanted to puke.
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I like the idea of Victorians with superpowers. I'm not sure I trust Whedon to do the research to do the historical elements right, let alone the fact that his being at the helm probably means they're all tiny waifs with angst about how their evil boyfriend doesn't love them.
Whedon has had a few good ideas--I enjoyed Angel the series in particular (fanboys/girls ruined Firefly for me)--but I haven't seen him have a good idea in a very, very longtime.
There is a CHANCE, just a chance, it could be okay though. If it's kind of like Giles' aunts in the Buffy Comic having their own show, that might be amusing.
Well, at least this keeps him away from Batgirl (which he left). Good luck to him.
I don't get HBO so I'll probably never see it anyway.
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I like the idea of Victorians with superpowers. I'm not sure I trust Whedon to do the research to do the historical elements right, let alone the fact that his being at the helm probably means they're all tiny waifs with angst about how their evil boyfriend doesn't love them.
Whedon has had a few good ideas--I enjoyed Angel the series in particular (fanboys/girls ruined Firefly for me)--but I haven't seen him have a good idea in a very, very longtime.
There is a CHANCE, just a chance, it could be okay though. If it's kind of like Giles' aunts in the Buffy Comic having their own show, that might be amusing.
Well, at least this keeps him away from Batgirl (which he left). Good luck to him.
I don't get HBO so I'll probably never see it anyway.
you mean I am not alone?!
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you mean I am not alone?!I like the idea of Victorians with superpowers. I'm not sure I trust Whedon to do the research to do the historical elements right, let alone the fact that his being at the helm probably means they're all tiny waifs with angst about how their evil boyfriend doesn't love them.
Whedon has had a few good ideas--I enjoyed Angel the series in particular (fanboys/girls ruined Firefly for me)--but I haven't seen him have a good idea in a very, very longtime.
There is a CHANCE, just a chance, it could be okay though. If it's kind of like Giles' aunts in the Buffy Comic having their own show, that might be amusing.
Well, at least this keeps him away from Batgirl (which he left). Good luck to him.
I don't get HBO so I'll probably never see it anyway.
No, and I've met other folks who feel similarly. Browncoats at least at one point, when they especially wouldn't shut up about whatever or stop quoting the show, induce a certain sort of rage in me that's hard to describe. When they're near me, I generally start talking about how awesome that scene was in Serenity where Wash died, and then I laugh wickedly while drinking their tears.
The really frustrating thing is the show wasn't bad--some good things, some bad, but it was more than watchable--but I can't even look at it without picturing some nerdy a%&*++@ going on about how sexy Nathan Fillion is or quoting Jayne or whatever and I know I will never be able to watch the show again without feeling bitter.
(Mind, I'm sure people feel similarly about me and the way I go on about some of my fandoms, but I try hard--don't know if I succeed--not to be too insufferable. And at the same time, despite any bitter feelings I might have, I wouldn't go into a Firefly forum and tell them to stop liking it or anything.)
Maybe that's part of my hesitation about interest in this show. Less, "will it be good," than, "what kind of obnoxious fans will it produce"?
you mean I am not alone?!I like the idea of Victorians with superpowers. I'm not sure I trust Whedon to do the research to do the historical elements right, let alone the fact that his being at the helm probably means they're all tiny waifs with angst about how their evil boyfriend doesn't love them.
Whedon has had a few good ideas--I enjoyed Angel the series in particular (fanboys/girls ruined Firefly for me)--but I haven't seen him have a good idea in a very, very longtime.
There is a CHANCE, just a chance, it could be okay though. If it's kind of like Giles' aunts in the Buffy Comic having their own show, that might be amusing.
Well, at least this keeps him away from Batgirl (which he left). Good luck to him.
I don't get HBO so I'll probably never see it anyway.
No, and I've met other folks who feel similarly. Browncoats at least at one point, when they especially wouldn't shut up about whatever or stop quoting the show, induce a certain sort of rage in me that's hard to describe. When they're near me, I generally start talking about how awesome that scene was in Serenity where Wash died, and then I laugh wickedly while drinking their tears.
The really frustrating thing is the show wasn't bad--some good things, some bad, but it was more than watchable--but I can't even look at it without picturing some nerdy a#@!%#+ going on about how sexy Nathan Fillion is or quoting Jayne or whatever and I know I will never be able to watch the show again without feeling bitter.
(Mind, I'm sure people feel similarly about me and the way I go on about some of my fandoms, but I try hard--don't know if I succeed--not to be too insufferable.)
Maybe that's part of my hesitation about interest in this show. Less, "will it be good," than, "what kind of obnoxious fans will it produce"?
I usually just say it's my favorite part of the film...
Jane Espenson, who has worked with Whedon on just about everything since Buffy, will be the co-showrunner and another writer on this project. Playwright Madhuri Shekar and journalist Laurie Penny will also be writers on the project.
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I don't think of myself as a Whedon fanboi, but I really enjoyed Buffy and Firefly. Angel...was okay. It probably helped that I never paid attention to what other fans of the shows thought outside my immediate circle of friends.
I enjoyed Jane Espenson's work on Buffy and Gilmore Girls, so that's another reason for me to give this series a look.
Both Buffy and Firefly are rather quotable, but then my wife and I have long had a weird form of twinspeak shorthand that incorporates quotes from Monty Python, Danger Mouse, 1776 (the musical), the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, The Tick and a score of other sources as part of everyday conversation. (Babylon 5 has some of the greatest bits of dialogue ever, but most of it can't be dropped into a normal conversation as shorthand for anything.)
"Our thoughts form the universe... They always matter."
- G'Kar
Not very usable but my favorite quote.
I have enjoyed pretty much all of the Whedon shows, even if I do think some of his later works (Dollhouse and yes...Firefly) were not as strong as Buffy or Angel.
I'll certainly watch this, although I generally only subscribe to HBO for a couple of months per year, then binge everything I am interested. Personally more interested in the Lovecraft Country adaptation by Peele than anything else listed there.
sounds interesting and as long as he dials back on the problems they have it could be good.
Interestingly, this show seems to be casting much older than Whedon's shows normally skew.
And now Whedon has quit, following completion of shooting.
His co-producers are handling post-production for the series launch in the summer of 2021.
That's quite a thing. I suspect Whedon realised he was going to lose his disciplinary investigation for how he handled the JUSTICE LEAGUE reshoots (once Jason Momoa took against him, that seemed certain) and decided to go before Warners severed all ties with him.
How long this has been on the cards is unclear. In fact, back in May (before Fisher's allegations of bullying) Whedon was reportedly having meetings with Marvel over maybe writing (but not directing) a new Fantastic Four movie and helming a Disney+ Marvel show, which suggests he was planning on bailing on Warners before the current situation erupted. Obviously he has form for this, several times kicking off TV shows and then leaving other writers to work on them full-time whilst he does other stuff.
Never seen Firefly so avoided all that.
I just hate Whedon as a person and as a director and don't trust him when it involves women.
You know, this (the bolded part) wouldn't be as bad if he wasn't shouting so loudly that he is/was a Feminist.
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Whedon's involved? Hard pass.
Whedon's involved? Hard pass.
Not any more.
Halfway through shooting. That was confusing but it seems that HBO chopped the season in half because they had so many delays. So twelve episodes, the first six (a couple written and directed by Whedon) are being shown in June and then the last six still need to be filmed, which should be happening fairly imminently.
Whedon's fingerprints are still going to be in the first season, of course, but there's other writers (including Jane Espensons, Doug Petrie and Laurie Penny) and directors involved.
Hope always exist. Just some times, it's a false one.
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I think we can safely say that any chance that Whedon might come back later on or, indeed, be doing anything in the entertainment industry ever again has sailed over the edge of a cliff.
Much like that pirate ship in Monty Python's Meaning of Life.
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Whedon sucks.
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I can't believe WB sided with Joss and fired Ray Fisher from the DCEU (which is why the Buffy stars recently have spoken up).
It's a shame because somewhere beneath that utter mess of a man, Joss Whedon had some good world-building skills and story ideas. I liked the concepts in Buffy and Angel, and there were some good stories in there (although arguably some of the best ones really came from Jane Espenson, but he still built the foundations). There were cool ideas in Firefly; the Browncoats ruined that for me more than he did per se. And indeed part of his power wasn't actually his writing skill, but that his work was popular at a time of a youthful internet, and he was able and willing to engage with fans directly online. That was the source of his cult of personality, that fans felt close to him (and I am sure that also fueled actors' fear of speaking out because at the time it would have upset and split the fanbase, in addition to endangered their fledgling careers), more than his actual skill at creating and maintaining stories. As the nature of the world has forced him to separate from fans and the Internet becomes increasingly more cynical, it can now be used to out him and cut him down to size.
And because while he had some good world-building skills, he also relies too heavily on sameold sameold tropes (couples can never be happy, someone has to die, waify girls are the badasses (who are yet often tortured in some way), and someone is always the broken bird), so he can't captivate people for long. People know now never to get too attached to his characters because they are always expendable, and because character building is one of his strong points, it keeps people from engaging from his work at all. He is also well known for starting something big, but then petering out and leaving work to be finished by other people; he was only deeply involved in Buffy in early seasons and then delegated much of its running later on to others; same for Angel; and the same would have happened to Firefly if it had lasted more than a season. He started big with Avengers but clearly burned out just at the second film, and this too looks like even with all other things aside he couldn't even make it through the first season. Even if he wasn't turning out in truth to be a deeply troubling abusive misogynist and racist a&#*!%%, I think his time would be up anyway. He doesn't have the consistency or stamina to contribute to the entertainment world well. He keeps saying he is exhausted, but moreover, the rest of the world is exhausted by him. The fact that he is ALSO apparently an abusive misogynist racist douchebag just ensures if there was anything left of worth in him for us to see, we won't want to anyway. If he was able to collaborate well, use his worldbuilding skills alongside writers who can break out of molds and stick with a project, he could maintain success, but no one should want to collaborate with an abusive piece of s!!+, and being an abusive piece of s~@* means he doesn't deserve success anyway.
On the subject of the thread, the Nevers looks interesting. But it's hard to trust how well it will hold up with his finger in that pie. But since he'll no longer be involved, it might be worth checking out to see what potential it has.
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On the subject of the thread, the Nevers looks interesting. But it's hard to trust how well it will hold up with his finger in that pie. But since he'll no longer be involved, it might be worth checking out to see what potential it has.
As you mentioned earlier, he starts out strong and then loses interest and wanders off leaving his gardens to be tended by others (and if he does return, tends to start ripping stuff up almost petulantly, as if annoyed at being dragged backwards from his endless quest for the new shiny).
This might be the best situation for the Nevers, to benefit from his input when he's right at the beginning, when all his creative thrusters are firing, and then ditch him long before he gets bored and destructive and repetitive.
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Much like that pirate ship in Monty Python's Meaning of Life.
The Crimson Permanent Assurance did return for an unwarranted attack on the main feature, only to have a larger building fall on it.
It did but that's not in cannon for me. :)
On the subject of the thread, the Nevers looks interesting. But it's hard to trust how well it will hold up with his finger in that pie. But since he'll no longer be involved, it might be worth checking out to see what potential it has.As you mentioned earlier, he starts out strong and then loses interest and wanders off leaving his gardens to be tended by others (and if he does return, tends to start ripping stuff up almost petulantly, as if annoyed at being dragged backwards from his endless quest for the new shiny).
This might be the best situation for the Nevers, to benefit from his input when he's right at the beginning, when all his creative thrusters are firing, and then ditch him long before he gets bored and destructive and repetitive.
This is part of what I was trying to say but I got trapped inside my own rambling.
When does the show release?
Sometime in April.
Definitely a lot of x men vibes with this with some interesting characters.
Does Amelia have some kind of superstrength/durability in addition to seeing the future or is that just Whedon Fu?
I caught a couple episodes, but I also cancelled my HBOMax membership recently and it just ran out so I won't likely see anymore for a bit (wasn't finding enough to watch to justify the price that I hadn't already watched and was having some playback issues).
Definitely can win Whedon bingo with this although it's not the worst I've seen. I expect he was reined in a bit (and probably why he left after a season). There's also upsides to Whedon repeating himself like Olivia Williams being an awesome grey area villainish? mastermind. At the same time part of the reason I'm not brokenhearted about seeing more right away this way I don't have to worry about getting to the part where a love interest becomes weirdly rapey or the character I like/identify with the most getting brutally murdered for drama's sake.
Honestly I didn't think it was bad although a bit muddled. I like the premise of XMen But Victorian; it would be fun to play a Mutants and Masterminds game set in a similar sort of setting. Some of the historical accuracy/inaccuracy is all over the place. Like some fits but other bits feel like it's just someone's idea of Victorian rather than doing the research to be sure. The main characters seem fairly cool; the actors are good. The steampunky aspects are fun.
I believe yes Amalia does have some kind of superstrength/durability--I recall explicitly them showing her healing very quickly--and despite them saying no two people have the same turn I think the reason has something to do with her connection to Maladie, who also seems to have some kind of superstrength/durability. (I have not seen the latest episode so I don't know if they've built upon that).
Whedon did leave after six episodes (and only wrote one of those and directed two) so I don't think he had anywhere near enough time to drop in his standard, more dubious tropes.
Whedon did leave after six episodes (and only wrote one of those and directed two) so I don't think he had anywhere near enough time to drop in his standard, more dubious tropes.
What about "his standard, more dubious" personal behaviors? :(
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Whedon did leave after six episodes (and only wrote one of those and directed two) so I don't think he had anywhere near enough time to drop in his standard, more dubious tropes.What about "his standard, more dubious" personal behaviors? :(
Given he left after only six episodes, one might speculate--with the emphasis on speculation--he may have tried to get away with such and didn't.