If I have a +1 Demon Bane weapon and I hit a demon with DR/cold iron, does the weapon bypass this DR?
Versus demons this is a +3 weapon, and +3 weapons normally bypass silver and cold iron DR. But temporary adjustments to the enhancement bonus, like Greater Magic Weapon, do not bypass DR. So which is the operative rule in this case?
If I have a +1 Demon Bane weapon and I hit a demon with DR/cold iron, does the weapon bypass this DR?
Versus demons this is a +3 weapon, and +3 weapons normally bypass silver and cold iron DR. But temporary adjustments to the enhancement bonus, like Greater Magic Weapon, do not bypass DR. So which is the operative rule in this case?
It is not a temporary bonus versus Demon, it's a permanent +3 bonus versus Demon, so yes you bypass... ;)
Greater Magic Weapon doesn't bypass DR because it specifically says it doesn't.
Unless you're using a bow or other projectile weapon, it overcomes DR.
Ah yes... ammunitions of a projectile weapon can only overcome magic DR... But you still got the full +3 damage... Just not overcome the DR... If you want to overcome the DR it's your ammunitions themselves that must be +1 bane or +3... ;)
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Unless you're using a bow or other projectile weapon, it overcomes DR.
Bane is one of the exceptions, as noted in the player's handbook.
Projectile weapons with this ability bestow this power upon their ammunition
You would still need to be using +1 arrows, if you want the benefits of a +3 arrow for DR silver and cold iron.
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If you are inquisitor you can just put the bane ability on the arrows right?
I mean I've done something similiar in a campaign where we started a bar fight, I took up a chair and as I was trained in improvised weapon activated bane on the chair and went to town with it.
I do this with my crowbar all the time.
I do this with my crowbar all the time.If you are inquisitor you can just put the bane ability on the arrows right?
I mean I've done something similiar in a campaign where we started a bar fight, I took up a chair and as I was trained in improvised weapon activated bane on the chair and went to town with it.
Sorry but improvised Weapons are NOT Weapons and cannot be imbued as weapons...
See this thread for more info... ;)Ammunition are Weapons, they can be imbued... :)
As far as I can tell the thing about temporary bonuses not applying to DR is not an actual rule but an extrapolation from the Greater Magic Fang spell and some general comments by devs.
...and some general comments by devs.
Yeah but comment from the Devs are considered RAW here, after all you can't consider arguing against the "what something is supposed to do" if the very persons in control to the rules are telling you how a rule is supposed to act for them...
That's one of the reason why I love Paizo product, Devs sometimes talk and explain themselves about RAI and if a dev do that you can consider this RAW... ;)
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...and some general comments by devs.Yeah but comment from the Devs are considered RAW here, after all you can't consider arguing against the "what something is supposed to do" if the very persons in control to the rules are telling you how a rule is supposed to act for them...
That's one of the reason why I love Paizo product, Devs sometimes talk and explain themselves about RAI and if a dev do that you can consider this RAW... ;)
No, devs comments are not RAW. They can be useful for RAI and determining how to interpret RAW, but they aren't official rules. FAQs are.
No, devs comments are not RAW. They can be useful for RAI and determining how to interpret RAW, but they aren't official rules. FAQs are....and some general comments by devs.Yeah but comment from the Devs are considered RAW here, after all you can't consider arguing against the "what something is supposed to do" if the very persons in control to the rules are telling you how a rule is supposed to act for them...
That's one of the reason why I love Paizo product, Devs sometimes talk and explain themselves about RAI and if a dev do that you can consider this RAW... ;)
In a discussion with a PFS master discussion if you can point the discussion to a Devs declaration you have 99% to got the direction of the rules going the devs way...
In homebrew who cares the GM is god, don't care of devs, don't care of rules as written... What is important is that you reach on an agreement between GM and players tou all play the same game... :p
Even FAQs are more clarifications on how discrepancies should interact, only rules addendums actually alter the rules as written. And it has to be this way, because trying to track all the places and things devs have opined upon makes an already rules heavy game impossible beyond the ultra-well read. Also, there are timing considerations - if a dev makes a comment 5 years ago, and there have been opportunities to alter or FAQ how something works, why didn't they?
Having said that, there is of course merit in understanding what an appropriate approach might be from the devs discourse.
Nope. FAQs are actually considered part of the rules, and they aren't spread out over comments in the forums. Look at the very top right corner of this page, and there is a "Help / FAQ" link. I would love it if they combined all the core product FAQs into a single page, instead of by book - as I usually don't remember off the top of my head which book a given rule came from and end up having to search through multiple FAQ pages - but it isn't terribly onerous.
Now if you go to the Ask Mark Seifter thread, his statements there are not official rules. Likewise if you find a random post in a random thread by one of the PDT, those also are not official rules. In those instances it is one member of the PDT stating how they think it works, or giving insight into why it was designed that way etc. And USUALLY those responses, if a FAQ also ever appears on the subject, are in alignment.
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As far as I can tell the thing about temporary bonuses not applying to DR is not an actual rule but an extrapolation from the Greater Magic Fang spell and some general comments by devs.FAQs are an official part of the rules.
That's specifically only about ranged weapons and doesn't even address whether temporary bonuses generally count for overcoming DR. The Inquisitor's Bane ability, the Paladin's Divine Bond and the Occultist's Legacy Weapon focus power can add temporary enhancement bonuses and/or Bane and I see absolutely no distinction in the rules between "true" and temporary enhancement bonuses.
Greater Magic Weapon specifically says that its enhancement bonus doesn't help against DR. Given that the Inquisitor ability, Divine Bond and the Occultist focus power lack that clarification, it seems pretty clear to me that Greater Magic Weapon is the exception rather than the rule and temporary enhancement bonuses (and the +2 from Bane) work just fine against DR.
This failure to overcome DR on Greater Magic Weapon is only an issue for some divine casters, and some comments above about temporary bonuses not applying are misapplying that, which incorrectly rules out lots of good options.
Versatile Weapon is the same level [or lower] for arcane casters + rangers, and it does allow bypass of one type of mundane DR (bludgeoning, cold iron, piercing, silver, or slashing) selected by the caster [and acts as GMW to bypass the exact same DR/magic]. The level 4 Bard or level 5 Wizard can likely make the knowledge checks to get the right DR bypass and cast a 2nd level bard / 3rd level wizard spell.
Greater Magic Weapon: antipaladin 3, bloodrager 3, cleric/oracle 4, inquisitor 3, magus 3, paladin 3, shaman 4, sorcerer/wizard 3. Bypass DR/magic
Versatile Weapon: bard 2, bloodrager 3, ranger 2, magus 3, sorcerer/wizard 3. Bypass one DR of type bludgeoning, cold iron, piercing, silver, or slashing, plus magic.
Bless Weapon: paladin 1. Bypass DR/evil.
If you are getting a wand, potion, or oil to bypass materials DR, Versatile Weapon is the way to go over GMW. Bless Weapon [paladin only] is pretty nice too, for a lower level, though it only works against DR/evil.
This failure to overcome DR on Greater Magic Weapon is only an issue for some divine casters, and some comments above about temporary bonuses not applying are misapplying that, which incorrectly rules out lots of good options.
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That's all fine and well (and I didn't know about Versatile Weapon, that's interesting), but we aren't really looking for advice, but specifically talking about the ability of weapons with high enhancement bonuses being able to bypass Damage Reduction, as detailed here.
For example, a level 6 Occultist infusing a +1 melee weapon with Legacy Weapon, choosing a +1 bonus and Foo-Bane would effectively have a +4 weapon against Foo. Would this bypass DR/Adamantine? I think it would since the only rule against temporary enhancement bonuses not applying to DR is specific to Greater Magic Weapon and nothing else.Versatile Weapon is the only ability I know which can bypass "weapon type" damage reduction such as Piercing, though, which is undoubtedly useful.
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Versatile Weapon is the only ability I know which can bypass "weapon type" damage reduction such as Piercing, though, which is undoubtedly useful.
There is the Weapon Versatility feat which actually lets you deal P, S, or B damage.