Looks like you are referring to the Monstrous Companion feat.
This feat cannot be taken with the Leadership feat.
I think you found a failure of RAW to address the situation.
As a houserule, I would allow the Leadership modifiers except "Has a familiar, special mount, or animal companion" to affect the effective druid level, adding 2/3 cohort level per effective druid level beyond 20, capped at cohort level 17 [=leadership max]. Basically:
21 .. 12
22 .. 13
23 .. 14
24 .. 14
25 .. 15
26 .. 16
27 .. 16
28 .. 17
This gives the same range as the Leadership feat, which also has unobtainable entries. [Stone Giant in Bestiary 1 is cohort level 18.]
/cevah
You can get the level 18 cohort by assimar oracle of nature. Your effective druid level is 30 which should net you the 18.
problem is this feat replaces animal companion AND is weaker (as written) than Leadership itself
nice idea but complete RAW failure
Whether this feat is weaker than Leadership depends on your charisma. I would imagine that most druids do not pump their charisma scores too high since their caster stat is wisdom.
How does your Charisma help?
I am interested in the answer to this question as well.
You can get the level 18 cohort by assimar oracle of nature. Your effective druid level is 30 which should net you the 18.
I'm pretty sure there was an FAQ about FCB for this particular combination which nerfed it pretty hard. I don't think this is true anymore.
You can get the level 18 cohort by assimar oracle of nature. Your effective druid level is 30 which should net you the 18.I'm pretty sure there was an FAQ about FCB for this particular combination which nerfed it pretty hard. I don't think this is true anymore.
I have looked for it, but can't find anything
How does your Charisma help?I am interested in the answer to this question as well.
if you have high charisma, that's a bonus to your leadership cohort, however charisma isn't applied to the monster cohort feat, so you only lose out on it if you have high charisma.
that's my understanding of his logic.
That makes sense to me.
You can have a 21 HD monstrous companion according to some dev
?
How does your Charisma help?
It helps with the effective cohort level of a cohort gained via the Leadership feat. It has absolutely no effect on the effective level of the cohort granted by the Monstrous Companion feat. If your charisma is low enough, the effective level of your monstrous companion may exceed what you could have gotten with the Leadership feat.
I have looked for it, but can't find anythingYou can get the level 18 cohort by assimar oracle of nature. Your effective druid level is 30 which should net you the 18.I'm pretty sure there was an FAQ about FCB for this particular combination which nerfed it pretty hard. I don't think this is true anymore.
Couldn't find the FAQ, but found the developer quote that was developed into the FAQ:
Favored Class Bonus for Half-Elves and Half-Orcs
For the purpose of qualifying for favored class bonuses, half-elves are also treated as both elves and humans, and half-orcs are also treated as humans (but not orcs)—a byproduct of their respective elf blood and orc blood racial traits. Only characters that have the elf blood or orc blood racial trait count as a member of another race for this purpose.Related Point: Can I apply the aasimar or elf oracle's favored class bonus to a revelation I do not yet have? Can I do so for the aasimar bard’s favored class bonus?
No, when choosing which class feature’s effective level to increase, you can only select a feature that you already have. For example, an aasimar flame oracle cannot choose to improve the wings of fire revelation with her favored class bonus until she actually gains the revelation at 7th level or beyond; she could not start augmenting it at 1st level.
Related Point: Can I have an 18th-level animal companion at level 12?
A character’s effective druid level for determining the abilities of her animal companion (based on Table 3–8 on page 52 of the Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook) cannot increase her animal companion’s Hit Dice above her actual character level + 1. An animal companion receives no additional abilities for its level unless it has the requisite number of Hit Dice; a character can increase her effective druid level further, though these effective levels do not grant any benefit until the character’s actual level increases. For example, a 12th-level aasimar oracle with the nature mystery and the bonded mount revelation could theoretically have an “18th-level” animal companion; however, her animal companion would only be “16th-level” for all abilities because the animal could not have more than 13 Hit Dice.[ooc]This is a conscious modification to how the rules work for the few cases that would allow a character to have an animal companion with a higher effective level than she does—primarily related to oracles’ use of the aasimar and elf alternate favored class bonuses. Such characters can still receive considerable benefits from such an investment of favored class points, but the mechanical edge is not as overwhelming for an ability that is persistent and potentially game-changing. The above information will be included in an FAQ entry, and a note will appear in the Additional Resources entry for Pathfinder RPG Advanced Race Guide.
Do I get to rebuild?
An aasimar or elf affected by this change may freely change her race, favored class point assignments, and any character options (e.g. feats, race-specific spells and archetypes, etc.) dependent on being a member of that race.I understand that some folks may only be playing an aasimar or elf because of the extraordinarily potent favored class bonuses. This change may have made some of those favored class bonus assignments redundant or illegal. Perhaps this “ruins” your character and you want to reconsider your race choice. I’m fine with you changing these things. Everything else (e.g. mystery, revelations, non-race-specific archetype, ability scores, etc.) follows the retraining rules printed in Pathfinder RPG Ultimate Campaign.
See this thread.
I have looked for it, but can't find anythingYou can get the level 18 cohort by assimar oracle of nature. Your effective druid level is 30 which should net you the 18.I'm pretty sure there was an FAQ about FCB for this particular combination which nerfed it pretty hard. I don't think this is true anymore.Couldn't find the FAQ, but found the developer quote that was developed into the FAQ:
...Favored Class Bonus for Half-Elves and Half-Orcs
For the purpose of qualifying for favored class bonuses, half-elves are also treated as both elves and humans, and half-orcs are also treated as humans (but not orcs)—a byproduct of their respective elf blood and orc blood racial traits. Only characters that have the elf blood or orc blood racial trait count as a member of another race for this purpose.Related Point: Can I apply the aasimar or elf oracle's favored class bonus to a revelation I do not yet have? Can I do so for the aasimar bard’s favored class bonus?
No, when choosing which class feature’s effective level to increase, you can only select a feature that you already have. For example, an aasimar flame oracle cannot choose to improve the wings of fire revelation with her favored class bonus until she actually gains the revelation at 7th level or beyond; she could not start augmenting it at 1st level.
Related Point: Can I have an 18th-level animal companion at level 12?
A character’s effective druid level for determining the abilities of her animal companion (based on Table 3–8 on page 52 of the Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook) cannot increase her animal companion’s Hit Dice above her actual character level + 1. An animal companion receives no additional abilities for its level
So at level 20, your effective druid level is 30, the max hitdice of your companion is 21, the max cohort level is 18.
What are the best companions that fall within this category?
Lets take it one step further, using fcb of elven oracle of nature. What is the best cohort you can have at level 8, level 12, level 16, and level 20. This includes possibly taking a lower cohort and then giving it class levels to bring up your cohort level.
My DM thoughts:
Monstrous companion totally blows. Fiercely. A level 10 druid with Leadership and an Animal Companion has 2 effectively CR6 minions, for a combined CR8. Math: an NPC with 7 PC levels -1 for NPC equipment and an animal with 9 hit dice per monster creation table.
If the very same druid uses this dumb feat to swap for a Hippogriff with ECL 6... you get a CR2 creature. What the actual eff?
My thoughts: ignore the text on the feat and just say you can swap your Comp for a monster on the list with CR of up to your Level-2, with class levels for the remainder. That way it's literally the same as taking a cohort, but you get one buddy instead of 2. If it's unbalancing, add in CHA math or something.
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My DM thoughts:
Monstrous companion totally blows. Fiercely. A level 10 druid with Leadership and an Animal Companion has 2 effectively CR6 minions, for a combined CR8. Math: an NPC with 7 PC levels -1 for NPC equipment and an animal with 9 hit dice per monster creation table.If the very same druid uses this dumb feat to swap for a Hippogriff with ECL 6... you get a CR2 creature. What the actual eff?
It makes me sad that a professional game designer earned a paycheck for writing this feat.
We have always just used Leadership and allowed for monsters, using CR as level.
Subject to GM approval, naturally.
We have always just used Leadership and allowed for monsters, using CR as level.
Subject to GM approval, naturally.
Actually, you should be using CR+1 as level, considering that NPC's CR without PC gear is Level - 1. Also, your cohorts should never have PC-level gear.
With my houserule... In order to keep the power level of this feat in line with Leadership... I'd probably apply a CHA 15 prereq or else everyone would be running around with hippogriff clerics or leucrotta sorcerers or giant owl wizards or what have you.
Also, for creatures with INT>2, you should be within one step of their alignment.
All up to the DM to decide , i also prefer CR = level , how much gold the cohort has at the start depends on cohort really.