| amyhart420 |
So I know that this has been a topic of many conversation but I just want to see how others have dealt with this. I am trying to see how people take to dealing with the capacity of bags.
A backpack states "holds about 2 cubic feet of material". No capacity by weight is listed.
A sack states "holds 1 cubic ft. or 60 lbs. of contents full". This leads one to believe that each cubic ft is the same as 60lbs.
A belt pouch reads "hold up to 10 lb. or 1/5 cubic ft. of items". This math leads to 1 cubic ft being 50lbs not 60lbs.
A barrel states "holds 10 cubic ft. or 650 lb. of materials". The math here comes to 65lbs for 1 cubic ft.
A bucket also goes along with the barrel stating, "holds 1 cubic ft. or up to 65 lb. of liquid or material".
A basket has "holds 2 cubic ft. or 20 lbs. of material". This is the smallest amount I have found at only 10lbs for 1 cubic ft.
The Handy Haversack matches with a basket reading that the side pouches "hold material of as much as 2 cubic feet in volume or 20 pounds in weight" and the large pouch "can contain up to 8 cubic feet or 80 pounds of material".
So between all of these that leads 1 cubic ft being equal to 10lbs, 50lbs, 60lbs, and 65lbs. That leads to me wondering for items like the backpack which does not have a weight conversation. How do different people decide how much the max weight should be for these items?
| Fuzzy-Wuzzy |
I would ignore the basket's ratio, because it probably assumes baskets are relatively fragile and will fall apart if something dense is placed in them.
I would definitely ignore the handy haversack because those pouches are bags of holding and magic doesn't have to follow the same rules.
They're also probably assuming you're mostly stuffing your containers with lumpy things, not a continuous mass. That means larger containers will be more efficient. So the figures of 50:1 for belt pouches, 60:1 for sacks, and 65:1 for barrels may actually be reasonable together.
I would compare the backpack to the non-ignored item that comes closest to its capacity, which would be the sack at 1 cuft, putting the backpack at 120 lbs. That this matches to total weight capacity of a handy haversack is probably coincidence.
| Sissyl |
It is not just a matter of weight. Containers are limited by volume and weight separately. A tough, sturdy container would be high on weight but low on volume since it doesn't flex much, and vice versa for a flimsy, large container. A backpack can IRL hold some 100 lbs or so, and 2 cubic feet sounds reasonable.
| Zarius |
Frankly, with only two cubic feat, you aren't likely GETTING 100 lbs of stuff in there, unless you're tossing in raw trade ingots (I've always imagined that, instead of coins, any player SHOULD be allowed to use pound-increment bars of metal to count as fifty-coins per pound) in there. Or lead. Lead would do it, too. But, yeah, if you pack it right, I could see about a buck, buck and a quarter. Don't forget about masterwork backpacks :D
| graystone |
So between all of these that leads 1 cubic ft being equal to 10lbs, 50lbs, 60lbs, and 65lbs. That leads to me wondering for items like the backpack which does not have a weight conversation. How do different people decide how much the max weight should be for these items?
In almost every game I've been in, the solution has been to totally ignore the whole thing. Most games aren't enhanced by micromanaging weight/volume. Instead common sense is used. You list containers on your character and you can carry up to your capacity. Just don't try to say the 2000lb statue is in your belt pouch and everyone is happy.
| amyhart420 |
amyhart420 wrote:So between all of these that leads 1 cubic ft being equal to 10lbs, 50lbs, 60lbs, and 65lbs. That leads to me wondering for items like the backpack which does not have a weight conversation. How do different people decide how much the max weight should be for these items?In almost every game I've been in, the solution has been to totally ignore the whole thing. Most games aren't enhanced by micromanaging weight/volume. Instead common sense is used. You list containers on your character and you can carry up to your capacity. Just don't try to say the 2000lb statue is in your belt pouch and everyone is happy.
One of the main reasons I'm trying to get this is because we just recently had a session in which my players got held down by tentacles. Because of this they were severely limited in movement. We are getting ready to move to an updated {custom} character sheet and in it we've created a way for them to say which bags they put their items. Being able to reach your belt pouch but not your backpack can change what options you have story wise. I'm not trying to get a down to the pound range more of a general number to give them so they can better sort their items.
| amyhart420 |
I would ignore the basket's ratio, because it probably assumes baskets are relatively fragile and will fall apart if something dense is placed in them.
I would definitely ignore the handy haversack because those pouches are bags of holding and magic doesn't have to follow the same rules.
They're also probably assuming you're mostly stuffing your containers with lumpy things, not a continuous mass. That means larger containers will be more efficient. So the figures of 50:1 for belt pouches, 60:1 for sacks, and 65:1 for barrels may actually be reasonable together.
I would compare the backpack to the non-ignored item that comes closest to its capacity, which would be the sack at 1 cuft, putting the backpack at 120 lbs. That this matches to total weight capacity of a handy haversack is probably coincidence.
I really like the math that you put into this so I'm probably gonna go with something similar but I do thank-you guys for your help. I tried asking a group on facebook and got just a ton of "It doesn't matter." without any actual help into just understanding a why for the different ranges.
| Claxon |
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
One of the main reasons I'm trying to get this is because we just recently had a session in which my players got held down by tentacles. Because of this they were severely limited in movement. We are getting ready to move to an updated {custom} character sheet and in it we've created a way for them to say which bags they put their items. Being able to reach your belt pouch but not your backpack can change what options you have story wise. I'm not trying to get a down to the pound range more of a general number to give them so they can better sort their items.
I would simply treat that as the pin condition, which has it's own restrictions which basically include "You can't do anything except try to escape from the grapple".
| Dave Justus |
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Being able to reach your belt pouch but not your backpack can change what options you have story wise.
That is perhaps true, but it doesn't have anything to do with the pathfinder rules, as far as I know.
I don't believe their is any condition which would allow you to retrieve a stored item from a belt pouch, but not retrieve a stored item from a backpack. As far as the rules go, there is no difference at all between the two things.
Obviously you are free to do what you want, and have fun however you want to have fun, but it is good to understand that it is by going outside the rules in one area (having conditions limit what containers you can access) has forced you to go beyond the rules in another, more specific rules on containers and their capacity. I would suggest unless you are really sure the increased detail makes it more fun, you consider walking back your houserule of limited access to containers.
| John Mechalas |
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
I would suggest unless you are really sure the increased detail makes it more fun, you consider walking back your houserule of limited access to containers.
This. The game already has a staggering amount of detail and bookkeeping. You can add more detail to try and approach reality, but there's a point where it's just not manageable without sacrificing something more important. You can easily set up and organize something between games that turns out to be absolutely unsustainable in-play.
I've been playing the game for over 30 years, and I still have trouble remembering to mark off expended spells, used potions, and wand charges in the middle of a fast-paced battle. And those things are easy. For what you propose, every item you pick up from a looted corpse means a potential reshuffling of everything in your packs.
Game time is a precious resource for most people. Details like this are abstracted away for a reason.
| graystone |
Being able to reach your belt pouch but not your backpack can change what options you have story wise. I'm not trying to get a down to the pound range more of a general number to give them so they can better sort their items.
Like some of the others, I struggle to find something in the rules that would target just a backpack and make it inaccessible. If that floats your boat though, go for it: just know you're far into house-rule territory.
Setting that aside, I still fail to see why you'd NEED the max weights. It sounds like it's more what's where than weight. if your characters KNOW you're targeting containers to make them inaccessible, they'll most likely spread things out anyway so they most likely would never hit whatever limit you make. Is someone trying to put thousands of pounds in a backpack? If not then is it really worth figuring out if a backpack can carry 160 vs 180 vs 200? Are masterwork versions of containers able to carry more? What if they are made of stronger materials? Magically strengthened? Put in a framework to enhance it? It seems a big can of worms for little in game benefit.