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So I had the thought of making a Magus type character who uses dark magic while armored as kind of a Dark Knight/Anti Paladin character without the evil part or the holy part. So I was thinking that a Hellknight might work for this since they are kind of "evil" in a not evil kind of way.
So I started to think about how I could make a Magus/Hellknight character and found that it wouldn't be to hard to do with a couple of feats and the gold needed to make the armor feasible.
I was just wondering what others think about it and if anyone has suggestions for traits, feats, equipment, spells, etc. that would help the character. So far these are the things that I have found either help or are needed:
Classes/Levels: Magus 7 -> Hellknight 10 -> Magus 3
Feats: (Lvl 3) Arcane Armor Training, (Lvl 7) Heavy Armor Proficiency, (Lvl 9) Arcane Armor Mastery
Equipment: Mithral Hellknight Plate (11,000 gp)
I was thinking Arcane Strike could be useful at times and it should stack with the Arcane Pool stuff, and can be useful when you run out of your pool.
Also I thought it would be flavorful and cool if you were able to get the armor to work like Folding Plate from the APG, but I wasn't sure if you could make specific armor different and what the associated costs would be. I personally would probably just increase the cost by 500 since that is the difference of Full Plate and Hellknight Plate, but that is just me. Which would add 11,150 gp (12,650 minus the 1,500 for Full Plate).
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The reason for doing it this way is cause it isn't till 13th level that you get the heavy armor for Magus and the Hellknight is a 10 level PrC, so in order to fully take Hellknight you would have to be 23rd level, which is currently not possible with the base rules. Or else that is what I would do.
Thanks for the trait idea, I will keep an eye out for it.
Is this a home game, a one-shot, organized play, or what?
My home games have the tendency to end at 20th, but one DM I know goes crazy with epic levels (to the point where 20th is almost invalidated in the scheme of things. This bugs me a bit, but that's non sequitur) Point is, he has 20 as a hard cap for class level, but not character level. I played in a game with a Mystic Theurge once. They're usually just OK, but once it's 10Wiz/10Clr/10Theurge, things are simply bananas.
Anyway what I mean to say is, if it may go epic, go ahead and take Magus to 13.
If not, well...what's more important to your character concept? That he wield sword and spell in heavy armor? That he be a hellknight? Do you want him to be more powerful in a martial or magical sense? Furthermore, how much do levels 8, 9, and 10 of hellknight matter to you? I know, its capstone ability is pretty good, but is it something you can't accomplish with the 3 feats you save, in addition to the extra spells per day (and access to higher level spells), larger arcane pool, etc?
In fact, now I'm curious *looks through classes*
Ok, so going Magus 13/Hellknight 7, as opposed to 10/10
You gain: Improved spell pool, better will save (same fort), 5th level spell slots, heavy armor proficiency (ignoring arcane failure), one arcana ability
You lose: Infernal Armor, Hell's Knight, force of will (better will save vs. 1 spell school), 9th level discipline ability, worse BAB/HD (just enough BAB for 4 attacks)
Ok, so hell's knight is fairly cool. It'd be better if you didn't specify you wanted to be non-evil, but immunity to the most common energy type in the game is always nice. Infernal armor is very situational, but very useful in those situations. 9th level discipline, depends on which you choose/what your concept is.
However, Improved spell pool is also really nice, as it allows you to spend arcane points to regain spells, or to prepare spells you didn't have prepared (IIRC). Further, you can do a LOT with the 3 feats you save. I recommend arcane strike at least, but it's your call. Same with your extra magus arcana. And if you've played casters, you already know the value of higher spell levels. So yeah, you end up more customizable and more versatile if you go 13/7
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It isn't really for any game as of now, more of just a concept and thought. If I do play it it will be in a home game.
Never played Epic and myself (the main GM of the area) am not a huge fan of winging the rules that much and a friend who I am teaching to GM probably wouldn't feel comfortable doing something that far out of the rules.
Personally I like to finish a PrC if I start one. I was never a fan of dipping as people put it, even back in the 3.Xe days. But the concept would be a Terror Knight/Dark Knight concept, high defense, good attack, some debuff spells, some damaging spells, and a really high intimidate.
Yeah, the 9th level, Infernal Armor, and 10th level, Hell's Knight, are one of the coolest parts about the Hellknight in my opinion. You get, Infernal Armor, +2 Cha based stuff (which is OK but not awesome), the ability to see perfectly in all darkness, Resist fire 30, acid and cold 10, and Hell's Knight gets you Immunity to fire and free axiomatic, flaming burst, or unholy quality.
Also I think some of your math is wrong. Magus 13/Hellknight 7 has Fort 12, Ref 6, Will 10 and Magus 10/Hellknight 10 has Fort 12, Ref 6, Will 10. They have the exact same saves except the Hellknight gets a bonus +6/+4/+2 to three different spell descriptors. Also the BAB for M13/HK7 is +16 where as a M10/HK10 would be +17. So when it comes to BAB and saves the 10/10 split is better.
Overall it really comes down to whether or not I want 5th level spells, recall spells to be cheaper, another arcana, and less feat tax. I think the 10/10 split is what I am actually looking for.
Why would you need to take Arcane Armour Training to use a Mithral Full Plate? It counts as medium armour so a 7th level magus can cast in it, all you need is heavy armour proficiency.
*Shrug* if you're ok with throwing that many feats after it, that's your prerogative.
Yeah, epic rules are kind of unsupported in Pathfinder for now. They're not without precedent (there is a section discussing it in the Core rulebook). The only difficult part of the way my GM does it, (level up normally, but in another class/PrC) is determining XP values and making suitable encounters.
Free +2 weapon enhancement bonus is nice, but it's restricted. I haven't looked at Magus archetypes yet, so that's your call.
Of course, in fairness, I see no reason you couldn't just go Hexcrafter 1-20 and have a dark magic using, spell slinging, armored knight.
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@Quantum Steve Mithral only "lightens" the armor for purposes of movement, not proficiency, spellcasting, restrictions, etc. So a barbarian can not use it without penalty, a magus can't cast spells in it till 13th, etc.
Really it is only 3 feats out of the 10 the character gets. But thinking about it a little more the Hexcrafter would probably be a good choice to just go through 1-20 for the character. I really liked the Hellknight armor and some of its flavor as well, but alas I don't think it is needed here.
@Quantum Steve Mithral only "lightens" the armor for purposes of movement, not proficiency, spellcasting, restrictions, etc. So a barbarian can not use it without penalty, a magus can't cast spells in it till 13th, etc.
Really it is only 3 feats out of the 10 the character gets. But thinking about it a little more the Hexcrafter would probably be a good choice to just go through 1-20 for the character. I really liked the Hellknight armor and some of its flavor as well, but alas I don't think it is needed here.
I don't think that is correct. Mithral makes it lighter for ALL purposes short of proficiency.
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Mithral is a very rare silvery, glistening metal that is lighter than steel but just as hard.
When worked like steel, it becomes a wonderful material from which to create armor, and is occasionally used for other items as well. Most mithral armors are one category lighter than normal for purposes of movement and other limitations. Heavy armors are treated as medium, and medium armors are treated as light, but light armors are still treated as light. This decrease does not apply to proficiency in wearing the armor. A character wearing mithral full plate must be proficient in wearing heavy armor to avoid adding the armor's check penalty to all his attack rolls and skill checks that involve moving. Spell failure chances for armors and shields made from mithral are decreased by 10%, maximum Dexterity bonuses are increased by 2, and armor check penalties are decreased by 3 (to a minimum of 0).
An item made from mithral weighs half as much as the same item made from other metals. In the case of weapons, this lighter weight does not change a weapon's size category or the ease with which it can be wielded (whether it is light, one-handed, or two-handed). Items not primarily of metal are not meaningfully affected by being partially made of mithral. (A longsword can be a mithral weapon, while a quarterstaff cannot.) Mithral weapons count as silver for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.
HP/inch 30
Hardness 15
OK, I guess reading it again the and other limitations could mean for abilities such as these. I have always played and been told that the only thing that it actually modified was purposes of movement and the modifiers to max dex, check penalty, etc.
I could be wrong and I will check on the forums here for a clarification. If is does count as medium for the purposes of spellcasting and such then that saves me two feats.
So it looks like the common consensus is that mithral treats it as lighter for everything except proficiency. So I would only need one feat to do the Magus/Hellknight build effectively.
THAT'S more like it. It's much nicer to not throw feats (and swift actions, for that matter) away on things like that. And now you can use all the great new casting feats!