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You have a few options. The witch list is terrible on its own for defenses, imo. Some of the patrons give the classic wizard defenses such as mirror images, but that requires you to actually pick that patron. You can always use potions or UMD and use pragmatic activator to help you excel at it. Potion of invisibility and the like have saved my life plenty of times and have lots of utility. You can also shut your foes down before they shut you down, but results may vary and that's not really the same as putting up a defense.
You can also bump up your AC the normal ways, amulet of natural armor ring of deflection, mithral buckler/light shield, silken ceremonial gown, etc. That cost gold though and likely everyone else is doing it too.
The best way imo, is to get a bunch of mooks... er... minions! er... no... Henchmen? Hey, what's the word... Those other people in your party. Yeah! those guys. Put them in front of you.
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The best way imo, is to get a bunch of mooks... er... minions! er... no... Henchmen? Hey, what's the word... Those other people in your party. Yeah! those guys. Put them in front of you.
Minions!*raises fist* They prefer that to "henchmen."
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The best way imo, is to get a bunch of mooks... er... minions! er... no... Henchmen? Hey, what's the word... Those other people in your party. Yeah! those guys. Put them in front of you.Minions!*raises fist* They prefer that to "henchmen."
We called them "meat shields" back when I used to play Cyberpunk 2020.
I don't understand. You just described exactly how your witch protected herself.
You have a few options. The witch list is terrible on its own for defenses, imo. Some of the patrons give the classic wizard defenses such as mirror images,
THIS
I wouldn't play a witch without mirror image!
Armour, lots of it. Hexes can generally be cast in full plate, if you want to. When you do want to cast, have something easy to put on and take off.
I've got a Wizard with a Shield in a PbP game. Ended up getting it for totally IC reasons, but it turns out to actually work great. Also have an armoured coat. I can be unarmed in one round if I need to, and my cruising AC is pretty good in the meantime. In a few levels I'll be able to enchant both of them, and actually keep my AC going up.
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At lower levels, my tiefling witch likes to use the Flight hex to levitate out of reach, but as you point out, this has a weakness against archers.
At somewhat higher levels, my party was rescuing hostages held by a barbarian tribe. I used Cloak of Dreams. Any barbarian that made it close enough to me to attack found himself asleep at my feet. This was made especially effective when the bard used Lullaby.
Unfortunately question, you've enumerated all the weaknesses of the witch... the only thing to help you know is items. Which you cant afford.
Obscuring mist isnt a bad idea, and there are goggles to allow you to see through it. The fullplate idea isnt bad, but it will limit you to hexes & certain spells. You've discovered the great limits of the witch spell list, and now mainly items can help you.
Note: The spell "threefold aspect" (which you should be able to get since it's level 4 for the witch) can give you decent boosts to stats. You can change between forms as a standard action, and in a low-wealth campaign I would see this as a standard witch spell (IE, cast on self every day).
Witches have a lot of options when a single melee guy attacks her.
There are a lot of spells and/or hexes that greatly reduce the danger enemies pose.
Let's say you are standing in the obscuring mist and a melee guy attacks you. What can you do?
Spells that could help:
- Glitterdust (most strong melees have low will save)
- webbolt
- beguiling gift + poison or whatever*
- Summon monster X
- Summon swarm
- Symbol of mirroring
- Armor lock
- call the void (very underrated spell)
- Fly
Some of those only really help if you can take more than 1 or 2 hits. But if you keep a strong melee busy for some time that should give your friends the time to help. I did not include 4th level spell because you still only will have few of those.
*depending on the weapon the enemy uses other things might help, too. If you for example hand him a broken dagger he has to use it for one round. And he might have to drop his normal weapon to take that broken dagger.
Have a cursed item? hand him this cursed item and he can't stop using it.
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The witch is really good at escaping and not bad at defense. One thing she can not do well is to stand and deliver. D&D/PF isnt set up for solo play. Some people have enough mastery to pull that off, but even they can only do it with a few classes at the right levels with the right gear. Your best option in that situation was to either regroup or escape.
Ring of Invisibility asap.
There is also having a small familiar, casting reduce person on yourself, then jumping on the familiar's back and having it full round run away.
Really witches shouldn't be far from the party unless you have a cohort who can keep you alive.
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@Question
Hello fellow witch player!
Most of good advice was already given, but there is few things that people didn't mention.
There is option also to keep disguise up. Typically enemies will prefer to target squishy casters if they get a chance. Disguise Self or wearing a mock armor can deceive them into thinking that you are full-plate user.
You also wish to ignore AC. Keep Mage Armor up to prevent iterative attacks if any, but don't bother with it much. Problem is that it will never be high enough for you. Instead focus on miss chance and a lot of hit points.
- Potion of Displacement will for example grant you survivability far greater then armor, but it costs some money. Potion of Blur is cheaper.
- Keep False Life always up. Buy a wand if you wish. It's best investment.
- Buy Belt of Con +2.
- Summoned creatures (Lantern Archon has Aid at will) can grant you some buffs. I stacked on my witch 30 temporary hp last session.
There you go. Hope it helps!
Malag
Casters, even the witch, can have great AC. At level 11 you can get around 30 without much trouble. But, it requires you to not hyper optimize ability scores and actually invest in things like dexterity. :) A mere 16 dex is a constant +3. Never discount the pluses. Also, light armor proficiency and the light armor arcane training feats are not bad investments. You can very quickly out-AC mage armor for cheap and have nifty armor abilities, too, many of which, are very nice, even for casters. Shield, barkskin, etc just stack the bonuses.
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@Buri
I can see this happening for a regular wizard, but witches list only knows Mage Armor. This present's big problem if you plan to stack armor, altho it's not impossible, just very hard.
But now that you mentioned, having UMD might be great idea for a witch. Grabing all those foreign spells on wands. Oh joy!
Malag
Symbol of Mirroring, Secure Shelter, Solid Fog, Black Tentacles, Summon Monster, Stinking Cloud, Web, Haunting Mists. Those are just spells on your list, not including patron spells.
Hat of Disguise is super cheap. Get separated, obscuring mist, disguise, send people that run in the wrong direction.
@Buri
I can see this happening for a regular wizard, but witches list only knows Mage Armor. This present's big problem if you plan to stack armor, altho it's not impossible, just very hard.
But now that you mentioned, having UMD might be great idea for a witch. Grabing all those foreign spells on wands. Oh joy!
Malag
Indeed. The pragmatic activator trait is probably one of the most broken out there.
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Summon Monster all the way! Throw up an Obscuring Mist and just start summoning. Summoning one thing off your most powerful list or a few things off of a lesser list should be more than enough to handle any mooks that come your way, or at least buy you a turn or three against more competent foes.
Level 7 means you can now summon multiple Lantern Archons at once. They have DR 10/evil, which means they can soak up plenty of low-damage hits. They can spam Aid to give 1d8 + 3 temporary HP, as well as a ranged touch light ray that ignores DR. And of course, they can always use Aid Another to boost your AC against any baddie that gets close.
SMIV can also get you a Lion for pure mook-destroying Pounce damage, a Grizzly to grapple your foes, a Hound Archon (free Magic Circle Against Evil!), a mephit for SLAs (Dust Mephits can cast Blur and Wind Wall, Water Mephits can cast Acid Arrow and Stinking Cloud)... the list goes on.
Bah. I see your slumber and raise you being immune to mind-affecting.
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Bah. I see your slumber and raise you being immune to mind-affecting.
I take your slumber and raise you an icey tomb. Undead have good will saves anyway.
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Bah. I see your slumber and raise you being immune to mind-affecting.I take your slumber and raise you an icey tomb. Undead have good will saves anyway.
I'll take your slumber and Icy Tomb and raise you a Death Curse as I run my elven arse wearing a ring of freedom of movement away.
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Slumber everything!
Sounds like that strategy would have ended in disaster :p
"She was a witch, after all. And precisely because she was a witch, and therefore sensible, she put little faith in protective amulets and spells; she saved it all for a foot-long bread knife which she kept in her belt." -Terry Prachett and Neil Gaiman, Good Omens
Okay, so that's less than helpful for the game... XD It's really hard to be good at everything, though, so perhaps you should look into getting some "emergency escape" ability for future troublesome situations?
"She was a witch, after all. And precisely because she was a witch, and therefore sensible, she put little faith in protective amulets and spells; she saved it all for a foot-long bread knife which she kept in her belt." -Terry Prachett and Neil Gaiman, Good OmensOkay, so that's less than helpful for the game... XD It's really hard to be good at everything, though, so perhaps you should look into getting some "emergency escape" ability for future troublesome situations?
Awesome book :). Also, your quote just gave me a great idea for a hexcrafter magus!
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You could use the web spell.
Tangling up some of the attackers will help, along with cover from the arrows.
Unless the attackers have torches. Then you should run very fast.
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Invisibility + Summon Swarm is incredibly effective.
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Question you need party support. The witch cant shut down archers and kill them by herself. Your best bet is to go defense until you can regroup and then reevaluate your options at that time.Im concerned about how a few low level archers was enough to completely shut me down and remove me from combat while the rest of my party did all the work...
Of course if the archers were all standing one nice clump, i could easily shut them down with a single spell, but they werent. Most of them were concealed and the rest were all spread out and in the open where web had no effect.
Some days you get the dragon and some days the dragon gets you. Soemtimes a character is just out of their element which is why the game is based on playing as a team. Folks have been kind enough to offer plenty of suggestions but none seem to work for you. Not sure what to say now question.
...also we cant afford potions, etc as its a low wealth campaign. We just got enough gold at level 7 to afford our first +2 stat items.
A potion of vanish is incredibly cheap. If you can afford a +2 stat item, you can get a whole bag of potions of vanish. Or if your UMD is decent a wand of vanish (or other 1st level defensive spell) is even a better buy.
A tower shield in your bag of holding that you whip out and hide behind so the archers can't hit you. So what if you're not proficient. All you are doing is hiding behind it until friends can come to your rescue. Or prop it up with a couple of poles, drink a potion of vanish, and run away.
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But basically, that is the weakness of the squishy classes. Yes, eventually phenomenal magical power. But if you don't have surprise or defending buddies you are in trouble.
A friend of mine never plays a wizard, sorcerer, or witch without taking a level of some martial class to make him more survivable. Not saying that is the best strategy, but the fact that he feels like it is necessary shows that they can have issues.
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Though Summon Swarm and Vomit Swarm are nice, they do lack one thing: Control over the Swarm. This can cause some risk to the party.
What you need is Swarm Skin. You can get a variation of swarm types, MULTIPLE SWARMS, control of sais swarm(s), and indefinite duration/distance. The drawback is that you lose your body, literally. They become bones. The good thing though is that you can command your swarm to go back to your body or when your swarms get killed, then poof, you are back. The real risk is if your bones are destroyed, then you die when you go back. Just hide your bones in a bag of holding or something. Or when your bones are destroyed, have someone cast Mending on them while you wait in a wasp swarm.
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Though Summon Swarm and Vomit Swarm are nice, they do lack one thing: Control over the Swarm. This can cause some risk to the party..I beg to differ sir with regards to Vomit Swarm.
That is workable control in my book. And it's not a full round action like Summon Swarm.
You vomit forth a swarm of spiders that attacks all other creatures within its area. The swarm begins adjacent to you, but if no living creatures are within its area, it moves in one direction of your choosing at its normal speed. You can move the swarm or change the swarm's direction by spending a standard action to concentrate on the swarm, otherwise it continues moving in its current direction.
The problem would be corners. Since you cannot change direction during movement (standard action to move a changed direction), it will take two rounds to go to the corner and then turn at the corner.
I played a samurai with witch in the party and witch protection was always priority number one. Our witch used Dimension Door, flight, and summons to good effect, minimizing how often I had to come to her rescue. IMO if you are separated from the party your focus should be on rejoining the party ASAP instead of trying to fight on your own.