Ok, the statblock of the spell states it's duration is instantaneous, though the description seems to state otherwise. Same with Wall of Stone. This has vexed me since 3.0. To me, instantaneous means "there and gone again in an instant". What am I not understanding here? I have difficulty grasping things more now than ever before (I'll not go into that) but I'm still puzzled by this.
It creates a wall, that is the effect.
The wall stays, and is no longer magical.
That's what I thought, but I just needed someone to verify it for me. Thanks.
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In this case, the difference between "instantaneous" and "permanent" is that with instant spell, the spell creates something and then magic is gone, but the thing stays. A permanent spell would create a thing and keep it there with magic.
You can get rid of a permanent thing with Dispel Magic, but not of an instant thing, because it's just a mundane object after the spell's completed.
No you can't chop it into ingots and sell the iron. ;-)
Which implies a lingering magic, because... why can't you?
Even things without value can be foisted off on some simpleton by a skilled enough salesman.
That last part of the spell seems a bit arbitrary to me, but I get it... not that iron is worth THAT much...
Truly this is a powerful spell. It alters reality itself in such a way that everyone, everywhere can identify the pieces of this wall, and assign it exactly no value, regardless of it's presentation.
Like any iron wall, this wall is subject to rust, perforation, and other natural phenomena. Iron created by this spell is not suitable for use in the creation of other objects and cannot be sold.
I've always taken this to mean that while it could be cut up as if it were iron, the pieces become weak and brittle and crumble to rust scale easily. If you attempt to melt it, it becomes mostly slag and won't recast properly.
Conclusion: It's an iron-LIKE substance created (but not sustained) by magic, but it's not truly iron. Perhaps the spell name should be "Faux-Iron Wall".
I call it:
"Reality Altering, Thought Preventing, Value Negating alsomakesawall"
Like any iron wall, this wall is subject to rust, perforation, and other natural phenomena. Iron created by this spell is not suitable for use in the creation of other objects and cannot be sold.I've always taken this to mean that while it could be cut up as if it were iron, the pieces become weak and brittle and crumble to rust scale easily. If you attempt to melt it, it becomes mostly slag and won't recast properly.
Conclusion: It's an iron-LIKE substance created (but not sustained) by magic, but it's not truly iron. Perhaps the spell name should be "Faux-Iron Wall".
I agree.
It's a way to close a loophole. Otherwise a caster could simply create many walls of iron a day and smelt it down and make lots of money. No one would mine iron anymore, because it would be inefficient compared to casting the spell and smelting it down. Unless it turned into something incredibly useless because it wasn't really iron.
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I understand the balance logic behind it, but it makes very very little in-game sense. :D
A-"Nice looking iron wall, I would like to purchase it from you"
b-"But, it's not suitable for use in the creation of other objects!"
A-"I care not for such trivialities. It is an oddity, and I desire it, sell it to me!"
b-"I cannot! It cannot be sold!"
A-"I will give you whatever price you wish!"
b-"No! Go away, it's MY WALL!"
A-"Sell it to me, or suffer the consequences!"
oh wait, I get it now... you can murder someone, steal it, have it donated...
You just can't sell it.
Still kinda arbitrary. :D
Even if it was just slag, you would think that it you could forge a ball of metal to launch out of catapults, but as written you can't even do that. What happens if you cast fabricate on it? does it keep the "can not be sold" clause if you cast polymorph any object?
Owner - D20 Hobbies
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Still kinda arbitrary. :D
Not at all. I can't remember a 3.5 game where a Wizard didn't say:
Wizard:
"Hey lets just take a break for a year of gaming and I'll make all my spell slots wall of iron. I'm 10th level, so I get 3 a day so 3750 cubic feet of iron a day. Iron has a weight of 491 per cubic foot, so 1841250 lbs a day, 365 days and sell for 1 sp per lb = 67205625 gp. Split 6 ways with the party = 11200937 gp each. 11 million gold to sit out a year. You all in for it right? Hells Yells.
GM:
Get out you jerk.
Now we have a rule. We don't have to banish our friends from the game table!
Translating the purpose of this spell (wall of iron) is to effect battlefield control, not make the 9th level wizard the bill gates of the universe at a rate of 61,375 gp per 5th level spell slot.
*bad math removed*
Translating the purpose of this spell (wall of iron) is to effect battlefield control, not make the 9th level wizard the bill gates of the universe at a rate of 61,375 gp per 5th level spell slot.
Numbers are way off. As a 6th level spell, minimum caster level is 11. A 5' square is 25 square feet - 11 of those squares is 275 square feet. At a thickness of 3 inches/0.25 feet (CL 11/3), that gives 68.75 cubic feet of iron per casting. That is 33756 pounds of iron, or 3,375.6gp per casting. Even with 3 castings per day for a whole year, it is still only 3,696,282 gp total. Still a lot, but no where near the 67 million you got.
Still bad, just not quite as bad as you calculated.
Turn it into wood and it would make a great bonfire
>Implying you cannot print money using Fabricate anyways
I just love that it literally alters reality so that you just...
CAN'T
sell it.
No conditions, no saves. No one in the universe will give even a single copper for it, no matter what.
In fact, they CAN'T. Even if they want to.
Hilarious.
Does the money fly out of their hands? Go shooting back into their pockets?
How does this manifest in-game? I must know.
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The magic is that no-one can want it. Everyone despises your wall of iron to the point of insanity. Even if you hold a knife to their throat, they will die rather than pay you a penny for your loathsome wall of worthless iron.
While you can't sell the wall FOR MATERIAL, you *can* be hired to cast wall of iron. So, you are effectively selling the wall, just not for material.
While you can't sell the wall FOR MATERIAL, you *can* be hired to cast wall of iron. So, you are effectively selling the wall, just not for material.
Hrm... nice loophole.
I just love that it literally alters reality so that you just...
CAN'T
sell it.
No conditions, no saves. No one in the universe will give even a single copper for it, no matter what.
In fact, they CAN'T. Even if they want to.
Hilarious.
Does the money fly out of their hands? Go shooting back into their pockets?
How does this manifest in-game? I must know.
I like the faux-iron approach above. It's iron-like but not exactly iron in that it's not really worth anything other than as the exact wall you create when you form it.
The magic is that no-one can want it. Everyone despises your wall of iron to the point of insanity. Even if you hold a knife to their throat, they will die rather than pay you a penny for your loathsome wall of worthless iron.
No no, that's extortion.
That's okay.
You can't have a WILLING buyer.
Maybe if you charge someone X gold for a potato, and throw the wall in for free, that could work?
I'll ask my GM and see what he says.
Why does this spell even need to exist? Doesn't Wall of Stone suffice?
Iron is harder.
Why does this spell even need to exist? Doesn't Wall of Stone suffice?
They do different things. If you want your very own keep, a few castings of Wall of Stone along with Knowledge (Engineering) and in a day or two you have a keep.
If you're in a dungeon and you're being pursued by a big nasty and are trying to run away, a wall of iron across the tunnel will hold them off longer than a wall of stone would.
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In my campaig that passage is fluff, not a rule. Last mage that tried to make money selling the iron was found in Dwarfburgheim, head down in a keg of ale with a pickax through his skull. Chief gaurdsman Stumpy McBeardson ruled it an open and shut case of suicide. Digger McBeardson, president of Miners, Smelters and Smiths local #407 is quoted as saying "We all as re saddened at this tragic news, and prayers go out to the family."
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I think when I design my next dragon encounter, instead of the usual gold, gems and itemz;the dragon horde will consist of row upon row of walls of iron. Talk about irony....
I think when I design my next dragon encounter, instead of the usual gold, gems and itemz;the dragon horde will consist of row upon row of walls of iron. Talk about irony....
Is that ironic? I don't think it's ferrous to decide. :D