OK so i have a natural attack White Hair Wich.
Basically i am trying to get as many natural attacks as i can in one full attack.
The attack i have are.
1. my White hair
2. tengu bite
3. tengu caws
4. an oni mask for a gore attack
5. cloak of manta-ray for a tail piercing attack
My real question i want to ask is that i am wanting to get a Vibrant frog hide for a tong whip attack and im not sure if it would be a primary attack or a secondary attack. will it work with my full attack build? as my sixth?
also feel free to suggest some ways i can get more attack or better attacks i can switch out with one of these. i would like a tentical attack or something lol
also i would love some suggestions on how i can boost my attack bonus or BAB because being a wich my BAB stinks. i know i can stack strength
Animal totem Tattoo (eagle) for 2 talons
Helm of the mammoth lord - another way to get a gore attack
Fleshwarped Scorpion's Tail - sting with 3/day poison
If you have a permissive GM, 2 level dip in alchemists to get vestigial arms for extra claw attacks.
For frog hide, it doesn't say a specific natural weapon so that would make it "other" and secondary.
Also, I'm not sure you can bite and use the tongue in the same round.
i don't think i can use helm of the mammoth lord if i have the oni mask because they are both gore attacks.hhmm or can i use them both.can someone answer if i can use both oni mask and mammoth lord helm?.also i already got turned down when i asked about the alchemist claws :(
dang i wanted a frog tong attack lol
tenchix wrote: also i would love some suggestions on how i can boost my attack bonus or BAB because being a wich my BAB stinks. i know i can stack strength You could cast transformation for full BAB, when you get 6th level spells. Spell perfection + quickened spell = cast transformation and full attack in the same turn.
This takes a while to set up though, and given that you're a 1/2 BAB full caster you should really be making use of your spells rather than trying to be a fighter that lacks bonus feats and weapon training... + your hit die means you're not going to last long in melee and you cant even wear armor (due to both lacking proficiency and spell failure) so you'll likely be spending most of the combat buffing yourself just to be able to survive/keep up in melee - So I'd wonder why you weren't spending this time crippling/obliterating the enemies using your full casting, given how powerful full casting is compared to the martial characters you'll be poorly imitating. I suppose the question I have to ask is why you're trying to do this, do you have a particular thing you're building around that makes this a more appealing option?
(Given the requests for suggestions and build advice, wouldn't this be better suited to the advice forum?)
cloak of the manta ray wont work as the tail attack is only when your transformed into a manta ray
I knew i would get one of these.
thank you for the sujesttions and advise. BUT i like to do stuff different and try new things. i could make a Go To Sleep witch or some other Cooky Cutter Build but that is no fun doing the exact same thing. under stand? because i can :)
besides im having fun wiping waves of minions killing them before they can touch me at low levels
tenchix wrote: I knew i would get one of these.
thank you for the sujesttions and advise. BUT i like to do stuff different and try new things. i could make a Go To Sleep witch or some other Cooky Cutter Build but that is no fun doing the exact same thing. under stand? because i can :)
besides im having fun wiping waves of minions killing them before they can touch me at low levels
Heh, I must say i've never made a cooky cutter build in my life, I usually go for more unusual flavor-based "average-ish" characters. I'm just pointing out that trying to make a D6 1/2 BAB martial character without any martial class abilities/bonus feats will probably mean you wont even be close to average unless you have something that compensates for that (Hence me asking if there's something that makes it a more appealing option).
From my experience 1/2 BAB gimmick builds that heavily invest in martial stuff at early levels then inevitably drop off in mid levels, that can then neither perform martially nor beat SR/have decent DCs are difficult for the GM to include and not fun for the rest of the party who have to drag you around everywhere. (Perhaps quite literally "drag you around" given your lack of armor & d6 HD ^^)
That being said, I certainly don't disagree with how flavorful/visually interesting your character could be, I merely see practicality as a factor to consider.
tenchix wrote: i don't think i can use helm of the mammoth lord if i have the oni mask because they are both gore attacks.hhmm or can i use them both.can someone answer if i can use both oni mask and mammoth lord helm?.also i already got turned down when i asked about the alchemist claws :(
dang i wanted a frog tong attack lol
You can not use both unless you have two heads. You can bite and gore with your head, otherwise it follows the one natural attack per appendage rule. I only mentioned the Helm as I couldn't find the Oni mask so I didn't know which would be better/cheaper etc.
The talons and sting I mentioned are both good options to try out once you have enough gold.
yes cloak does work in salt water. lady
Be sure you are grabbing:
Amulet of Mighty Fists (the +1 version is 4,000 gp, enhances all natural attacks)
Deliquescent Gloves (gives your claws the corrosive ability, and allows you strike oozes and the like with your claws). Generally gloves are in pairs unless otherwise specified, so don't worry about the singular language.
Anonymous Warrior wrote: Be sure you are grabbing:
Amulet of Mighty Fists (the +1 version is 4,000 gp, enhances all natural attacks)
Deliquescent Gloves (gives your claws the corrosive ability, and allows you strike oozes and the like with your claws). Generally gloves are in pairs unless otherwise specified, so don't worry about the singular language.
haha yah i know i want mighty fist. i dont know if i should put holy on it or fire and frost. or maybe nothing and just make it +4 :)
tenchix wrote: Gallant Armor wrote: tenchix wrote: i don't think i can use helm of the mammoth lord if i have the oni mask because they are both gore attacks.hhmm or can i use them both.can someone answer if i can use both oni mask and mammoth lord helm?.also i already got turned down when i asked about the alchemist claws :(
dang i wanted a frog tong attack lol
You can not use both unless you have two heads. You can bite and gore with your head, otherwise it follows the one natural attack per appendage rule. I only mentioned the Helm as I couldn't find the Oni mask so I didn't know which would be better/cheaper etc.
The talons and sting I mentioned are both good options to try out once you have enough gold. thank you gallant you are very helpfull. the oni mask is cheaper. 200 gold. you didnt find it because you looked in wrong place i bet. look in feats
glad someone wants to chat and not talk down to me for wanting to have some fun and not go cookie cutter ;) I found the feat, I prefer the helm, but the mask would be good at lower levels.
I try to avoid being too cookie cutter myself, but it's important to balance that with reasonable choices. If you are planning on taking this build past low level, it might not be as effective as you hope. I have played with a White Haired Witch who was frustrated that they could never successfully pull off combat maneuvers. The low BAB really hurts after a while.
You could go with a Shaman or Alchemist, either has some good options for natural attack builds.
Also, please keep things civil, there was no reason to be rude to
tenchix. If you ask for advice you can't act angry just because someone suggests something you don't agree with.
tenchix wrote: yes cloak does work in salt water. lady yes but only when transformed into a ray which means you lose all other natural attacks
Lady-J wrote: tenchix wrote: yes cloak does work in salt water. lady yes but only when transformed into a ray which means you lose all other natural attacks did i say otherwise? i dont think i did
tenchix wrote: Lady-J wrote: tenchix wrote: yes cloak does work in salt water. lady yes but only when transformed into a ray which means you lose all other natural attacks did i say otherwise? i dont think i did the way you said it made it seem so yes
Lady-J wrote: tenchix wrote: Lady-J wrote: tenchix wrote: yes cloak does work in salt water. lady yes but only when transformed into a ray which means you lose all other natural attacks did i say otherwise? i dont think i did the way you said it made it seem so yes really!?!?
tenchix wrote: Lady-J wrote: tenchix wrote: Lady-J wrote: tenchix wrote: yes cloak does work in salt water. lady yes but only when transformed into a ray which means you lose all other natural attacks did i say otherwise? i dont think i did the way you said it made it seem so yes really!?!? based on what my comment was yes
cloak of the manta ray wont work as the tail attack is only when your transformed into a manta ray
yes cloak does work in salt water. lady
yes you said that. why are you repeating yourself??? yes cloak does work in salt water
tenchix wrote: yes you said that. why are you repeating yourself??? yes cloak does work in salt water you are missing the point of my previous post i was trying to show you how your answer to what i had said made it seem like the cloak worked in a way in which it does not so long as it was in salt water then i explained how it worked with my wording based on what you had replied. you then said that is what you said which it wasn't and i replied that it didn't seem that way and you asked really so i replied with the quotes of our initial statements
@Lady-J: I get what you're saying, but I fear you are incorrect, as the Cloak seems to have a Specific rule to beat General. To be specific, the lines of the second paragraph that state "The cloak does allow the wearer to attack with a manta ray‘s tail spine, dealing 1d6 points of damage. This attack can be used in addition to any other attack the character has, using his highest melee attack bonus." This would, as I read it anyways, imply that the General rule of Polymorphs (in this case the Beast Shape 2 that the cloak applies) replacing Natural Attacks is overwritten.
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Shinigami02 wrote: @Lady-J: I get what you're saying, but I fear you are incorrect, as the Cloak seems to have a Specific rule to beat General. To be specific, the lines of the second paragraph that state "The cloak does allow the wearer to attack with a manta ray‘s tail spine, dealing 1d6 points of damage. This attack can be used in addition to any other attack the character has, using his highest melee attack bonus." This would, as I read it anyways, imply that the General rule of Polymorphs (in this case the Beast Shape 2 that the cloak applies) replacing Natural Attacks is overwritten. i read it as you can use the tail to attack while in the beast shape forum as the damage for a medium manta ray tail attack would be 1d4 not 1d6 and the cloak sites 1d6 thus inferring that its an attack to be used during the beast forum 2 and not usable while in humanoid forum. maybe we could faq to see what the devs intended?
Lady-J wrote: Shinigami02 wrote: @Lady-J: I get what you're saying, but I fear you are incorrect, as the Cloak seems to have a Specific rule to beat General. To be specific, the lines of the second paragraph that state "The cloak does allow the wearer to attack with a manta ray‘s tail spine, dealing 1d6 points of damage. This attack can be used in addition to any other attack the character has, using his highest melee attack bonus." This would, as I read it anyways, imply that the General rule of Polymorphs (in this case the Beast Shape 2 that the cloak applies) replacing Natural Attacks is overwritten. i read it as you can use the tail to attack while in the beast shape forum as the damage for a medium manta ray tail attack would be 1d4 not 1d6 and the cloak sites 1d6 thus inferring that its an attack to be used during the beast forum 2 and not usable while in humanoid forum. maybe we could faq to see what the devs intended? let me know how that turns out
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tenchix wrote: OK so i have a natural attack White Hair Wich.
Basically i am trying to get as many natural attacks as i can in one full attack.
The attack i have are.
1. my White hair
2. tengu bite
3. tengu caws
4. an oni mask for a gore attack
5. cloak of manta-ray for a tail piercing attack
My real question i want to ask is that i am wanting to get a Vibrant frog hide for a tong whip attack and im not sure if it would be a primary attack or a secondary attack. will it work with my full attack build? as my sixth?
also feel free to suggest some ways i can get more attack or better attacks i can switch out with one of these. i would like a tentical attack or something lol
Is this for PFS?
tenchix wrote: i would like a tentical attack There is a Tentacle Cloak: it gives 2 tentacle attacks.
You could dip 2 levels in Alchemist and grow an Alchemal Tentacle. You have to use your regular attacks for an Alchemal Tentacle as if you were using a longsword or something. But since you probably aren't using those attack slots anyway, since combining manufactured weapons with the same Full Attack as your Natural Weapons demotes your Primary Natural Attacks to Secondary, you probably aren't using those attack slots anyway.
tenchix wrote: or something lol If you Polymorphed into a creature with a Slam Attack, then drank a Feral Mutagen, you would gain 2 Claws and a Bite. Your Oni would still give you a Gore; you could still wear a Tentacle Cloak, and the Eagle Totem could still give you your Talons! You'd be quite the monstrosity.
Rather than a Cloak of the Manta Ray, perhaps a Fleshwarped Whip? You can graft it onto yourself and give yourself a Tail Attack, and it won't interfere with your other attacks like the 'Manta' cloak does.
tenchix wrote: also feel free to suggest some ways i can get more attack or better attacks Your 'Hair gives you a Free Grapple with every hit. Wear Armor Spikes: an extra 1d6 + Bonuses for every hit. Take Hamatula Strike. Every attack you make with a Piercing Weapon--Gore and Bite--will give you a Free Grapple Attack, so more Armor Spike Damage.
Take a level in Monk or Brawler. Add Unarmed Strikes to your Full Attack. Take 2 weapon. Take Snake Style. Your Unarmed Strikes will do Piercing Damage and will benefit from the Hamatula Strike thing.
Take Feral Combat Traininng for your Claws, your Talons, your Slam, and your Tail whip. Then you apply Hamatuala Strike to all those, and you just doubled your attacks.
tenchix wrote: also i would love some suggestions on how i can boost my attack bonus or BAB because being a wich my BAB stinks. i know i can stack strength Well my first thought is to take only 1 level in White Haired Witch and make most of my levels in something else like Warpriest. The nice thing about Warpriest is that you can take Weapon Focus for all your Natural Weapons and do your Warpriest Sacred Weapon Damage instead of your regular damage. Take Improved Natural Attack and all those attacks do damage as if you were one size bigger. Dip a level in Ranger or Druid, and you might acquire a Wand of Strong Jaw: 2 sizes instead of 1.
A friend of mine suggested the Eldritch Heritage Feat. Take the Orc Bloodline, and as a Standard Action you can give yourself a significant buff to your Attack and damage for the next round
Scott Wilhelm wrote: tenchix wrote: OK so i have a natural attack White Hair Wich.
Basically i am trying to get as many natural attacks as i can in one full attack.
The attack i have are.
1. my White hair
2. tengu bite
3. tengu caws
4. an oni mask for a gore attack
5. cloak of manta-ray for a tail piercing attack
My real question i want to ask is that i am wanting to get a Vibrant frog hide for a tong whip attack and im not sure if it would be a primary attack or a secondary attack. will it work with my full attack build? as my sixth?
also feel free to suggest some ways i can get more attack or better attacks i can switch out with one of these. i would like a tentical attack or something lol
Is this for PFS? Yes it is. WHY?
tenchix wrote: Scott Wilhelm wrote:
Is this for PFS?
Yes it is. WHY? It's important, if it's for PFS you always should make it clear from the start 'cause, for example, we can't advise you to try to ask your GM to authorize Medusa's Lock from the Advanced Options Witches, a Hex that solve the issue with White Haired witch attack being underpowered... ;)
Scott Wilhelm wrote: tenchix wrote: i would like a tentical attack There is a Tentacle Cloak: it gives 2 tentacle attacks.
You could dip 2 levels in Alchemist and grow an Alchemal Tentacle. You have to use your regular attacks for an Alchemal Tentacle as if you were using a longsword or something. But since you probably aren't using those attack slots anyway, since combining manufactured weapons with the same Full Attack as your Natural Weapons demotes your Primary Natural Attacks to Secondary, you probably aren't using those attack slots anyway
hmm it is for 1 round so i think i will skip this one sadly lol. i need the money. this build is expensive haha. my society group only plays level 1-12. but i will keep this in mind after i get my bab up
you have ben the most fun and helpful prson in this thread :)
I have thought of this but i keep hearing from people that i can not take a feat from the bestiary :( otherwise i would have done this already
i am going to be so monstrously ugly i think my opponents should be blinded and sickened for just looking at me HAHAHA
i dont think i can weapon focus all of my natural attacks. i think i have to use a feat on each attack
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