So basically I am trying to figure out the class to use for an intelligence based battle. I plan on using Kirin Style as well as feats its a prerequisit for to gian bonuses against my opponents using my intelligence. However I am stumped one what class (preferably not wizard) to use for the rest of this. I was thinking possibly a mutigenic brawler or just plain alchemist as a well timed mutagen or cognatogen could help. I then wondered onto investigator, and decided i would get some other players opinions.
If 3PP is allowed the Warder is basically designed to be an option for melee characters who have high intelligence. For Paizo classes, if you don't like spellcasting there's not a whole lot you can do with intelligence.
Fluff-wise, Kirin style would make a lot of sense for an Esoteric Magus, effectively an a arcane monk.
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Alchemist
Investigator (<- works well with Kirin style as well, especially empiricist, literally best knowledge class in the game)
Magus (esp. Kensai due to int-to-AC benefit)
If 3rd party, Warder is probably best though. It has a maneuvers system based on intelligence, along with some other nice int-based benefits and an ability (armiger's mark) that helps force foes to focus on them. They also have a nice archetype (Dervish Defender) that gives int-to-AC the same way Monk does, but it allows light armor and bucklers, making it much more convenient to use.
Student of War is also a nice full BAB prestige class with some int-based benefits, including swapping your dex for intelligence for AC. Use another full BAB class as lead-in and you're g2g. Not slayer, though. It's studied combat ability and the SoW key ability conflict on actions (both are move/swift depending on level).
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Investigator is brilliant and wonderful for Int-focused melee. I recommend it 110%, especially Empiricist with the Student of Philosophy Trait (as mentioned earlier). Inspired Blade Swashbuckler is indeed the one level dip for making this Dex-based, as well.
Occultist, Alchemist, and Magus are also all mechanically sound possibilities, but not quite as fun IMO.
In all cases, I'd consider very carefully whether you really want Kirin Style. It's not terrible, but almost all the Classes mentioned above (and indeed, Int-based classes in general) have very tight Swift Action economies, which makes actually using it something that happens very rarely unless you have a round to prep beforehand, and even then you'll only get it on one enemy. And it's 2 Feats for conditional +2 bonuses on Saves and half of Mobility...that's just not all that great. Picking up Great Fortitude and Iron Will would be better most of the time.
Kirin Strike is a little better, but only applies to one attack and runs into an even worse action economy problem. Kirin Path is definitely better by quite a bit (though still situational) but by that point, we're talking 4 Feats of investment.
An Investigator's Studied Combat provides a lot of the same flavor as Kirin Style while providing a significantly greater bonus and coming baked into the Class. I'd just stick with that.
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Don't use Kirin Style, it's a trap. By the time you actually have the damage bonus set up whatever you were fighting will be dead.
That being said, there are a lot of very good choices for making an int-based martial. Besides what's already been said, strength-based Fighters can qualify for TWF feats easily if you boost intelligence thanks to Artful Dodge. Though if you really want your intelligence to be a significant factor in your playstyle I think the Occultist is definitely the best choice for you.
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Everything above very much so, and also -
Just one level of Wizard will gain access to Knowledge is Power. Along with a couple possible School Powers like Shift from Teleportation or Prescience from Foresight. Actually casting any spells is totally unnecessary, though True Strike doesn't care about armor so it's an easy way to fill 1-slots. The entire rest of the character can be pure martial if so desired.
Of course, it's possible to make a Wizard/ Eldritch Knight with Divine Favor as a regular spell through Spell Sage and Preferred Spell, so there's that.
Contributor
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Everything above very much so, and also -
Just one level of Wizard will gain access to Knowledge is Power. Along with a couple possible School Powers like Shift from Teleportation or Prescience from Foresight. Actually casting any spells is totally unnecessary, though True Strike doesn't care about armor so it's an easy way to fill 1-slots. The entire rest of the character can be pure martial if so desired.
If you're not into the level dip, the wizard variant multiclass from Pathfinder Unchained is an alternative way to approach this.
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If you're not into the level dip, the wizard variant multiclass from Pathfinder Unchained is an alternative way to approach this.
This is true, and if you go Diviner probably very worth it, but doesn't give Knowledge is Power until 15th level (at which point, with only one Discovery available but full level for it, True Name is a better choice anyway).
Well what I was hoping for was to build a character who uses knowledge to their advantage for more then just oh yeah so and so is a part of so and so group. So Kirin Style seemed fun. Based on what you guys are saying it sounds like an Empiricist Investigator is the best for this thank you everyone. Also I do plan on taking Kirin path and everything.
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Well what I was hoping for was to build a character who uses knowledge to their advantage for more then just oh yeah so and so is a part of so and so group. So Kirin Style seemed fun. Based on what you guys are saying it sounds like an Empiricist Investigator is the best for this thank you everyone. Also I do plan on taking Kirin path and everything.
I really can't say enough about why Kirin style is a trap and should be avoided at all costs. Because of swift action costs it takes three rounds before you ever see your int bonus to damage. Round one, swift action enter style. Round two, swift action identify an opponent. Note this is a nerf to knowledge checks because its normally a free action to identify. Round three, swift action apply bonus damage on one attack per round. The problem is that your opponent is likely already dead, leaving you with three rounds of wasted swift actions. Even if you do successfully use the bonus damage, you still have another wasted round to switch targets.
The new Elven Battle Style allows for INT-to-damage if you're an Elf (including 1.5xINT 2-hand). It's annoying that they tied it to Weapon Finesse and "Elven" weapons, but it does mean being able to 2-hand an elven curved blade or longsword with full 1.5xINT and 2-hand Power Attack.
An Elven character could actually use Guided Hand and Elven Battle Style to wield a longsword in two hands purely with mental stats, but you'd need Warpriest or some multiclassing to make it feasible at all.
Also An Elven Branched spear.
It's too bad that Trained Grace (Advanced Weapon Training) specifies you must use dexterity and strength. If it was "any time you use a different attribute for attack and damage" then it would be pretty good for Elven Battle Style.
I had an idea recently which the Estoric (Magus) and the Unchained Monk multiclassed. Overall they mesh well. I find that four levels into monk and the rest into Estoric gives a lot of good stuff. There is also the Orc archetype for witch, the scarred witch doctor. I've heard from people the extreme strength and spells, despite the low BAB actually makes it a really good combat choice. It also ignores the orc's intelligence penalty. In the Occult Adventures book the spell burst of adrenaline is really handy. As an immediate action you can get a free +4 bonus. Quite helpful I find.
A lvl dip in Master of Many styles could let me use both Kirin and Elven styles. Also this is a home brew so I probably could convince the GM to let me have the styles on all the time in dungeons and similiar, thank you for the idea. :)
Also I found Combat Style Master which could help with the swift action economy.
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There is also the Orc archetype for witch, the scarred witch doctor. I've heard from people the extreme strength and spells, despite the low BAB actually makes it a really good combat choice. It also ignores the orc's intelligence penalty.
I think that opinion dates to when the archetype used Con for its casting stat (making you really tough, and no longer Int based) instead of just giving +2 effective intelligence to offset the stat penalty.