Hello folks,
I'm working on a new character for a campaign that should start in a few weeks. It's going to be a small party (three or four people), so role flexibility will be good. I know one of them will be a fairly traditional monk, but it's otherwise as of yet unclear what people want to play.
Now, regarding campaign information, I know we'll be doing quite a bit of wilderness and social stuff, since we'll be busy gettting a colony off the ground. This suits me, since I enjoy utility characters.
So, here's my ideas - and the issues I run into.
1. I play far too many Inquisitors. It's my favourite class by a decent margin (although this is in good part because paladins are crippled in the skills department). Something different would be good.
2. As mentioned, I enjoy utility characters, and this should fit the campaign very well. It seems that divine casters will have a significant role in the campaign, and this also suits me well.
3. I am not a fan of bad action economy classes. Were it not for this, I'd probably love Oracles more. [Reach life oracles aren't too bad, of course.] The errata to Divine Protection hurt them badly, as well, even if it was frankly necessary.
4. I've got a fancy to play a swashbuckler-themed character. A one-level dip of the actual Swashbuckler class, possibly with the Inspired Blade archetype, is likely a decent option. I've thought about a straight dex Magus (possibly Bladebound), but I'd like access to condition removal spells, and we will NOT be using traits - so UMD is going to be a problem on that chassis. Besides, I'm not sure how our wealth will look, but I suspect it's less than usual, so depending on consumables for status removal and healing may not be a good plan.
5. Bard is a lovely class in concept, but they give up a lot to become acceptable front line combatants. They do cover access to healing (if wealth allows for wands), buffs, skill utility and so forth rather well. I'm keeping an open mind on playing one.
6. I have permission to use the Evangelist prestige class, which opens up a lot of classes for skill utility, once I'm past the early levels.
7. I've never played a War Priest, but they seem to be a bit like an Inquisitor-minus at first sight. Fervour will be used for too many things I'm afraid, so access to Channel may not be so easy if you need it for fast buffing, too. Lovely amount of bonus feats, though.
8. Paladins, once you ignore the skill issues, are a wonderful class for roleplaying purposes; I'm quite fond of them. But enemies may not be evil (most animals and many monsters are not), and Detect Evil has been houseruled to only work on outsiders and creatures with a divine aura (such as clerics). This impacts Inquisitor a little as well, but at least they aren't reliant on smite. I feel they are too restricted in how they operate for mechanical reasons as a result.
There's a houserule in paladins' favour, as well - they are not restricted to LG, but to the exact alighment as their deity. This will adjust their Detect Evil and Smite abilities as one might expect.
Having said that, I don't mind a slice of paladin flavour, but that can be done with RP on a very different chassis.
9. I dislike weak defences. Decent saves, AC and a non-crippling health pool are very welcome, as are self-heals. [It's what piqued my interest in War Priest.]
Am I overlooking options? Shaman doesn't strike me as the right flavour at all (I'm looking at something a bit more cosmopolitan, and spirits wouldn't be his thing), although a Ranger might work, I suppose. Their spells aren't much good for keeping the party trucking, though, and UMD isn't in their wheel house, either.
I'm not looking to optimize hard, to but enjoy being able to contribute in more than one way, especially in the non-combat arena. Suggestions very welcome!
Investigator or Alchemist works very well with an inpired blade swashbuckler dip. They can do a little healing, are pretty good with skills (especially an empiricist investigator) and have plenty of utility.
Slayer is pretty nice. Quite versatile and loved. Full BAB, HD, fighting ability, talents, etc. Archetypes help out too.
Divine casters with swashbuckler theme, utility casting, and good action economy?
Specific Mysteries that might help your goal include Battle for better initiative, pseudopounce, debuff prevention, weapon feats, and a bit of maneuver dabbling, and Metal for better fort saves, curse negation (or simply better move speeds), weapon buffs, and a few utility powers (vision in iron and rusting grasp have some fun utility).
Warsighted oracle archetype may also work well for improving action economy (giving you ways to spend move and swift actions flexibly and efficiently).
Raging Song eventually becomes a quick buff which helps the whole party. The urban skald archetype might help with a swashbuckler theme (dex bonus). For thematic apreciation, you could say you are using perform oratory or comedy for quick-witted words with foes or inspiring talks of heroism. You get some good condition removal like curses and fear, and spell kenning picks up the rest, albeit slowly.
The real beauty here however is the rage powers. The Celestial Totem powers are among my favorites for giving you (eventually) lots of healing (combo with Path of Glory and lingering performance, and greater skald's vigor), free elimination of pesky deeper darkness and invisibility problems, and selective SR to help combat enemy mages. Beast totem is also pretty great, but seems less thematic.
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One other idea. A hunter with the courtly hunter archetype has that swashbuckler theme without dipping, gets some healing from the druid & ranger lists (delay poison at level 1 for example), and has excellent action economy with their fancy animal companion/familiar giving them a second set of actions.
Going to cover all your suggestions quickly, before I go back to browsing my books for more options. :)
Ranger's not a bad call, and I like how they work. Skipping prerequisites is always nice, and the Witch Guard archetype could open up options for more social work, too.
Not so sure about Slayer. I've played one before, but giving up spellcasting means you need to invest in UMD to use wands, which is a bother. The flavour is also a little off. I mean, there's the rogue-with-a-good heart approach, but the class as a whole, and all the archetypes minus the Vanguard, are still killers first and foremost. I'm not really looking for something that grimdark. :)
The investigator might work, I suppose, although they aren't much divine in flavour. It could be made to work, perhaps.
The Alchemist is neither divine nor really related at all to swashbucklers. I'll admit that both are very functional classes, but I'm not a huge fan of totally wiping off the labels and pretending it's all about mechanics.
Battle Oracle is an option, I'll admit. Saves will be a problem, but with or without one level dip, they can fill the divine caster role just fine, once they get to second-level spells (for lesser restoration and a plethora of others). As a full caster, it's probably the strongest option in the very long run, although I'll definitely be forced to segue into Evangelist, just to improve my skill options. That's not bad, though, and fits the flavour.
I'd love to make an Oradin swashbuckler work, but I'm afraid that the feat requirements would be problematic. Spells would also come online rather late. Dropping the paladin from the equation, for Swashbuckler 1 / Life oracle X, is an option perhaps. They lack the fancy toys of the Battle oracle, but gain much of it back from the dip, and they have some action economy from Life Link and riposte. Tempting idea.
Flavour-wise, I love the Courtly Hunter, and they have some pretty decent options for non-combat skills through their animal focus. Not a fan of the druid spell list, I'll be honest, but Ranger adds to it, so that helps. Now I just need a way to make a songbird or something of the kind function as a flanking buddy without too much snickering! [I'm thinking of playing a follower of Sune, from the Forgotten Realms, and song birds are sacred to her - as they are to Shelyn in Golarion.]
Granted, the Hunter might get a bit MAD, with a demand on dex, wis and cha for sure, and only Str as a possible score to somewhat dump. THat's not unique to it, though - Oracle has that to an extend, since you're never likely to dump wisdom much. And Hunter has better saves. Hmmm.
Re Investigator, the lamplighter investigator archetype looks divine if you squint slightly.
At 2nd level a courtly hunter can transform their companion into a 'similar Tiny animal'. No duration or limit per day is mentioned. If you start with a Bird (or even Roc) animal companion it can flank while in the full-size form and be a songbird when Tiny.
The courtly hunter doesn't need much Cha. You might want some to use social skills (especially intimidate from their Frilled Lizard animal focus), but you could just have 10 or so. Maybe 12 if the flavour of being more charismatic than average is wanted.
I have answers for you but I must ask one question before I type them....
Do you want to be badass or be a good role-player (who doesn't suck of course)? If you want to say both I want you to prioritize for me please.
Badass seems to imply a combat focus, which does not interest me. I want to be able to contribute in combat situations - being able to lead the line would be nice, but optimizing for combat seems senseless to me, when I expect that combat challenges are going to be a relatively small time expenditure in our campaign.
Having said that, I'm not silly enough, for instance, to go for Finesse without Fencing Grace, but I *am* silly enough to want light armour at most - to keep the swashbuckler feel alive, not to mention the ethos of Sune.
As it stands, I'm looking at some classes I had initially dismissed in a different light, with the Evangelist prestige class available. It really opens up a lot of 3/4, low-skill BAB classes. Paladin's still hosed (smite is pretty limiting, if devastating when it works, and Evangelist would sacrifice the Paladin's BAB), but warpriest starts to look good. Wish I could trade out some of that armour without being tied into unarmed fighting!
I play far too many Inquisitors.
i understand those words but the sentence makes no sense
Look into erastil evangelist PRC from a hunter or druid perspective in an a wilderness themed campaign...
But Erastil isn't at all what I am interested in, and fits the theme badly.
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Have you looked at the Occultist class from Occult Adventures? It's psychic, not divine, and gets its flavor from drawing the power out of items with some sort of history, which is interesting, but maybe not what you're looking for.
The class can take a little work to wrap your head around, but the spell list and focus powers can cover pretty much any role you choose to specialize in, depending on how you build your PC. If you want healing and condition removal, take the Conjuration school early. If you want buffs to share with the party, go with Transmutation and Abjuration. If you want swift action self buffs (usable on attack rolls or skills), they're in Divination, along with some great utility powers (darkvision and See Invisibility at all times by level 7!).
And with d8 HD, 3/4 BAB, martial weapons and medium armor, you can be a pretty good support combatant even without a heavy investment in feats or other resources. Or you can invest everything in combat and just about keep up with the barbarian.
Edit: Almost forgot to mention, since you like skills, that occultist gets 4 + int per level on an int based caster, so you'll have plenty.
Thank you, Fromper. Although totally different from anything I might have had in mind, that seems a creative and novel approach to my question, and a very valid suggestion. It would require a significant rethink to get the flavour on board, but I like the idea. Appreciated!
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I've been looking through the occult classes a lot lately, trying to decide on my next PFS PC, and I ended up deciding that the occultist looks like the best of the bunch. More than any other class in the game, it looks like it can fill ANY possible role - you just have to decide up front what role(s) you're trying to fill and build appropriately.
Occultist immediately sprang to mind for me as well. Check out this article from the Dice Decide if you'd like a little help wrapping your mind around the class.
Tourtured Soul Paladin gets 4 skills per level and are wis based. No divine grace though.
Investigators are awesome.
There's the Divine spiritualist, Divine Occultist as options for occult with divine casting
The medium class with the champion spirit makes for a good fighter that has some spells and stuff.