A Witch, a Wizard, some Permanency, and a Pocketful of Vipers


Advice


I want to make a sub-boss who will be a re-accruing bad guy who will be a LvL 9 Wizard/Lvl 6 Witch who is constantly booby-trapping basically everything with Saturday-morning Cartoon villain style traps. Such as casting "Pocketful of Vipers" on the Party's main thing of storage and then casting "Permanency" on it.

I've sadly can't find much I can do with idea but I'm determined to do so. I've come here looking for ideas and help on making this enemy and his childish traps.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

*messenger* "Sir, I have a sealed letter for you, *pops seal* it reads..." {EXPLOSIVE RUNES!}

*old lady* "Why thank you for helping this old granny across the road, you take this basket of fresh apple wraps for your kindness..." *old lady opens basket, shows a apple wrap, eats one, closes lid and hands basket off, then walks away* "What a nice granny" *hungry party member opens basket* {FIRE TRAP!}

I do love the Disguise Hex...


Scrapper wrote:

*messenger* "Sir, I have a sealed letter for you, *pops seal* it reads..." {EXPLOSIVE RUNES!}

*old lady* "Why thank you for helping this old granny across the road, you take this basket of fresh apple wraps for your kindness..." *old lady opens basket, shows a apple wrap, eats one, closes lid and hands basket off, then walks away* "What a nice granny" *hungry party member opens basket* {FIRE TRAP!}

I do love the Disguise Hex...

That is an amazing idea. I will definitely do that.


My IRL Friend just mentioned a Metamagic feat called "Conditional Spell" and it will work amazing well with this character. Any got some good ideas with that feat.


You realize that your proposed build, Wiz 9 / Witch 6, is crippled. A straight wiz 15 or witch 15 can cast 8th level spells; yours tops at 5th...


Best uses: Conditional dispel (perhaps something the gave the party turns dangerous.

Summons - while they sleep. Doesn't even have to be deadly- an invisible imp pickpocket works just great.

Even more amusing if he pick pockets all the ingredients for resist fire....


pad300 wrote:
You realize that your proposed build, Wiz 9 / Witch 6, is crippled. A straight wiz 15 or witch 15 can cast 8th level spells; yours tops at 5th...

Maybe he's not trying to optimize a sub boss, buddy.


pad300 wrote:
You realize that your proposed build, Wiz 9 / Witch 6, is crippled. A straight wiz 15 or witch 15 can cast 8th level spells; yours tops at 5th...

If you want somebody who has that many levels but doesn't cast 8th level spells, but doesn't lose caster levels or Hex levels, try single-classed Hexcrafter Magus -- natively part Wizard, part Witch, and part Fighter.


pad300 wrote:
You realize that your proposed build, Wiz 9 / Witch 6, is crippled. A straight wiz 15 or witch 15 can cast 8th level spells; yours tops at 5th...

The only spell-casters in the party are a Paladin and a Rogue. I don't want to make overpowered spell-casting enemies.


UnArcaneElection wrote:
pad300 wrote:
You realize that your proposed build, Wiz 9 / Witch 6, is crippled. A straight wiz 15 or witch 15 can cast 8th level spells; yours tops at 5th...

If you want somebody who has that many levels but doesn't cast 8th level spells, but doesn't lose caster levels or Hex levels, try single-classed Hexcrafter Magus -- natively part Wizard, part Witch, and part Fighter.

I'm having him go Wizard-Witch and not Hexcrafter Magus because Magus doesn't get the spells I would use, and I would have to go out of my way to get a Familiar for him since I've been planning on giving him a Poppet Familiar.


Stacking Wizard-Witch lvls for Familiar or Arcane Bond Item for Wizard and Familiar for Witch? In latter case, I recall there was a feat to boost Familiar levels, some thing about adding half lvls of a non-familiar class, don't recall exact name or if it could be applied in this case as Wizard is border-line with option of Familiar or Arcane Bond. As pointed out, it's not as powerful as a pure lvl 15 caster, but I Love the Flavor and versatility, it can pose as a number of other casters, keeping the party guessing every time they meet some one new!
One spell that is a Must Have is Non-Detection! Foils Detect Alignment and Detect Magic, making that lovely Disguise Hex much more Fun to use!


All I'll say further is that a wiz9/Witch6 is about a CR 11, not a CR 14, like a non-crippled 15th level character normally is. Further, he has 35000 or so in gear (45000 or so if heroic), while a normal CR 11 encounter gives about 7000 gp in wealth. You need to think hard about how much of a Christmas present you want to give your PC's...


pad300 wrote:

All I'll say further is that a wiz9/Witch6 is about a CR 11, not a CR 14, like a non-crippled 15th level character normally is. Further, he has 35000 or so in gear (45000 or so if heroic), while a normal CR 11 encounter gives about 7000 gp in wealth. You need to think hard about how much of a Christmas present you want to give your PC's...

He won't be a direct combat encounter he will be a rival slowing them down while he tries to get the maguffins.


The Boss's right hand that always gets away, causes distraction and gathers intelligence for The Big Boss, but rarely confronts the party as their true persona. They might do a direct confrontation with the party at the end game, only to applaud their skill, give a hint of what lies ahead, possibly betraying The Big Boss, then vanish in a poof of smoke and laughter...
They may reappear later in another form to help the party take down a rival or two so they can quietly step in as a new underling to a puppet boss...
or Poppet Boss!


Velos Lithe wrote:
UnArcaneElection wrote:
pad300 wrote:
You realize that your proposed build, Wiz 9 / Witch 6, is crippled. A straight wiz 15 or witch 15 can cast 8th level spells; yours tops at 5th...

If you want somebody who has that many levels but doesn't cast 8th level spells, but doesn't lose caster levels or Hex levels, try single-classed Hexcrafter Magus -- natively part Wizard, part Witch, and part Fighter.

I'm having him go Wizard-Witch and not Hexcrafter Magus because Magus doesn't get the spells I would use, and I would have to go out of my way to get a Familiar for him since I've been planning on giving him a Poppet Familiar.

Which spells? Remember that a Hexcrafter Magus gets everything with the [Curse] descriptor up to 6th level.

Just had an idea: If Hexcrafter Magus doesn't cut it for spell list (or at least come close enough to let you use Spell Blending to get the rest), how about Mystic Theurge using entry classes Witch + Shaman (Shaman 3/Witch 3/Mystic Theurge 9)? For the Shaman levels, use the Lore Spirit (NOT Wandering Spirit) with Arcane Enlightenment to snag Sorcerer/Wizard spells you would otherwise be missing. If I understand correctly, the non-Mystic-Theurge levels even stack for Hex effect and DC, and they also stack for Familiar advancement (the Shaman class description specifically says that other Familiar classes stack with effective Shaman level for Spirit Animal advancement). Mystic Theurge isn't great (especially if you can't use any of the early entry cheese that has been found since the SLA FAQ nerf) until you get to super-high levels, but it would be less suboptimal than Wizard 9/Witch 6. Refraining from using early entry cheese actually provides some benefit in this case by providing Hex advancement and Familiar advancement (3 levels of Shaman + 3 levels of Witch = 6 levels, same as with Wizard 9/Witch 6), and then the Boon Companion feat can cover 4 more levels of the latter (gets it to 10 levels). Use the Magical Knack trait to boost the caster level of whichever type of spellcasting you want to favor, and the caster level for that type of spells will be only 1 behind a single-classed spellcaster with the same character level, while the spellcasting progression for both classes is 3 behind (whereas Wizard 9/Witch 6 is behind by 6 for Wizard and 9 for Witch, and Magical Knack can't come close to making up the deficit in caster level for either one). Both Mystic Theurge(*) and Shaman of Lore with Arcane Enlightenment are highly MAD, but the MADness here completely overlaps -- you want Wisdom for Shaman spellcasting, including the Save DCs of spells snagged with Arcane Enlightenment, and you want Intelligence for Witch spellcasting and to be able to snag more spells with Arcane Enlightenment. Since this build will get you to 6th level spells (in both classes) at 15th level, it's pushing the upper limit of what you want, but probably not too over the top -- if you want to limit it to 5th level spells, knock off just 2 character levels (taken from Mystic Theurge).

(*)Exception: Using 2 Charisma-dependent classes or Intelligence-based caster (preferably Wizard with Faith Magic) + Living Grimoire Inquisitor -- however, these combinations don't do what you want. Edit: EXCEPT:

Just had another idea: Seducer Witch (changes spellcasting and Hex DC to Charisma-dependent, but still prepared spellcasting) + Spirit Guide Oracle also does the trick (Oracle 4/Witch 3/Mystic Theurge 8). You can even snag the Lore Spirit with the Arcane Enlightenment Hex to snag Sorcerer/Wizard spells, although this still requires Intelligence. Arcane Enlightenment Hex on a Spirit Guide Oracle may be ruled not to work by a literal reading of the text, but since you are the GM, you can declare that it works, just as long as you let the PCs use this too. This gets you 7 levels of Hex instead of 6, but only 3 levels of Familiar (7 with Boon Companion) instead of 6 (10 with Boon Companion), and you just need to take off 1 character level to limit spells to 5th level, but spellcasting has more synergy (Mystic Theurge lets you use spontaneous spell slots to recast expended spells 1 level lower in your prepared class). Again not great, but still less suboptimal than Wizard 9/Witch 6.


UnArcaneElection wrote:
Velos Lithe wrote:
UnArcaneElection wrote:
pad300 wrote:
You realize that your proposed build, Wiz 9 / Witch 6, is crippled. A straight wiz 15 or witch 15 can cast 8th level spells; yours tops at 5th...

If you want somebody who has that many levels but doesn't cast 8th level spells, but doesn't lose caster levels or Hex levels, try single-classed Hexcrafter Magus -- natively part Wizard, part Witch, and part Fighter.

I'm having him go Wizard-Witch and not Hexcrafter Magus because Magus doesn't get the spells I would use, and I would have to go out of my way to get a Familiar for him since I've been planning on giving him a Poppet Familiar.

Which spells? Remember that a Hexcrafter Magus gets everything with the [Curse] descriptor up to 6th level.

Just had an idea: If Hexcrafter Magus doesn't cut it for spell list (or at least come close enough to let you use Spell Blending to get the rest), how about Mystic Theurge using entry classes Witch + Shaman (Shaman 3/Witch 3/Mystic Theurge 9)? For the Shaman levels, use the Lore Spirit (NOT Wandering Spirit) with Arcane Enlightenment to snag Sorcerer/Wizard spells you would otherwise be missing. If I understand correctly, the non-Mystic-Theurge levels even stack for Hex effect and DC, and they also stack for Familiar advancement (the Shaman class description specifically says that other Familiar classes stack with effective Shaman level for Spirit Animal advancement). Mystic Theurge isn't great (especially if you can't use any of the early entry cheese that has been found since the SLA FAQ nerf) until you get to super-high levels, but it would be less suboptimal than Wizard 9/Witch 6. Refraining from using early entry cheese actually provides some benefit in this case by providing Hex advancement and Familiar advancement (3 levels of Shaman + 3 levels of Witch = 6 levels, same as with Wizard 9/Witch 6), and then the Boon Companion feat can cover 4 more levels of the latter (gets it to 10 levels). Use the Magical...

I really like this Shaman/Witch/Mystic Idea I'll look at the concept of this to see if it fits my campaighn


. . . Ever since I posted the above, I now have a nagging urge to try to make a viable PC out of one of the above options . . . .

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Advice / A Witch, a Wizard, some Permanency, and a Pocketful of Vipers All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.