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If letter is burned and only ash remains can it be restored by make whole.
A) Letter is restored with all text.
B) Paper and ink is restored, but ink doesn't form letters.
I understand that spell restores damage to objects, but I'm not sure whether letters of ink would also be restored. Especially if ash is partly present.
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I think it's clearly intended to, er, "make" the letter "whole," e.g. completely undamaged.
I base this in part on the line in make whole stating "Make whole [...] restores the magic properties of the item if your caster level is at least twice that of the item."
This would include items such as the manual of war, which are actually books, and which must be read to activate them. Since the manual of war is not a charged or single use item, but it's restored to usefulness, the words must be restored somehow.
Other examples of this type of written magic item would include the page of spell knowlege, the book of the loremaster, and possibly the lord's banner.
As to how it does it? Magic. The idea that written words are magical goes back millennia, so I don't have any issue with the idea that a spell that restores magic can restore the magic of the written word, even when the written word is "scenery is beautiful, wish you were here."
Send secret messages like this:
Write your messages on half a piece of paper.
Burn off the bit with the message.
Send the unburnt remnant.
The recipient knows in advance to use make whole on this scrap of paper to recieve the message.
Success!
As to how it does it? Magic. The idea that written words are magical goes back millennia, so I don't have any issue with the idea that a spell that restores magic can restore the magic of the written word, even when the written word is "scenery is beautiful, wish you were here."
This makes sense, but wouldn't the "virtual Caster Level" of not-actually-magical writing be 0, and thus not much of a threshold?
Send secret messages like this:
Write your messages on half a piece of paper.
Burn off the bit with the message.
Send the unburnt remnant.
The recipient knows in advance to use make whole on this scrap of paper to recieve the message.
Success!
Of course, so does the Chelish spymaster you're trying to bypass. I suspect that in the Golarioniverse, this is the equivalent of writing in lemon juice using A=1, B=2, C=3....
As to how it does it? Magic. The idea that written words are magical goes back millennia, so I don't have any issue with the idea that a spell that restores magic can restore the magic of the written word, even when the written word is "scenery is beautiful, wish you were here."This makes sense, but wouldn't the "virtual Caster Level" of not-actually-magical writing be 0, and thus not much of a threshold?
Yes, and that's why it's easier to restore the not-very-magical writings of an ordinary letter. ("Dear Sir: Your letter of the fourth instant is received and contents noted.") You still need to be able to cast the spell, but that's typical of magic-affecting magic. It's still a third level spell (requiring a 5th level caster) to dispel a cantrip.
Anyone who can manage to cast the spell can manage the CL 0 requirement to restore ordinary writing.
Send secret messages like this:
Write your messages on half a piece of paper.
Burn off the bit with the message.
Send the unburnt remnant.
The recipient knows in advance to use make whole on this scrap of paper to recieve the message.
Success!
Of course, so does the Chelish spymaster you're trying to bypass. I suspect that in the Golarioniverse, this is the equivalent of writing in lemon juice using A=1, B=2, C=3....
They must burn through a whole lot of make wholes on random scraps of paper.
They must burn through a whole lot of make wholes on random scraps of paper.Send secret messages like this:
Write your messages on half a piece of paper.
Burn off the bit with the message.
Send the unburnt remnant.
The recipient knows in advance to use make whole on this scrap of paper to recieve the message.
Success!
Of course, so does the Chelish spymaster you're trying to bypass. I suspect that in the Golarioniverse, this is the equivalent of writing in lemon juice using A=1, B=2, C=3....
That's probably why it can still work. The Chelish countermeasures are easy, but costly.
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As an opposing viewpoint, I'd say make whole cannot restore a letter that has been burned to ash. Both make whole and mending require that all the pieces of the object are available. A significant portion of the letter went up the chimney, so neither of those spells will work. Burning the letters is still useful when the Chelaxian Inquisition is about to barge through the door.
As an opposing viewpoint, I'd say make whole cannot restore a letter that has been burned to ash. Both make whole and mending require that all the pieces of the object are available. A significant portion of the letter went up the chimney, so neither of those spells will work. Burning the letters is still useful when the Chelaxian Inquisition is about to barge through the door.
In fact I have exactly same opinion. For some sad reason I was the only one with it in the group.
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As an opposing viewpoint, I'd say make whole cannot restore a letter that has been burned to ash. Both make whole and mending require that all the pieces of the object are available. A significant portion of the letter went up the chimney, so neither of those spells will work. Burning the letters is still useful when the Chelaxian Inquisition is about to barge through the door.
Yuppers. Folks often forget that the ash doesn't comprise the whole of the material that was destroyed in the fire; a portion of it was converted to various fumes & gasses that would be rather difficult to reclaim without preparation.
There are higher lever spells that address this sort of issue when attempting to, say, reconstitute a body. Those are generally not 3rd level spells, however.
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I think there are two relevant sections of text;
"All of the pieces of an object must be present for this spell to function."
Taken to the extreme, this would mean that the spell never does anything... because EVERY object has a few molecules which have chipped off or bonded with other elements and been removed. Thus, I think the 'burning means some atoms have bonded with oxygen and gone up in smoke' argument, while accurate, doesn't prevent the effect from working. There are still plenty of atoms there to reconstruct what was written. It might not be in perfect pristine form, but it would be readable.
Consider also;
"This spell has no effect on objects that have been warped or otherwise transmuted, but it can still repair damage done to such items."
Even if we take burning to be a form of transmutation (which would mean that a staff given the 'broken' condition by fire damage could never be restored... seems unlikely to be the intent), the remains can still be repaired. That would mean re-assembling ashes into a page, removing soot stains, restoring any ink in those soot marks to it's proper place, et cetera.
This would likely produce a very fragile page which could nonetheless be read.
I think there are two relevant sections of text;
"All of the pieces of an object must be present for this spell to function."
Taken to the extreme, this would mean that the spell never does anything...
That's my thought as well. This interpretation makes the make whole spell absolutely nonfunctional, which is reason enough for me to disagree with the interpretation. Irrespective of what a spell does, it should do something.
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 8
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I'm willing to overlook a few chipped off molecules, but burning is a pretty significant change to the the object. Think of a stack of firewood, and the small pile of ash left behind when you've burned it--obviously quite a bit of that material is missing!
I'd also argue that burning is functionally similar to (though obviously not technically) transmutation, given that it's not simply damaging the object but also transforming it from one thing into another. Make whole cannot fix transmutation, therefore make whole probably shouldn't be able to turn ash back into paper.
Make whole would restore a document that I put through my cross-cut shredder. It will not restore a document from the ashes of my incinerator any more than it would restore a cord of firewood from the ashes of my fireplace.
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Make whole would restore a document that I put through my cross-cut shredder. It will not restore a document from the ashes of my incinerator any more than it would restore a cord of firewood from the ashes of my fireplace.
Suppose the incinerator didn't have an exhaust port... so every molecule which formerly composed the document was still there. In such case, why WOULDN'T 'Make Whole' work?
What about rust? That's oxidation just as much as a burnt letter. Are you saying that 'Make Whole' can't repair rust? So even if an adventurer were casting the spell on their trusty sword every day the slow accumulation of rust (and bits of metal being scraped off in fights) would eventually make it worthless?
Finally, have you ever seen a burnt document which DIDN'T fall to ash? They can often still be read, but the slightest touch can cause them to break apart into ashes. Thus even if many molecules escaped as the document burned, why couldn't 'Make Whole' re-assemble ashes into a burned sheet of paper... while also removing any soot marks which might obscure letters? That's just rearranging the existing materials.
What about rust? That's oxidation just as much as a burnt letter. Are you saying that 'Make Whole' can't repair rust?
If your anchor shank has been reduced by rust to half its original cross-section, where are the "missing pieces" needed by 'Make Whole' ?
Ah, aren't minutiae wonderful?
Burned letter: honestly, I'd say it's too far gone. Remember, with a few exceptions this thing's a beefed-up Mending spell. Mending doesn't look like it deals with destroyed stuff, aside from destroyed magic items (and it just fixes them, doesn't restore the magic), and Make Whole looks like it just fiddles with destroyed magic items and restores its magic. Of course, if you just shredded the letter, mending would work. (Seriously, I remember reading an article about some folks in Iran who were reweaving shredded documents left behind.)
I will admit that it might not be too imbalancing to let it work tho. Depends on how common level 3+ magic users are in your setting. And this all assumes that the letter-burner hasn't *scattered* the ashes. Once they're tossed to the winds, good luck recovering enough for a casting.
You ight be interested in the example of somebody actually reading a burned scroll, although this example is closest to Divination rather than Transmutation.
Mereological nihilism strikes again!