Oracle wood vs Metal

[Zwordsman]

So which oracle do you think is better? Metal or Wood?
Primarily I'm looking at the defense and offensive options of the revelations

Metal gets medium armor without the speed lose and later dex penality. Gets dance of blades: gives 10ft speed bonus, and bonus to hit if you move, some anti range at higher levels Iron Weapon (SU) weapon starts as cold iron, then gets enhancment bonuses and later adamantine. Steel scarf (not super useful but totally fun, though gives a bit of range melee ability), also an ability to DR10/adamtine (as stone skin) once a day
Spells some Lead blades (1 lv bigger weapon)

Wood has, wood armour +4 bonus increasing at max to 10, dr 5/slashing 1hr per oracle lv,
Wood bond EX +1 (scaling) competence bonus to attack rolls made with wood weapons. Woden Weapons is basicaly the same as Iron weapons, except it is masterwork not cold iron, it gets keen later
Thorn burst is neat, swift 1d6/per two lv explsoion around you that makes temp caltrops
Spell wise.. shillelagh; which incrases the size by 2 (combined with the wood bonuses makes a nice lil weapon...) and barkskin.. which is an nice defense buff

It seems like Wood can get some higher damage from the created weapons (with the shillelagh stuff, wood bond and wood weapon's bonues) you also sorta end up psudu full bab to atttack with a wooden weapon. Psudo full BAB to hit, normal enhancment bonuses (though no special properties) and Keen. The wood armor is nifty, it scales pretty high and with dex, and bark skin some decent scaling AC. Just requires some prep.
Metal seems a bit weaker perhaps? It has the same to hit buff but you have to have moved at least 10ft that round.. Though perhaps if you liked charge attacks. It can use normal armor (which means that you can put other enchangments on it) DR 10/adamtine is nifty but once a day.1

On to the weapons creation things.. Wood lets you “ wooden club, quarterstaff, longspear, shortspear, or spear “ Metal is any simple or martial. Typically the base damage on martial stuff is much better than those of the wood yea? Also.. Spiked Heavy Shield is under martial and is mostly metal, might be intersting to make one in cases where I needed a shield

Spear/Long spear does 1D8 (I think the highest in that group ) so two size categories bigger is what? Large becomes 2d6, so the next after that is 3d6?
Near as I can see on all the metal weapons is they top at 2d6 so 3d6 with lead blades (2handed also) Though they offer a hell of a lot more variety in choices.

Hm.. you can't use weapon fineese for the metal weapons or the wooden weapons unless they replicate a weapon that naturally able to use weapon fineese for right? (would be awesome to use a scythe with dex)

I didn't really look much at lv 20 stuff, but off hand I like the metal's lv 20 more; though wood has some neat effects
overall metal sounds more fun flavor wise, (though Ireally like the wood's armor since less weight etc)

There is of course the ancestrial one as well but most of the moves seem limited to once or twice per day stuff instead of CHA times stuff

If I missed an oracle class that has a similar thing feel free to point it out to me.

[Ipslore the Red]

First, better for what? And yes, two categories above 1d8 is 3d6 according to enlarge person's table.

My snap judgment is that wood oracles are better for support and metal oracles are better for melee.

[XMorsX]

For a battle Oracle, Metal is better IMO. You can effectively cancel the drawback of the Lame curse. Skill at Arms is really all you need and you can take the Dual-Cursed archetype in order to add more great revelations. Wood also seems interesting but a bit inferior.

Neither mystery is suited for a support / caster Oracle, but Oracles still remain full divine casters so they can still be great casters.

[Zwordsman]

Basically what you answered haha thanks!

Just trying to figure out which is better generically. your answer is good enough I suppose. I don't have any real experience with higher level stuff so I wasn't sure about the major differences. Since they looked sorta equal, mostly looking for opinions from people on the two mysteries.

[pendothrax]

I would go for which feels better for the charactor. I play builder/artificer charactors alot, so I would favor metal over wood. Buth you should justgo with which is better for the character you want to play.

[Zwordsman]

haha yeah. I'm leaning towards Metal.. just because I like the idea of forming metal weapons over wood (it's easier for me to imagine).
Honestly I like the stone mystery more than any other mystery but it doesn't give some things I like to have in this sorta game. (heavens is cool too but not many offensive revelations there. as I don't like "once or twice" a day abilities (I always feel like I wasted it after I use it haha)

Metal is probably hands down if I didn't really like "on command armor" for as often as we end up naked haha.

[ArmouredMonk13]

Zwordsman wrote:

(heavens is cool too but not many offensive revelations there. as I don't like "once or twice" a day abilities (I always feel like I wasted it after I use it haha)

Well, it has got [one of] the best offensive revelations the class has to offer. Awesome Display. Because Colorspray+Pumped Save DC="I Win" cone.

[Zwordsman]

Yeah.. but its a bit too one note for my group to enjoy it sadly.. first sorc I played used it a ton but peeps didn't enjoy it too much in the end haha.

[qutoes]

Wood makes a pretty good switch hitter bow/spear or archer support.
I'm pretty sure you can't use shillelagh on a spear though.

Metal is WAY better melee.

Just my 2 cents.

[Imbicatus]

Wood gets effective full BAB on iterative, Where Metal only gets full effective bab when they move, so they are not as accurate if they want to full attack. Spells help, but a full attacking wood oracle will always have +5 to hit over a full attacking metal oracle.

Metal is much stronger defensively, but it isn't clearly better in melee.

[Zwordsman]

Oh right.. club or staff no spear.. helps me lean a bit to metal.

the bab considerations is hard, unless I was a charger but I don't know much about that.

[MyTThor]

qutoes wrote:

Wood makes a pretty good switch hitter bow/spear or archer support.

I'm pretty sure you can't use shillelagh on a spear though.

Metal is WAY better melee.

Just my 2 cents.

Absolutely disagree that metal is better melee. It should be, but a lot of the abilities fall short.

Lead blades is a good spell and Keen edge is early entry, which is cool, but check out the revelations:
Armor mastery sucks unless you have high dex, which you won't.
Dance of the blades is great, but one of the cool features, the 20% miss chance option, is a move action, so it's better for when you're casting or something. You're not going to lose your full attack to use it.
Iron constitution is meh
Iron Skin is good, but very restricted use and only high level
Iron weapon is not going to keep pace with what you really need to be a primary melee, so basically it'll be for emergencies only
Riddle of steel is useless, even if you want to craft it's not overwhelming
Rusting grasp is lame and situational
Skill at arms is ok but I'd rather dip fighter
Steel scarf is useless. Taking a standard action to do something you're almost guaranteed to be not very good at.
Vision in Steel is useless in combat.

So you've got 2 good melee revelations, 3 after 11th level, 1 good and 1 ok melee spells.

Compare that with wood.

Shillelagh is great at low levels, barkskin is awesome at any level,
Wood weapon is better than iron weapon because you can combine with wood bond
wood bond is great for the reason above along with the combo of transmute metal to wood and ironwood. Basically gives you full BaB with any wooden weapon (bows anyone?). As long as you choose a wooden weapon, you're a full caster with full BaB. That's insane. You just don't get iteratives on the same schedule. Good thing you can cast blessing of fervor.
Wood armor is great, buff it all day with magic vestment.

Wood gets better utility spells and revelations, too. Wood is better at everything except crafting (and metal isn't even that good of a crafter).

[XMorsX]

Wood certainly has its perks. But the fact that crit fishing is the best way to deal damage as a battle oracle menas that even after all the advantages Wood has over Metal, metal weapons are going to be superior. Skill at arms is definately great, dipping Fighter is suboptimal at anything but the low levels if you do not intend to reach high level spells.

Transmute metal to wood is a high lvl spell and does give -2 penalty on attack and damage rolls, almost cancelling the main advantage of the Wood mystery, the higher BAB. Ironwood does the trick but it is still a pretty late entry too.

That being said, Wood after all might make a more effective character. But it certainly needs more effort. A metal Oracle with just Skill at Arms has a martial weapon and heavy armor from level 1.

[Umbranus]

Wood bond has the problem of bonus type. The competence bonus is rather easy to come by and doesn't stack. So you could easiely end up with an ability that does nothing.

[Zwordsman]

I've rarely seen competence before, what are some common things off the top of the head? (likely spells or bard stuff perhaps? I've never played a buffer, or a buffee and we rarely have bards)

[Caimbuel]

Wood does well as an archer

[Umbranus]

Caimbuel wrote:

Wood does well as an archer

Most archers want bracers of falcon's aim because they are just too good to ignore. And they give a competence bonus to hit which doesn't stack with wood bond. Same is true for bracers of archery.

I can't add more magic items giving competence bonuses to attack but I think there are some. Most will be such that duplicate spell effects.
Then there are, as stated bards and buff spells.

[sunbeam]

To me it all comes down to whether you are allowed to cast Magic Vestment on your Wood Armor. It becomes pretty good at this point. What's freaking silly, is that I think RAW reads like Magic Vestment is perfectly viable for some Oracle mysteries that get armor, like Wood and Bone, but not for others with more nebulous fluff like Shadow and Wind.

Though it isn't specifically addressed either way, so it is up to your dm. No idea about PFS.

Mechanically with the +5 bonus built in I think Wood is a better combatant. Competence bonuses might be available, but you can say that about a lot of bonuses.

Then too you can become a Treant whenever you want eventually. As far I can tell, you can resummon your wood armor (if it didn't stay with you), then summon your weapon.

So you are a Huge(? have to check srd) tree that swings a telephone pole or Greatclub.

I think this is kind of wonky. As far as I understand, you lose your gear if you shapeshift to a Treant. But you can immediately summon some using your oracle revelations.

Then too it isn't defined whether you get Wood Bond with your slam attacks as a Treant, or maneuvers if you use those.

[Diekssus]

I personally have never heard oracle wood music, but I doubt its better then metal, metal is awesome.