Adding Class Ability enhancements to Inertial armor or mage armor


Rules Questions


1 person marked this as FAQ candidate.

I am wondering if it would be possible to place class ability armor enhancements onto Inertial armor or Mage armor. I would think not but considering Inertial Armor creates a force effect thereby creating a physical manifestation of armor, it could reasonably be added to by other psionic/magical effects.

Example

Magus Arcana Warding from Unlimited Possibilities : New Magus Arcana

Warding:
Warding (Su): The magus may expend 1 point from his arcane pool as a swift action to grant any armor he is wearing a +1 enhancement bonus to AC for 1 minute.
For every four levels beyond 1st, the armor gains another +1 enhancement bonus, to a maximum of +5 at 17th level. These bonuses can be added to the armor, stacking with existing armor enhancement to a maximum of +5. Multiple uses of this ability do not stack with themselves. A magus of 5th level or higher can use these bonuses to add any of the following armor properties: fortification (light, moderate of heavy), ghost touch, invulnerability, and spell resistance. Adding these properties consumes an amount of bonus equal to the property’s base price modifier. The magus can also grant the following properties using the listed bonus cost: energy resistance (+4),glamered (+1), improved slick (+3), improved shadow (+3), jousting (APG)(+2), slick (+2), and shadow (+2). These properties are added to any the armor already has, but duplicates do not stack. If the armor is not magical, at least a +1 enhancement bonus must be added before any other properties can be added. These bonuses and properties are decided when the arcane pool point is expended and cannot be changed until the next time the magus uses this ability. These bonuses and properties are not functional if the armor is worn by anyone other than the magus. A magus can only enhance one suit of armor in this way at a time. If he uses the ability again, the first use immediately ends.

Shogahin


Yes for both inertial armor and mage armor. Mage armor is a conjuration (creation) spell, so it explicitly makes an actual, tangible set of armor with the described properties.


Expect table variation. There was a hotly debated thread a bit back about whether Mage Armor was a valid target for Magic Vestment. Mage Armor doesn't create "armor". It creates a field of force that provides an armor bonus. Thus, there's a question as to whether this is an intended, valid target for this type of effect.

My personal opinion is no. But like I said, YMMV.


Bracers of armor adds special armor properties to Mage Armor.

Bracers of armor:
These items appear to be wrist or arm guards, sometimes etched with symbols of protection or depictions of vigilant-looking animals. Bracers of armor surround the wearer with an invisible but tangible field of force, granting him an armor bonus of +1 to +8, just as though he were wearing armor. Both bracers of armor must be worn for the magic to be effective. Alternatively, bracers of armor can be enchanted with armor special abilities. See Table 3–3: Armor Special Abilities for a list of abilities. Special abilities usually count as additional bonuses for determining the market value of an item, but do not improve AC. Bracers of armor cannot have a modified bonus (armor bonus plus armor special ability bonus equivalents) higher than +8. Bracers of armor must have at least a +1 armor bonus to grant an armor special ability. Bracers of armor cannot have any armor special abilities that add a flat gp amount to their cost. Bracers of armor and ordinary armor do not stack. If the wearer receives a larger
armor bonus from another source, the bracers of armor cease
functioning and do not grant their armor bonus or their armor
special abilities. If the bracers of armor grant a larger armor
bonus, the other source of armor ceases functioning.

Shogahin


Bracers of Armor are magical items that are created using Mage Armor. That's not quite the same thing as Mage Armor itself benefiting from other magical enhancements. And it's also not necessarily clear that Bracers of Armor are valid targets for this ability (considering the cap at +5 enhancement bonus, the ability to add flat-cost enhancements, and the fact that Bracers aren't armor, just items that provide an armor bonus).

So once again, expect table variation because there likely isn't a straightforward, uniformly accepted answer at this point.


No, it is not physical armor, it is a force effect.


You're not wearing armor. You're getting a bonus from a force effect happening to have some similarity with real armor. But it's not armor.

And for Shoga : Bracers of Armor are a specific case that specifically allows armor properties. They're not armor by themselves.

Scarab Sages

Say you have +1 Padded Armor of Light Fortification, and someone's cast Mage Armor on you.

Do you effectively have a +4 Armor Bonus, and Light Fortification?

Or is it just one or the other?


You have a +4 armor bonus and no Light fortification. You only get the armor/spell/bracers that gives the most armor bonus...

Scarab Sages

I understand the Bracers have that text.

Is that the basis for your answer regarding Mage Armor?


Baku Shadescar,

RAW: The rules are silent
RAI: some people (including myself) believe that the intent is that you can only benefit from one armor (effect or real) at a time. This includes the special armor properties.

Other people believe that what you propose is fine.

Perhaps a FAQ thread should be made.

Scarab Sages

Sounds good.

A player asked me this just yesterday, and we went with the answer that Elicoor gave.

Figured this'd be a good thread to ask.

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

fretgod99 wrote:
Expect table variation. There was a hotly debated

I recommend not trying this, because you will trigger intense disagreement with some tables.

I wouldn't allow either and would reject them by my interpretation of RAW.

Scarab Sages

What "RAW" have you found to interpret?

(not being snarky, I just couldn't find anything when I searched)

Shadow Lodge

I'd point towards Instant Armor to debunk the Mage Armor/Magical Force Effect is not "real" armor, but I still think those against it would disagree.

As for the ide of Mage Armor + Magical Armor Properties/Enhancement Bonus, it's sort of a grey area. Normally, you can only benefit from one of them at a time, and it's a Standard Action to, for instance deactive one Ring and Activate another. You can wear as many magical rings as you want, but can only benefit normally from 2 of them at a time. This may or may not apply to Mage Armor and another Armor.

I'd allow it. Obviously other say no.

Scarab Sages

DM Beckett wrote:
Normally, you can only benefit from one of them at a time

I'm just curious, because you're not the only person who claims this, but where is this "normally" written?

Shadow Lodge

For Rings and similar things, it's in the Core Book.

Magic Items on the Body
HERE

Many magic items need to be donned by a character who wants to employ them or benefit from their abilities. It's possible for a creature with a humanoid-shaped body to wear as many as 15 magic items at the same time. However, each of those items must be worn on (or over) a particular part of the body, known as a “slot.”

A humanoid-shaped body can be decked out in magic gear consisting of one item from each of the following groups, keyed to which slot on the body the item is worn.

Armor: suits of armor.
Belts: belts and girdles.
Body: robes and vestments.
Chest: mantles, shirts, and vests.
Eyes: eyes, glasses, and goggles.
Feet: boots, shoes, and slippers.
Hands: gauntlets and gloves.
Head: circlets, crowns, hats, helms, and masks.
Headband: headbands and phylacteries.
Neck: amulets, brooches, medallions, necklaces, periapts, and scarabs.
Ring (up to two): rings.
Shield: shields.
Shoulders: capes and cloaks.
Wrist: bracelets and bracers.

Of course, a character may carry or possess as many items of the same type as he wishes. However, additional items beyond those in the slots listed above have no effect.

Some items can be worn or carried without taking up a slot on a character's body. The description of an item indicates when an item has this property.

For the Mage Armor deal, generally those against it are forming a double standard. It's NOT a "suite of armor" as far as being a physical thing you can touch, and thus target. But it IS a "suite of armor" in that it takes of the Armor Body Slot.

Scarab Sages

Okay.

I suppose I can see the argument against that as well, since Mage Armor is not an "additional item".

Thank you for the quote.


Mage armor does not take the 'Armor Body Slot', it's a spell force effect that provides an armor bonus.

Just like protection from evil provides a deflection bonus without taking a ring slot, and the shield spell provides a shield bonus without taking the shield slot.


Mage armour is also not a magic item, so those rules are flaky at best. You can't apply the magic item rules to mundane items or you get some very weird interactions (for example, wearing a suit of leather armour over the top to 'cancel out' the mundane properties of a set of full plate). Applying magic item rules to spells is similarly frought with peril.

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

Baku Shadescar wrote:
What "RAW" have you found to interpret?

An armor bonus even from force isn't armor.

Intant Armor explicitly says it makes Armor and replaces any armor worn. Unless the spell says that then it doesn't make armor.

Scarab Sages

That question was asked before Instant Armor was added to the discussion.

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