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I'm not sure if this is a dumb question or not but I didn't see it answered anywhere. The rules for grappling say:
"Humanoid creatures without two free hands attempting to grapple a foe take a –4 penalty on the combat maneuver roll."
Does this apply to both people in the grapple? Just the initial attempt or every grapple check? Its not mentioned anywhere again in the grapple rules that I saw.
Note the careful wording. If you are the one who begins the grapple, then you are the "grappler" and you are "grappling". But if you're the victim (they guy who is being attacked with the grapple maneuver), then you are not the "grappler" nor are you "grappling". Both the "grappler" and his victim gain the "Grappled" condition, but that does not make them equal in this terminology.
So if you are a humanoid "grappler", you need two free hands or you take this penalty on your initial attempt to start a grapple and, maybe or maybe not, on all other grapple rolls*.
But if you are a humanoid victim being grappled by a "grappler", then you are NOT "grappling" and this penalty does not apply to you.
Why does this matter?
Because the Grapple maneuver is not a grapple + disarm. You can grapple, or you can disarm, but you cannot simultaneously do both. If this penalty applied to the victim trying to escape a "grappler", he would get a sizable penalty or be strongly encouraged to drop his weapon to try to escape. Fortunately, the wording only applies the penalty when you are "grappling", not merely "grappled".
* see below
It appears that it applies for all grapple maneuver rolls. Thanks for pointing this out; I believe I've missed this in the past.
Maybe it doesn't.
First:
Humanoid creatures without two free hands attempting to grapple a foe take a –4 penalty on the combat maneuver roll.
So here we have one rule saying that you get a penalty if you are a humanoid who is grappling and you make any one-handed grapple checks. Fine. So clearly this rule suggests that you should use two hands.
But read the Grappled condition:
A grappled creature is restrained by a creature, trap, or effect. Grappled creatures cannot move and take a –4 penalty to Dexterity. A grappled creature takes a –2 penalty on all attack rolls and combat maneuver checks, except those made to grapple or escape a grapple. In addition, grappled creatures can take no action that requires two hands to perform.
So you should use two arms when grappling, but you cannot take any actions that require two hands to perform.
A possible contradiction.
Possible resolutions, in roughly the order that seems least likely to most likely:
1. Grow a hand that is NOT on your arm - you need two free hands but can only use one arm, so if you have a hand on, say, your chin, you can use your one free arm and your free chin-hand to satisfy the requirement of using two free hands. ;)
2. The penalty for using only one hand applies to all to checks even though it's not explicitly mentioned as such, but it was intended to force all grapplers to only grapple with one hand and suffer this penalty on every grapple check EXCEPT the first one, where this penalty is optionally avoided by using two hands - after that, if you continue grappling, you're one handed. End of story. Seems far-fetched. Why would I begin a grapple with two hands then decide to put one in my pocket and continue grappling with just the one hand? Nonsense, but maybe (doubtful) that's what the devs wanted.
3. The penalty for using only one hand applies only on the initial check where the rules describe the penalty. If they wanted it on all checks, the would have called it out as such. Maybe, but even this seems like a bit of a stretch - perhaps they thought mentioning it in the one paragraph was sufficient. It wasn't. Still, this seems like the most likely resolution.
YMMV
You technically by the rules don't need any hands to grapple, but if you use less than two, you'll suffer the penalties. You should note that for monsters that lack enough limbs.
From what I've been told by a popular grappler on the boards, this penalty only exists for the initial attempt to grapple, and then after it is no longer an issue. I wish this would be cleared up along with quite a bunch more of the grapple rules.
Also realistically, the penalty should apply to all parties involved in a grapple. I you have ever done any type of grapple fighting, then you know you need both hands... Especially if you are the grapplee to fend off the grappler. Therefore I would say that if the grapplee wanted to attempt to gain control of the grapple, or escape without using both hands them they should take the -4 penalty for not having both hands free. Now, if the grapplee has a one handed or light weapon they can make a full attack action with the normal penalties for being grappled. The grapplee can also attempt to use the Escape Artist skill without incurring the -4 penalty.
There are plenty of option other than dropping your weapon in a grapple.
There are plenty of option other than dropping your weapon in a grapple.
And yet, there may be no CMB related options.
So a slippery little weasel might be able to Escape Artist his way out of a grapple without being disarmed in the process. But a strong, tough gladiator trained in all forms of combat including grappling, is probably screwed - he relies on STR, not DEX, so is probably not heavily invested in Escape Artist so relies on his CMB to escape, but he CANNOT use two hands but he MUST use two hands or suffer penalty, so he's automatically penalized.
Come to think of it, it doesn't matter if he drops his weapon or not - he CANNOT use two hands while grappled so he can hold his weapon in whichever hand he's not using and then try to break free with his other hand. Penalized, of course.
Unless that penalty really only applies to the initial grapple attempt and/or only applies to the "grappler", not the victim.
You are adept at the one-handed grab.
Prerequisite(s): Improved Grapple; base attack bonus +6, brawler's flurry class feature, or flurry of blows class feature.
Benefit: When you use this style, you do not take a –4 penalty on combat maneuver checks to grapple a foe with only one hand. Additionally, you do not lose your Dexterity bonus to AC while pinning an opponent.
Normal: Without two hands free, you take a –4 penalty on the combat maneuver roll to grapple a foe. While pinning a foe, you lose your Dexterity bonus to AC.
I'm building a Strangler Brawler, and so I'm researching all these grapple feats.
It isn't clear when these penalties apply, however - at the first attempt, or all during? It seems that, without this Feat, you should suffer a penalty at trying to maintain a grapple with only 1 hand.
Once you're grappling, you're no longer attempting to grapple. So the penalty should be meaningless by then.
I think if you have a Tentacle you should be able to Grab and grapple just fine with that. At the very least I'd think that the Tentacle would count as a hand so that one hand and a Tentacle free would meet the requirement.
Another thing which seems confusing is whether actually grappling somebody makes one or both of your hands stop being free. For instance, what if a PC with nothing in his hands used Crane Wing and then hit and grabbed somebody with a Tentacle? Would he still have a hand free for Crane Wing? What if he was holding something in one hand?
Another reason an aasimar or tiefling has it better. As they are not humanoids.
It seems like another instance of whats a game term and what isn't.
Humanoid as in creature type or the general english definition and the differences in the grappling terms.
Is the grappler the one in control of the grapple or both parties in the grapple?
Is attempting to grapple a not as yet grappled opponent a different type of check with different modifiers than the grapple check made during the grapple?
I'm starting to think "the grappler" is anyone making a grapple check for any part of the grapple. Therefore the penalty for not having two free hands would apply to both parties. That is unless the original attempt is defined as a different thing. With seperate rules. I could see it argued that way as well.
Another reason an aasimar or tiefling has it better. As they are not humanoids.
Interesting point.
I read the grapple rule that says "Humanoid creatures without two free hands...". But it doesn't say "Creatures of the Humanoid type without two free hands...".
In the first case, "humanoid" is just a word from the dictionary that describes a general body type. In the second case, "Humanoid type" is a game term. The grapple rule seems to be clearly using the first case. Otherwise, one could argue that an aasimar can initiate a grapple with just his eyelid. Or his little toe. Or his, er, whatever he wants. But, clearly, he's still humanoid and therefore limited by similar physiology resulting in the same physics that constrain ordinary humans and other creatures of the Humanoid Type.
The RAI (in my own opinion). Anyone starting or maintaining a grapple who has one or more hands occupied with trying to do anything other than grapple takes the penalty.
Start the grapple with a weapon in hand? Take the penalty.
Maintain with a weapon in hand? Take the penalty.
Reverse the grappled with a weapon in hand? Take the penalty.
Start, maintain, or reverse with neither hand occupied with holding another object? Then you can commit both hands towards the grapple attempt (even though being grappled limits you to only using one hand, I don't believe this limitation is intended to apply to grappling itself).