wall of stone:


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


i dont get why so many people like t his spell.
it' uses seem amazing until you read :

"each 5-foot square of the wall has hardness 8 and 15 hit points per inch of thickness. A section of wall whose hit points drop to 0 is breached. If a creature tries to break through the wall with a single attack, the DC for the Strength check is 20 + 2 per inch of thickness."

the thickness is " 1 inch thick per four caster levels"

so, lets take a caster lvl 9: the wall is 2'' thick, having hardness of 8 and 30 hp.

almost ANY monster this lvl can destroy a 5' thick in a single round.
sp - you are wasting a strong lvl 5 spell, to stop monsters for 1-2 rounds only? this seem .... odd.
also - lets say you cover a whole corridor, yes - with a blow you destroy a 5' wide (6 seconds! ) but how do you move the rubble?


You can use it for more than just a simple road block. It can make bridges, pave over hazards, separate groups from each other (do they spend a round regrouping, or take their chances separately?).

It can make instant defenses. Its duration is instantaneous, so it can't be dispelled and it never disappears on its own. Given a little time and multiple castings you can put several walls around a makeshift camp to turn it into a more defensible fort. Combine with Stone Shape and you can fine-tune the appearance and abilities of it (spiky wall might hurt creatures without weapons).

And never underestimate the power of guaranteeing an enemy will arrive a round later, or be temporarily cut off from someone.

Enclosing the enemy Cleric in a ring of stone stops him from healing people for at least a round. Blocking off a room full of guards while the rest of your team gets the drop on their leader (through careful use of Readied actions, perhaps) is a solid use.

It can be used to wall off peasants and other noncombatants so they're not harmed when you go all out against the enemy, or to take them out of the fight without killing them if they're mind controlled or have been whipped up into an angry mob.

Can be used as a source of cheap housing if you're going to be camping in an area for a while and don't want to sleep in tents.

It's a versatile spell you can do a lot with, in other words, as long as you're creative.


nice advice.
it's indeed versatile - i wish clerics had wall of force ..


I tend to agree with you, I find wall of force far superior as battlefield control. Wall of stone covers too small an area for my tastes and is too easy to either go around or through. I have never seen why it gets rated so highly.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

According to the rules, you cannot break stone doors and walls unless you have a hammer or pick suited to the task. That makes this spell MUCH nastier and worthy of its high level. It is literally possible to completely entomb someone, not only taking them out of the fight, but trapping them completely until they either suffocate and die, or until allies outside the tomb can break them out (which might not be any easier for them if they are similarly ill-equipped). The fact that it's a Reflex save, which is terribly low for most NPC foes, makes it even more formidable.

It's all in the Smashing an Object rules.

Relevant rule quotes:
Generally, you can smash an object only with a bludgeoning or slashing weapon.

Most melee weapons have little effect on stone walls and doors, unless they are designed for breaking up stone, such as a pick or hammer.


Ravingdork wrote:

According to the rules, you cannot break stone doors and walls unless you have a hammer or pick suited to the task. That makes this spell MUCH nastier and worthy of its high level. It is literally possible to completely entomb someone, not only taking them out of the fight, but trapping them completely until they either suffocate and die, or until allies outside the tomb can break them out (which might not be any easier for them if they are similarly ill-equipped). The fact that it's a Reflex save, which is terribly low for most NPC foes, makes it even more formidable.

It's all in the Smashing an Object rules.

Relevant rule quotes:
Generally, you can smash an object only with a bludgeoning or slashing weapon.

Most melee weapons have little effect on stone walls and doors, unless they are designed for breaking up stone, such as a pick or hammer.

First if all , I didn't know that...

But , how often is the foe a humanoid ?
Monster claws/ slam might do, especially as a large str 30 beast - like most cases at those levels....
But - dm might agree it will take longer for a giant to fist his way out ....


A hill giant with greatclub and PA (2d8+16 -8) could usually breach the wall in 2 hits = 1 round, but makes only a 5' hole, so he'd need to squeeze a lot when crawling through. Two holes would let him stand up, but he'd still be squeezing. He'd need 4 holes to get through unimpeded, and for 3 of those rounds the PCs would be attacking him and he wouldn't be fighting back.

A bog standard fire giant has a sword, so has to slam it instead. Let's hope he enjoys punching rocks. PA punches do 1d8+14 -8, averaging 10.5, so he's taking 3 or even 4 attacks to breach it. And he needs to make 5 or 6 breaches to get through.

Alternatively, they might just shoulder-charge the wall: DC24, vs +7 for the Hill Giant or +10 for the Fire Giant. Not simple. It's unclear whether they should either get the +4 size bonus they'd get for breaking a door down or make more than a 5' hole, but IMHO they certainly don't get to do both.

Alternatively, many undead, oozes and aberrations are stopped cold by a wall of stone, even at quite high CRs.

The sneaky thing to do (let's say there's a 10' wide corridor) is to run the wall not directly across the corridor, but at an angle down it. Now the enemy has to go smashing it up all the way along, during which it can't get past (or is squeezing) but is exposed to spells and missile fire.

And get this: "you can create a wall of stone in almost any shape you desire". So it's a zig-zag wall all along the corridor. Or it has arrow slits, if you feel like reducing the area (and hence the thickness).


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

You can also stack multiple walls against one another to make one really thick barricade.


The garbage pit room can be paved over. This spell is stupid useful. You can do the thick wall to block a hallway with one casting.


Used the diagonal trick with a wall of sound before. Sealed off the entrance for the reinforcements, greased the corridor, thwomed them with arrows into the wall, making the sound bursts. I like wall spells in general for manipulating the battlefield.

If someone has a group of archers from a high point, a wall of sound - or a wall of stone - or a wall of wind - right in front of them and the range threat is moot.


Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Put some ranks in engineering for best utilization.

Instant battlement, stairs, ramp, bridge, or any number of similar simple structures. It allows reshaping the battlefield to your needs. Could also make a dam across a small creek with it, alter the flow of a stream.

The Exchange

.I used it recently to counteract a surprise attack from a possessed water elemental. It nearly dropped my eidolon in its surprise round + first round attacks. Given the tank nature of my eidolon, that made it a huge threat to the party. Since it attacked with reach, I wall of stoned a barrier to completely block it off.

Remember each 30 hp only destroys 5 feet of rock. This huge elemental can't squeeze, unlike fire elementals. So it took the thing quite a number of turns to smash enough wall to step,through and re engage us.

That was time enough to buff up, prepare attacks and heal my eidolon.

Very useful spell.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
RDM42 wrote:

Used the diagonal trick with a wall of sound before. Sealed off the entrance for the reinforcements, greased the corridor, thwomed them with arrows into the wall, making the sound bursts. I like wall spells in general for manipulating the battlefield.

If someone has a group of archers from a high point, a wall of sound - or a wall of stone - or a wall of wind - right in front of them and the range threat is moot.

I've used the wall of sound and sleet storm spells to great effect in a few games. Just how many pieces of sleet are hitting said wall? Hundreds of pieces? Thousands?

Warriors in the party even started carrying bags of gravel just so they could throw handfuls of it at the wall whenever I conjured it up without having me to wait until my next turn to cast sleet storm.

Essentially auto-killed anyone standing next to the wall. :D


Ravingdork wrote:
RDM42 wrote:

Used the diagonal trick with a wall of sound before. Sealed off the entrance for the reinforcements, greased the corridor, thwomed them with arrows into the wall, making the sound bursts. I like wall spells in general for manipulating the battlefield.

If someone has a group of archers from a high point, a wall of sound - or a wall of stone - or a wall of wind - right in front of them and the range threat is moot.

I've used the wall of sound and sleet storm spells to great effect in a few games. Just how many pieces of sleet are hitting said wall? Hundreds of pieces? Thousands?

Warriors in the party even started carrying bags of gravel just so they could throw handfuls of it at the wall whenever I conjured it up without having me to wait until my next turn to cast sleet storm.

Essentially auto-killed anyone standing next to the wall. :D

Honestly, as a gm, I'd probably count a handful of gravel as one attack, thus one 'thwom" - or more or less, if it would cause one damage roll it causes one thwom.


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Item the first: a bunch of archers at the top of a protruding cliff with readied actions to attack in ambush anything they see pass by.

Item the second, invisible bard casting wall of sound across the front edge of the cliff.

Item the third, wizard, also invisible, casting wall of stone BEHIND them.

Item the fourth, cheeky melee guy walking out visible in FRONT of them.

Item the fifth, much carnage.

Dark Archive

666bender wrote:

i dont get why so many people like t his spell.

it' uses seem amazing until you read :

"each 5-foot square of the wall has hardness 8 and 15 hit points per inch of thickness. A section of wall whose hit points drop to 0 is breached. If a creature tries to break through the wall with a single attack, the DC for the Strength check is 20 + 2 per inch of thickness."

the thickness is " 1 inch thick per four caster levels"

so, lets take a caster lvl 9: the wall is 2'' thick, having hardness of 8 and 30 hp.

almost ANY monster this lvl can destroy a 5' thick in a single round.
sp - you are wasting a strong lvl 5 spell, to stop monsters for 1-2 rounds only? this seem .... odd.
also - lets say you cover a whole corridor, yes - with a blow you destroy a 5' wide (6 seconds! ) but how do you move the rubble?

Also remember that when attacking an object, you halve the damage before applying hardness. So for being attacked by enemies, it's more like it has hardness 16 and 60 HP


You only halve the damage for energy attacks.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Rynjin wrote:
You only halve the damage for energy attacks.

Still worth noting I think, as there are a lot of players and GMs out there who think they can just blow up walls willy nilly with their lightning bolts and fireballs. Truth is, it's a lot harder than one would think.


Depends on the object. I let Lightning Bolt do normal damage to wood, for instance.

Stone is pretty much safe from everything though.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Rynjin wrote:

Depends on the object. I let Lightning Bolt do normal damage to wood, for instance.

Stone is pretty much safe from everything though.

Oh? I'm not nearly as generous.


I've seen a few trees get lightning smote before.

It doesn't look like half damage to me.


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Rynjin wrote:

I've seen a few trees get lightning smote before.

It doesn't look like half damage to me.

Considering how much power real lightning has it might be half damage.


Fair enough. I'll stand by it though, game-wise.

The Exchange

Rynjin wrote:

I've seen a few trees get lightning smote before.

It doesn't look like half damage to me.

I was under the impression that trees get smashed by lightning because of the effect it has on the water inside them. Super heating or some such thing.

I could be misremembering something I read though.

Dry timber doesn't get hit at all I think.

Might make a difference for in game reasoning for wooden buildings and doors.

Then again, if your players are happy with it, who cares :)


A normal person can survive more than one lightning strike so...


Emmanuel Nouvellon-Pugh wrote:
A normal person can survive more than one lightning strike so...

Yes, but most fleshy things tend to be rather capable of stretching, bending, and generally being able to move... trees... not os much xD

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