What is the best you can do with a whip?

[Torbyne]

I've long toyed with the idea of a useful whip character and finally have the chance to try one out. Its kind of surprising the versatility i see in the weapon and was wondering how others thought it could best be utilized. Here is what i am going with:

Human
Daring Champion Cavalier 10
STR 13
DEX 22
CON 14
INT 10
WIS 10
CHA 14

Panache pool: 4

Obviously i grabbed Whip Mastery and Slashing Grace as the core of the character's functionality. Beyond that i grabbed some extra panache to fuel parries and the teamwork feat Tandem Trip to go with the tactician class ability. Even without anything else to beef up tripping attempts i feel getting that free reroll can make tripping a perfectly valid tactic.

Damage seems fairly respectable at 1D3+14+10 before challenge or spending panache to add an extra 20.

What other whip wielders have people seen or played?

[Gisher]

A whip-wielding Kensai Magus can be really good. Warpriests aren't bad.

[Charon's Little Helper]

A Warprist can do it pretty well since they don't have to worry about the d3 damage die.

[pH unbalanced]

If you are interested in maneuvers, take a look at Serpents Lash and Greater Serpents Lash. I've tended to use those with characters who use whips as secondary weapons, rather than primary ones (so a rapier in one hand for when you want to do damage and a whip in the other for when you want to move people around) The advantage is that they aren't as feat intensive as the Whip Mastery line -- but it's hard to do both.

When you're looking at traits, definitely check out Prehensile Whip, which will let you grab things with your whip.

Since you've got a decent Charisma and Weapon Focus is required for Whip Mastery, you should consider Dazzling Display. (Especially if you can also grab Hurtful.)

[Torbyne]

Charon's Little Helper wrote:

A Warprist can do it pretty well since they don't have to worry about the d3 damage die.

That was my first thought for the warpriest back in the ACG playtest but the damage die progression seemed slow compared to how fast other classes could rack up a static boost. Maybe as a dip though?

[Torbyne]

pH unbalanced wrote:

If you are interested in maneuvers, take a look at Serpents Lash and Greater Serpents Lash. I've tended to use those with characters who use whips as secondary weapons, rather than primary ones (so a rapier in one hand for when you want to do damage and a whip in the other for when you want to move people around) The advantage is that they aren't as feat intensive as the Whip Mastery line -- but it's hard to do both.

When you're looking at traits, definitely check out Prehensile Whip, which will let you grab things with your whip.

Since you've got a decent Charisma and Weapon Focus is required for Whip Mastery, you should consider Dazzling Display. (Especially if you can also grab Hurtful.)

Theres something i didnt know about. Both of those ideas look fun though the dazzling display/hurtful combo looks like it would serve best early in the game when you could only make one attack anyway, too bad it takes so many feats to pull off.

[Cavall]

You can't do the best with a whip.

But you can whip it good.

Whip it real good.

[Torbyne]

Cavall wrote:

You can't do the best with a whip.

But you can whip it good.

Whip it real good.

Trust me friend, there will be very much good whiping to evil's butt!

Side note: Can you just be assumed to have a miniature giant space hamster animal companion or do you still need to pay the GP and feats for it?

[Cavall]

I'd actually worked out a decent orc rogue charging build (their archtype) based on the steel ship and some other feats. Cleaving through opponents with a massive range and "sneak attack"

To me, that was the best whip build. I'd also go shattered defenses and cruel/ominous. Then you wouldn't have to worry about having to charge once in place. The build also allows cleaving sneak attacks.

Pretty decent.

[Torbyne]

Cavall wrote:

I'd actually worked out a decent orc rogue charging build (their archtype) based on the steel ship and some other feats. Cleaving through opponents with a massive range and "sneak attack"

To me, that was the best whip build. I'd also go shattered defenses and cruel/ominous. Then you wouldn't have to worry about having to charge once in place. The build also allows cleaving sneak attacks.

Pretty decent.

Ooh, that one also sounds fun :)

[galahad2112]

I'm currently playing a whirlwind tripper with a whip. It's pretty damn sweet. Only problem is it's INCREDIBLY feat intensive. I went with 1/2 Orc for the City-Raised and Toothy alternate traits, so that I can still threaten early game. I took a single level in Druid with the Plant(Growth) subdomain. This could easily be swapped for Cleric or Inquisitor, I just chose druid for flavor. Anyway, the rest of his levels have been in Fighter with the Lore Warden archetype.

Feats:
Dodge
Mobility
Spring Attack
Combat Expertise
Whirlwind Attack
Improved Trip
Greater Trip
Weapon Focus: Whip
Whip Mastery
Improved Whip Mastery
Greater Whip Mastery

This guy is fantastic at crowd control, but he can't really capitalize on it, as he lacks Combat Reflexes and Power Attack. He's Str-based so that I don't have to worry about Weapon Finesse, plus it's got synergy with Enlarge Person.

[Darigaaz the Igniter]

I've got a magus build, tldr of it is magical lineage+rime spell+frostbite+enforcer+whip+spell combat+spell strike.

[Dave Justus]

The best I can do with a whip is not appropriate to be discussed on a family friendly forum. Even if it is role-playing related.

[Saldiven]

Cavall wrote:

But you can whip it good.

Whip it real good.

Thanks, now I have that song stuck in my head....

[Zwordsman]

If this is a home game with 3rd party stuff Look up the pyromancer psionic. They get a flame whip and cool tricks that make the whip game even more amusing.

[Gisher]

The Unchained Rogue could make an interesting DEX-based whip wielder. The biggest problem with whips, especially with DEX builds, is the large number of feats needed to make them viable. Finesse Training granting Weapon Finesse at first level and DEX to damage at third is a big help. Plus you can use Combat Trick and Weapon Training rogue talents to get two more needed feats.

[Zwordsman]

I think.. there was some FAQ somewhere that said scoropion whip, used by someone who has proficincy in scorpion whip and normal whip, gets to use it with the same properties as whip. So it's basically reach and bypasses the need for the feat line to do lethal damage vs armour.
Though you may still want those feats for tricks.

[Kalindlara]

Gisher wrote:

The Unchained Rogue could make an interesting DEX-based whip wielder. The biggest problem with whips, especially with DEX builds, is the large number of feats needed to make them viable. Finesse Training granting Weapon Finesse at first level and DEX to damage at third is a big help. Plus you can use Combat Trick and Weapon Training rogue talents to get two more needed feats.

I deployed one as a player's cohort in Carrion Crown, and she's been solid - I actually had to nerf her a little.

I recommend Gang Up in addition to the Whip Mastery line. The reach on the whip also lets you perform a lot of combat maneuvers without provoking, and the Surprising Maneuver feat helps up your CMB.

It seemed fun; I'd give it a try. ^_^

[Gisher]

Gang Up seems pretty good. I never noticed it before. Probably because I haven't played a Rogue since the days when they were called Thieves.

[Torbyne]

Zwordsman wrote:

I think.. there was some FAQ somewhere that said scoropion whip, used by someone who has proficincy in scorpion whip and normal whip, gets to use it with the same properties as whip. So it's basically reach and bypasses the need for the feat line to do lethal damage vs armour.

Though you may still want those feats for tricks.

That might work for the early game to get some damage at range but it becomes even more intensive if you want to go the improved and greater whip mastery lines.

[fel_horfrost]

Whirlwind attack, lunge, trip.
Trip against all foes within 20 feet, 25 feet if you drink a enlarge person potion.

[Charon's Little Helper]

fel_horfrost wrote:

Whirlwind attack, lunge, trip.

Trip against all foes within 20 feet, 25 feet if you drink a enlarge person potion.

Wouldn't it be 35ft with an enlarge potion? Lage size doesn't just add 5ft to reach - it doubles reach.

[Kalindlara]

Charon's Little Helper wrote:

fel_horfrost wrote:

Whirlwind attack, lunge, trip.

Trip against all foes within 20 feet, 25 feet if you drink a enlarge person potion.

Wouldn't it be 35ft with an enlarge potion? Lage size doesn't just add 5ft to reach - it doubles reach.

I think it doubling the whip's range is a gray area, though. It's not explicitly "Reach".

[Torbyne]

It has the reach quality though with a special exception in its descritpion of being a 15 foot reach as opposed to 10 foot. following the rules of size, reach and the special whip exception you get the 30 foot large whip range.

[Kalindlara]

Torbyne wrote:

It has the reach quality though with a special exception in its descritpion of being a 15 foot reach as opposed to 10 foot. following the rules of size, reach and the special whip exception you get the 30 foot large whip range.

Does it actually have the Reach weapon keyword?

Oops.

Well then, just ignore me. ^_^