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I am scheduled to play Bonekeep in a few weeks and I have a character that has enough exp to be 3rd level from GM credit. I know the mod is supposed to be deadly. I am not looking for any spoilers, but I would like advice on a level 3 build with about 3500gp and 12 fame/10prestige to work with. The others play it with me will most likely be a level 4 gnome life oracle, a level 5 gnome druid, and probably a 7th level pregen (merisiel or ezren). We may have a level 5 tiefling kensai magus (dervish dance build) as well. Given all this informaton, what build would you use to help you and the whole group survive?
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By default, pregens are allowed to play in Bonekeep. Some regions have put restrictions that they won't seat pregens, but that is not the default rule.
I know I ran Bonekeep 1 at GenCon for 2 real characters and 4 pregens and watched them be pretty successful. (5 rooms, including the positive boon.)
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Anyways, as for the OP, without giving away any spoilers, sit down with your friends and brainstorm what you think are the nastiest, toughest encounters you've had in PFS, or that are tactically very difficult to deal with, and prepare for dealing with that.
I've only ever ran/played in the higher tier games. I am unsure how low level characters survive.
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Some players just don't get that *thrill* until they are on 7 hitpoints away from unconsciousness/death, have at least three [REDACTED] running through their body while a large [REDACTED] chases the party through a godforsaken [REDACTED] of [REDACTED]. And *that's* when the magically buffed [REDACTED] descends from the [REDACTED].
Good times, good times.
Yes, I had Mike Brock running it.
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I think what naturally creeps into a lot of players mind is that.. Im gonna die.. ive spent all this time on my character and he is gonna die. (and he might not come back).
It happens a lot more than you might think and especially to those characters who have 0 pp left (ie have died maybe once or multiple times and got better). Every time they die and return , there is more resistance to being in a less win or no win situation.
I have lost characters too. It isnt great, but I have copped. Id love to play Bonekeep Part 1 if it gets run locally and Ill certainly be charging forward (if the character likes that sorta stuff) into certain danger.
Or If not ill hang back while the rest of the group dies horribly :)
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RPG Superstar 2014 Top 32
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Well with a 3 blob,4 oracle,5 druid,5 magus you average out to APL 4. That means you'll be playing 3-4 and using a level 4 pregen for your 4th/5th player, and not a level 7 pregen.
Go through the Core Rulebook and find all the fun spells a pure level 6-7 caster could throw at you. Then flip through the bestiary and look at monsters up to CR 7. Look at their special defenses(DR, immunities) and special attacks.
Once you have your list of stuff to be worried about. Brainstorm with your friends about how to nullify, overcome or counter your list. There are several threads and at least one PFS blog on how to prepare yourselves for the worst with consumables.
As for party composition. You just look at do we have a damage sponge(tank), melee damage, ranged damage, magic damage, traps guy, knowledge guy, healing, etc.
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I am scheduled to play Bonekeep in a few weeks and I have a character that has enough exp to be 3rd level from GM credit. I know the mod is supposed to be deadly. I am not looking for any spoilers, but I would like advice on a level 3 build with about 3500gp and 12 fame/10prestige to work with. The others play it with me will most likely be a level 4 gnome life oracle, a level 5 gnome druid, and probably a 7th level pregen (merisiel or ezren). We may have a level 5 tiefling kensai magus (dervish dance build) as well. Given all this informaton, what build would you use to help you and the whole group survive?
I played bonekeep at DragonCon with a pickup group (whoever showed up at the table for that slot of the convention, with a character I figured was going to die and stay dead because she had not enough money or stuff or prestige to get raised (minimum 3rd level). She too had GM credit but I had also played her, and I built her to be a cork (ac 28 at 3rd) mostly but still had versatility - and I bought a lot of low gp equipment (after the armor and shield didn't have much beyond) to be "prepared" much of which wasn't needed at all - but was useful in games since.
So she survived with a widget, and no lasting consequences not uncommon for the game - and I played Battle Interactive with her later that day.
Play smart - be able to cover a role other than the one you planned - don't be afraid to do something you are not good at because sometimes a little extra help is what is needed - if you are a spell caster wear a spiked gauntlet (be a flank buddy between spells) if you are a melee character have a few chakrams - play smart - splitting the party is often bad - don't make fun of the GM before you start and pay attention to him when he/she talks, don't play on your tablet or phone between your turns, and don't be afraid to retreat and don't push it - if you group cannot make it you can back out before the TPK - also always top off your hit points. I don't care if you are only down 2 points (the exception is if you are low on healing but that just means not everyone has equipped properly - usually).
Why is the person playing a level 7 pregen - why not a level 4 pregen and keep the game in tier 3-4? If you play your 3rd character in the tier 6-7 - it will very likely be very bad and very quick. That is true for many year 4-5 games.
In bonekeep you have advance warning the mod is going to be really hard and you can plan for being stressed. Really hard scenarios, especially of the current year can sneak up on you and be really hard without warning.
I was ready to lose Vanna in order to play the game - but she survived - and I have a low level character to play the tank if we need one in a future party but that type of character is not my usual speed (my seeker is a 15th witch - my next highest are cleric, bard, sorcerer/cleric)
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Wow. So many people complaining about a dungeon delve. Bonekeep isn't for everyone. Please let the people who enjoy bloody tactical nightmares enjoy our cake. This is our moment to see a pure grind for the sake of grinding moment.
For every Bonekeep however I'd love to see another rp intensive mod like hellknight feast.
Also. Unless you have 14k in gold for scrolls than don't plan to beat Bonekeep. Just plan to try to survive 2-5 rooms.
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Owner - Enchanted Grounds, President/Owner - Enchanted Grounds
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I don't agree that Bonekeep isn't fun. It is, just in the same way that the old school Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth or White Plume Mountain modules were fun. They are dungeon crawls, as is Bonekeep, and a lot of people have very fond memories of those modules.
Having said that, nosig is right: the correct GM will go a long way toward making it fun, as the correct GM will actually approach the scenario in such a way that he presents the story to you. Because there really is a story in this one, and it's a pretty good story, and as a GM it is extremely fun to watch the light bulbs go on around the table as players figure things out. So, try to find that GM when you're playing through this.
To specifically address the OP: If you merely want to know what character build will survive this kind of adventure, that is an easy question to answer. Make a paladin. They have the best saves, have access to an excellent armor class, have smite evil to handle those pesky creatures that use DR as a defensive tool, and can heal themselves as a swift action in the midst of combat.
Beyond that, be prepared. Have options for all those things you know are dangerous (darkness, invisibility, flying, paralyzation, incorporeal, difficult terrain, etc.). And don't simply run through the adventure in an effort to get to every fight; make sure you are careful and know what you're dealing with. Last, make sure someone who comes along with you actually has good monster knowledge skills. A more vital tool for any scenario I cannot think of.
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All I can tell you is my First Character died at level 4 in Bonekeep at PaizoCon last year, and I was 1k gold short for coming back. All because I bought that Mithril Breastplate.
However you build the character, make sure you have the money for a res.
The rest of your party wasnt willing to help you out with that 1k?
Did you take into account that you can sell gear to help cover the difference?
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I actually ran this for a table of pregens at GenCon and they did very well. They didn't get through the entire thing, but they certainly got much further than I expected.
Honestly, if you play smart and are prepared for the worst then you should do OK. Don't forget that you can leave the dungeon in between combat at any time if things get too rough for you and your group.
A couple of things to remember about the scenario that are not spoilers that may help you:
1. There is a 5 hour time limit. You are not allowed to go over this, and the scenario will simply end immediately when it expires. Time management is very very important in this adventure. To this end, everyone at the table should always have their actions planned out before their turn comes around. People at the table should also avoid getting into rules arguments with the GM unless it is absolutely necessary. If your GM does not suggest to people that arguing is going to waste precious time, you might want to do so politely.
2. The creatures in bone keep may seem familiar to you in some cases if you are an experienced player, but they are all very unique. If something seems weird about a creature, it's safe to assume that it's just a new thing and not the GM screwing up. Hopefully, awareness of this in advance should save you time on unnecessary questions or arguments. If you want to get questions about these creatures, you're going to need someone with super high knowledge checks.
3. Awareness of terrain is quite important in this scenario. Pay attention to the room descriptions.
4. Consider investing in material components or scrolls for healing spells. That way your divine caster can keep you in shape without having to spend all of his own money. Sharing is caring! Material components for spells are trade goods, meaning they can be sold back for full price at the end of the adventure if they are unused. It comes in handy to keep some around in case something goes very wrong.
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Make sure there are at least 5 of you at the table, preferable 6. And, as someone previously mentioned, have a balanced adventuring party - have a high AC 'tank', preferably with decent saves (lolpaladin), dedicated healer, and a variety of damage dealers (a melee, a spellslinger, an archer/gunslinger).
Also, as previously mentioned, if you are familiar with the other players and characters, it can help A LOT. Play a different scenario as a table before going through Bonekeep. Or better, play 3. :-p
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OP, basically, just make sure your group can adequately handle a number of different monster types and has as much overall utility as possible. Have good saving throw modifiers. Be prepared to cover as many situations as possible with some good utility scrolls, spells, potions, alchemical items, etc.
I'm not really sure what else to say, as I do not want to spoil it, other than...
Having a well-rounded team will keep you alive in Bonekeep...while being ridiculously awesome at one or two specific aspects of the game/combat and not so great otherwise will most likely get your PCs killed.
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Bonekeep level one is an old school style dungeon crawl. If you've played first and second edition dnd modules, then you know what to expect. Honestly, you don't need an optimized group, you could do it with pregens even. What's necessary is smart players, teamwork, and a balanced party. Having optimized characters will just make it go quicker.
So your party is an Oracle, druid, magus, pregen, and you. Sounds like the roles you are missing is a trapper and an arcanist. So you'll want to play one of those, and the pregen the other. Preferably you'd get a 6th player too.
I ran this at Dexcon for a group of fairly non-optimized characters including 2 pregens. They made it halfway through and decided to retreat. Nobody even got very badly hurt, they just chickened out. At the high level table of highly optimized characters, they breezed through the entire thing and barely got scratched.
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RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 8
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Just wanted to mention there is tons of potential for some good roleplaying in Bonekeep. Posting exactly what happened during last night's session would be far too spolierific for this thread, but, even in a dungeon crawl like this, there were plenty of bluff, diplomacy, and sense motive checks rolled, as well as an encounter that was "defeated" through party negotiations.
More than half of them still died in the end, but the game was more than just a brutal dungeon crawl. It was a brutal dungeon crawl and an opportunity for the players to engage in some excellent RP.
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RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 8
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Just be careful that the RP is for a purpose, because your time is limited.
Pssh, RP is always for a purpose Lamontius!
If the players choose to engage in such activities, I as a GM can only serve to facilitate them. The table last night was able to explore all 9 rooms, and the game ended just shy of 5 hours.
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Just be careful that the RP is for a purpose, because your time is limited.
Pssh, RP is always for a purpose Lamontius!
If the players choose to engage in such activities, I as a GM can only serve to facilitate them. The table last night was able to explore all 9 rooms, and the game ended just shy of 5 hours.
Expect table variation.
I was tempting to sign up for Bone keep in about 3 week at the convention im going to. After this thread I dont think I will.
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Somebody nicked(I was told) our enrollment sheet, so last I saw of my previous Bonekeep chance was an angry guest GM(can't remember whether it was Mike Brock or Alistair Riggs) walking away from the table.
Gonna see whether my character can survive the City of Golden Fros...Death first, then he's 7.2 and has upwards to 14.000 in gp, so prepping for a delve should be a real laugh.
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All I can tell you is my First Character died at level 4 in Bonekeep at PaizoCon last year, and I was 1k gold short for coming back. All because I bought that Mithril Breastplate.
However you build the character, make sure you have the money for a res.
The rest of your party wasnt willing to help you out with that 1k?
Did you take into account that you can sell gear to help cover the difference?
The rest of the party had to pay for their own reses, and that was 1k short AFTER selling all my sellable gear.
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I was tempting to sign up for Bone keep in about 3 week at the convention im going to. After this thread I dont think I will.
I don't think this thread presented anything different to what the first text box the GM is required to read you when you begin Bonekeep tells you.
It's a lot of fun. Unless you only play social characters.
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Just be careful that the RP is for a purpose, because your time is limited.
Pssh, RP is always for a purpose Lamontius!
If the players choose to engage in such activities, I as a GM can only serve to facilitate them. The table last night was able to explore all 9 rooms, and the game ended just shy of 5 hours.
Dammit, Walter, you're making me jealous! I played this with a great GM who is excellent at RPing NPC's, bringing out the RP in the PC's, and making sure that at least some of the 'story' comes out during play. However, our table of Bonekeep seemed just like a slog to me ... and a series of VERY tenuously related combats (more like a bunch of different theme rooms stapled together with the thinnest veneer of a plot - I haven't read the scenario, but the ecology of the dungeon seemed pretty iffy ... and there seemed to be no 'theme' to what you would encounter .. other than, "here, here's a different type of challenge than you have dealt with in any of the previous room").
Anyway, I'm jealous that your players got to see you turn what is, in my opinion, a roleplay sow's ear into a silk purse. On the other hand, it's 73°F in Phoenix - what's it like in eastern WA today? :-p
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I was tempting to sign up for Bone keep in about 3 week at the convention im going to. After this thread I dont think I will.
Wait, Mr. Complains About PFS Lack of Difficulty is scared of Bonekeep? Remind me to taunt you mercilessly at our next session. :-)
Bonekeep isn't that bad if you keep your wits about you, prepare to deal with common ailments, and know when to call it a day. I breezed through both levels with 5 random strangers at last Gencon.
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RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 8
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Just be careful that the RP is for a purpose, because your time is limited.
Pssh, RP is always for a purpose Lamontius!
If the players choose to engage in such activities, I as a GM can only serve to facilitate them. The table last night was able to explore all 9 rooms, and the game ended just shy of 5 hours.
Dammit, Walter, you're making me jealous! I played this with a great GM who is excellent at RPing NPC's, bringing out the RP in the PC's, and making sure that at least some of the 'story' comes out during play. However, our table of Bonekeep seemed just like a slog to me ... and a series of VERY tenuously related combats (more like a bunch of different theme rooms stapled together with the thinnest veneer of a plot - I haven't read the scenario, but the ecology of the dungeon seemed pretty iffy ... and there seemed to be no 'theme' to what you would encounter .. other than, "here, here's a different type of challenge than you have dealt with in any of the previous room").
Anyway, I'm jealous that your players got to see you turn what is, in my opinion, a roleplay sow's ear into a silk purse. On the other hand, it's 73°F in Phoenix - what's it like in eastern WA today? :-p
Rain, rain, rain. But it's better than Snow, ice, ice.
Make sure table are full and players are good to go. I played it this past week and I optimize a bit. I was a str based Swashbuckler 5/Paladin 4. We only had 4 at the table and two were concerned about dying before starting. DM advised us to back out If I knew the other paladin at level 7 was sporting a 17 AC using a glaive I would have backed out, but I thought hay 2 paladins a zen archer and a sorcerer lets see where this goes. Well it went to me being the last one standing in an encounter and not enought smites, and the DM not rolling much under a 15 against me so... But it was fun and I would burn a star to do it again with players ready to tackle it. Though I need to earn my star. Guess I need to play less and GM more :) Good luck.
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Make sure table are full and players are good to go. I played it this past week and I optimize a bit. I was a str based Swashbuckler 5/Paladin 4. We only had 4 at the table and two were concerned about dying before starting. DM advised us to back out If I knew the other paladin at level 7 was sporting a 17 AC using a glaive I would have backed out, but I thought hay 2 paladins a zen archer and a sorcerer lets see where this goes. Well it went to me being the last one standing in an encounter and not enought smites, and the DM not rolling much under a 15 against me so... But it was fun and I would burn a star to do it again with players ready to tackle it. Though I need to earn my star. Guess I need to play less and GM more :) Good luck.
How did you play it as a level 9?
Wait, Mr. Complains About PFS Lack of Difficulty is scared of Bonekeep? Remind me to taunt you mercilessly at our next session. :-)
Bonekeep isn't that bad if you keep your wits about you, prepare to deal with common ailments, and know when to call it a day. I breezed through both levels with 5 random strangers at last Gencon.
Did NOT say I wouldnt play it. Just not randoming signing up for it. I mean, Im good but I cant do everything.