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Greetings all,
I have a Grippli Umbral Summoner (Mesmerist) planned for PFS.
Stat-wise, so far-
6 Str/16 Dex/13 Con/13 Int/13 Wis/16 Con
With this classes ability to Summon Monster at will, I plan on having those fight enemies while he focus on spell casting [even with Diminished Spellcasting].
What would be some good feats to support this build?
I'm thinking early Dodge/Low Profile for survivability, but would Spell Focus [Conjuration] or Expanded Summon Monster help at all?
what route is recommended for this pseudo-summon focused character?
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A Wayang does sound flavorfully better, but i do want to keep this as a Grippli.
A black/purple/indigo frog clinging to the ceiling, spitting out shadow monsters sounds like a neat idea.
also, with the limited mesmerist spell list and the Diminished Spellcasting of the archetype, there aren't many Illusion (Shadow) spells to benefit from the Wayang's ability.
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I dunno...It seems like kind of a weak archetype to me. You are a 2/3rd level caster who is focusing on summoning weak creatures that have the further disadvantage that they aren't even fully real.
I think either unchained summoner (if you want to focus on the summoning) or enigma (if you want to focus on the invisible part) both seem like better options.
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there aren't many Illusion (Shadow) spells to benefit from the Wayang's abilityGood point. In general, a gnome would be better all-around since Gnome Magic applies to all the Mesmerist's Illusion spells, not just Shadow. Doesn't help your Grippli tho.
I already have two gnomes- one's a sorcerer of the fey bloodline that is more an enchantment based caster, the other is a "Desnan buzzsaw" Warpriest/U.Rogue. I like to vary my roster, it's not interesting to run a full roster of humans.
I agree Umbral Mesmerist isn't a stand out archetype but I don't see it as weaker than a standard Mesmerist. It lets you be a Shadow Conjurer from 1st level and is better for a Mesmerist than Shadow Conjuration for summons. You give up a spell slot each level (6 total) for 3+cha max level slots for a fixed spell. The slower scaling summons kinda sucks but you're still a fully functional mesmerist just w/ a smaller selection of Mesmerist Tricks.
A Shadow mystery Oracle might be an interesting option for a summoning focused Oracle. Army of Darkness gives the option to add the Shadow Creature template to your summons and counts as SF: Conjuration for Augment Summons and it's dependant feats. Or go the Shadow Conjuration/GreaterSC/Shades route w/ Dark Secrets + Shadow Mastery + Solid Shadows.
again, for variation, i already have a Spiritualist. with all the classes out there, i'd like to try something else.
one thing i like about the Umbral Mesmerist is- he can create an army of shadow summons independent of his spell slots. i still have my army, and my utility of spell casting, and they last longer.With classes that utilize Conjuration eventually run out of spell slots to summon.
I know there are "better ways" to create a summoning oriented character [and i'll look into the Shadow Oracle], but for now- lets run with this idea.
one thing i like about the Umbral Mesmerist is- he can create an army of shadow summons independent of his spell slots. i still have my army, and my utility of spell casting, and they last longer.
With classes that utilize Conjuration eventually run out of spell slots to summon.I know there are "better ways" to create a summoning oriented character [and i'll look into the Shadow Oracle], but for now- lets run with this idea.
I'm not sure where your getting army from. It has the usual clause of "only one spell may be active at a time". You also have one of the worst progressions of this ability I have ever seen, normally the 6th casting versions bump it every 3 levels, this is 4.
You also seem to be wording this as if the ability is unlimited, perhaps you just mean you have a lot of uses at 3+charisma. An unchained summoner gets the same with the real thing and the best kind of progression if it's the army summoning.
Also look for the Bard Shadow Puppeter Archetype, it gets better progression with a very similar ability, can eventually activate it as a move.
If your sticking with this I would advise you to avoid spell focus conjuration and augment summoning, I think they may work but normal summons have enough problems to hit as it i.
There's no real route or advise to give on this one, all your summons can really do is possibly get in the way or provide flanking and that becomes less of a thing as opponents start deciding to ignore them.
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I know what the archetype does.
The whole thing with playing unchained summoner, is "why bother summoning monsters, when you have your eidolon?"
also, not very impressed with the Summoner's spell list.
The Shadow Puppetteer is Wayang only. I'm considering making this a Grippli.
How about we don't think of this archetype as "summoner with mesmerist spells" but Mesmerist with the utility to summon?
How about we don't think of this archetype as "summoner with mesmerist spells" but Mesmerist with the utility to summon?
That's actually how I'm thinking of it.
It's just you came to this thread asking for what advice to give to help support it and the simple answer is you don't support it.
It's not on this level of bad, this is just an example of intent, say a player comes along and wanted to make a build around ray of frost, the 0 level spell using his spell slots to metamagic it, magic lineage, spell mastery, you can help them but your still helping them make a bad character.
In your case augment summoning seems to work, superior summoning for more bodies, but these are resources you are putting towards amping this that do not benefit you as a now neutered casting Mesmerist.
If you are going to use this then take superior summoning so you can drop more blockers.
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It's just you came to this thread asking for what advice to give to help support it and the simple answer is you don't support it.
Have you even read the OP?
With this classes ability to Summon Monster at will, I plan on having those fight enemies while he focus on spell casting [even with Diminished Spellcasting].What would be some good feats to support this build?
what route is recommended for this pseudo-summon focused character?
I never said I wanted to rely on the summons aspect, just some advice on supporting the summoning aspect of the archetype.
yes, i know that these summons are chronically weaker than other classes that do the same damn thing. If they end up just running interference, that's fine.Summoners have an underwhelming spell list and rely more heavily on their Eidolons; the Occultist (Arcanist) spends their arcane pool to summon; other casters expend spell slots to summon; shadow puppeteer is race-restricted; blah blah blah <insert list of 'classes better suited to summon'>...
I like the aspect of the Mesmerist trying to trick his foes into believing his shadow summons exist. Compel Hostility/Lock Gaze while i'm ten feet up a wall, and my shadow monster gets some hits in- could be entertaining.
This build is still in the planning phase, i have not even make this character. i could go with my crazy Brawler/Toxitician/Sandman build; or Cavalier/Inquisitor "Teamwork happy" build. Why? because i can.
I'm looking for advice on possible builds to make this idea plausible.
A Mesmerist with the ability to summon. What can i do?
It's just you came to this thread asking for what advice to give to help support it and the simple answer is you don't support it.Have you even read the OP?
Yes and as I've already pointed out all you can really use it for is chump blockers.
There is no real recommendations for this beyond that, you just TRY and build a normal Mesmerist and add that if you want.
To be clear I would not go beyond that, never take expanded, evolved or any feat or item that augments your summons.
You can do whatever you want and where free to point out that it's a real stinker of an archetype.