Monk style feats


Rules Questions


I'm currently playing a Dwarf monk and thought I might pick up the Master of Many Styles archetype. My question is, what constitutes a "Style Feat". I was thinking it would just be stuff like Boar Style, Tiger Style, etc. But the Masterwork Tools I use most list Boar Shred and Boar Ferocity as style feats also. Is this an error or are they considered style feats? If they are style feats, then what about Dragon Roar and Snapping Turtle Shell?


Any feat that says Style and any feat with Style feats as a Preq.


They're all style feats. Boar Shred and Boar Ferocity are progressions from Boar Style.

You can read more about them here: Style Feats


Both the above posters are incorrect. It is Paizo editing standard to make ONLY the first feat in the line a Style feat.

The rest are NOT Style feats, only feats with a Style feat as their prerequisite. This is quite sensical if you think about it, because otherwise, you couldn't have more than one of them active.

Evidence:

Quote:
At 2nd level, a bloody-knuckled rowdy gains a bonus feat. This bonus feat must be a style feat or a feat with a style feat as a prerequisite. The bloody-knuckled rowdy treats his bloodrager levels as monk levels when qualifying for and calculating the effects of style feats and feats that have style feats as prerequisites.

Note how STYLE FEATS and FEATS WITH A STYLE FEAT AS A PREREQUISITE are two different things.


Secret Wizard wrote:

Both the above posters are incorrect. It is Paizo editing standard to make ONLY the first feat in the line a Style feat.

The rest are NOT Style feats, only feats with a Style feat as their prerequisite. This is quite sensical if you think about it, because otherwise, you couldn't have more than one of them active.

Evidence:

Quote:
At 2nd level, a bloody-knuckled rowdy gains a bonus feat. This bonus feat must be a style feat or a feat with a style feat as a prerequisite. The bloody-knuckled rowdy treats his bloodrager levels as monk levels when qualifying for and calculating the effects of style feats and feats that have style feats as prerequisites.
Note how STYLE FEATS and FEATS WITH A STYLE FEAT AS A PREREQUISITE are two different things.

Technically, they were the same, but this was errated.

Read how the new rewrote Master of Many Style is written.
" 1st level, 2nd level, and every four levels thereafter, a master of many styles may select a bonus style feat or the Elemental Fist feat. He does not need to meet the prerequisites of that feat, except the Elemental Fist feat. Starting at 6th level, a master of many styles can choose to instead gain a wildcard style slot. Whenever he enters one or more styles, he can spend his wildcard style slots to gain feats in those styles’ feat paths (such as Earth Child Topple) as long as he meets the prerequisites. Each time he changes styles, he can also change these wildcard style slots."

Prior to this, the style feats included all feats with Style as a Preq.

And the above poster is wrong.
You can have the benefits of multiple styles.
But you can't enter more than 1 style usually.

I forgot they changed the rules.


Incorrect again.

This is the pre-errata MOMS:

"Bonus Feat: At 1st level, 2nd level, and every four levels thereafter, a master of many styles may select a bonus style feat or the Elemental Fist feat. He does not have to meet the prerequisites of that feat, except the Elemental Fist feat. Alternatively, a master of many styles may choose a feat in that style’s feat path (such as Earth Child Topple) as one of these bonus feats if he already has the appropriate style feat (such as Earth Child Style). The master of many styles does not need to meet any other prerequisite of the feat in the style’s feat path."

Again, still not Style feats.


Secret Wizard, while Technically you are correct the odds are that for the purpose of what the OP was asking your point probably isn't actually useful. Especially if you keep in mind that they might not be working of the latest errata.

It would probably help us answer the OP if the point was clarified.
Are you asking what constitutes feats that the the Master of Many Styles can take as his bonus feat.


If he is referring to the MOMS, my clarification is perfectly correct.

You either take a Style feat (i.e. XXX Style) or a wildcard feat. There's really no point in taking an actual feat with a style feat as a prerequisite over a wildcard feat.

Scarab Sages

To be fair, the books list the path feats under the heading of style feats


burkoJames wrote:
To be fair, the books list the path feats under the heading of style feats

Incorrect. (See picture)

This is because the MECHANIC of Style feats is that:
1. They take a swift action to activate.
2. Only one style feat can be active simultaneously.

If the path feats were Style feats, they'd also be subject to those rules.

It helps I've played MTG which is rules heavy like this, but the editing/rules-management purpose is clear.


Secret Wizard is technically correct. The best kind of correct.

There are exceptions to "feats in a style feat's path are not style feats" but to the best of my knowledge those are mistakes, not intentional. Wolf Trip is the specific one I know of. Otherwise a Style feat is anything with the Style tag, which should only be the first feat in the chain (the style). It's just a tag, like Combat or Metamagic.


Bob Bob Bob wrote:
Secret Wizard is technically correct. The best kind of correct.

Gotta make a Perfect Scholar monk with a ton of points in acrobatics and a Jamaican accent now.

Scarab Sages

Secret Wizard wrote:
burkoJames wrote:
To be fair, the books list the path feats under the heading of style feats

Incorrect. (See picture)

This is because the MECHANIC of Style feats is that:
1. They take a swift action to activate.
2. Only one style feat can be active simultaneously.

If the path feats were Style feats, they'd also be subject to those rules.

It helps I've played MTG which is rules heavy like this, but the editing/rules-management purpose is clear.

I guess my point about the table headings just went over your head then?


Table headings are just for organization. What makes something a Style feat is the subtype on the parenthesis.


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Secret Wizard wrote:

Both the above posters are incorrect. It is Paizo editing standard to make ONLY the first feat in the line a Style feat.

The rest are NOT Style feats, only feats with a Style feat as their prerequisite. This is quite sensical if you think about it, because otherwise, you couldn't have more than one of them active.

Evidence:

Quote:
At 2nd level, a bloody-knuckled rowdy gains a bonus feat. This bonus feat must be a style feat or a feat with a style feat as a prerequisite. The bloody-knuckled rowdy treats his bloodrager levels as monk levels when qualifying for and calculating the effects of style feats and feats that have style feats as prerequisites.
Note how STYLE FEATS and FEATS WITH A STYLE FEAT AS A PREREQUISITE are two different things.

This is mostly true.

Inner sea combat released some wierd styles, i will list one example below and show that all three in the branch are style. All of them from that book are like that.

Perfect Style (Combat, Style)
Prerequisites: Wis 13, base attack bonus +5 or monk level 5th.

Unblinking Flame Feint (Combat, Style)
Prerequisites: Int 13, Wis 13, Combat Expertise, Perfect
Style, base attack bonus +9 or monk level 9th.

Unblinking Flame Fist (Combat, Style)

Prerequisites: Int 13, Wis 13, Combat Expertise, Perfect
Style, Stunning Fist, Unblinking Flame Feint, base attack
bonus +13 or monk level 13th.


Yeah, whenever they've done something like that, they've gone to errata it afterwards.

For example, from the PFS Campaign Clarifications document:

Quote:
Page 15—The Kitsune Tricks and Kitsune’s Vengeance feats are not style feats. The Kitsune Style feat allows a PC to attempt only one dirty trick combat maneuver, even if he would have additional attacks on a charge from pounce or similar abilities.

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

Most of this is when the author of the style feats chain doesn't realize the style feats are the first ones and the others in the path are not style feats. Then it slips by the editors.


In the Masterwork Tools app that I use when I'm playing, it lists Boar Shred and Boar Ferocity as style feats under the Style Feats tab. That's where my question about whether or not it's a mistake came from.

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

The tool is wrong.


Well, it's wrong.

Boar Style wrote:
Boar Style (Combat, Style)
Boar Shred wrote:
Boar Shred (Combat)
Boar Ferocity wrote:
Boar Ferocity (Combat)

Straight from the horse's mouth.


Alright thank you for the final word.

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