People are soft cover. Soft cover is not concealment and does not allow you to make a Stealth check. So just the -4 to attack, +4 to enemy AC.
{Edited to remove inaccurate information}
Cover
To determine whether your target has cover from your ranged attack, choose a corner of your square. If any line from this corner to any corner of the target's square passes through a square or border that blocks line of effect or provides cover, or through a square occupied by a creature, the target has cover (+4 to AC).
Given the above excerpt from the Combat section, I would be surprised if a 5' step would be enough to clear the cover penalty. I would still think that, even if you picked the most beneficial square of your ranged attacker's square, that the line drawn to determine cover didn't pass through your teammate's square on at least one of the target's square's corners.
I can see you successfully getting this to work with more squares of movement, though.
EDIT: Dangit! ninja'd by Howie.
Thanks, guys. How about if it were a large creature?
Would he still be considered to have cover even though most of him (the squares directly in front of the ranged character and above the ally's head) are clear?
Choose any corner of your square.
Draw a line from that corner to every corner of the target's square.
Are any of those lines passing through a square or border of the ally?
If so, the target has soft cover.
Your DM may rule that more than half of the creature is visible, thus reducing the cover bonus to +2. (Partial cover, subject to GM's discretion)
Okay, one more question that is somewhat related. For a character using a reach weapon, is there a feat or feat tree that will reduce or eliminate an enemy's soft cover AC bonus for attacking around an ally? I know IPS will do it for ranged.
Nope, not that I would know of.
Choose any corner of your square.Draw a line from that corner to every corner of the target's square.
Are any of those lines passing through a square or border of the ally?
If so, the target has soft cover.
Your DM may rule that more than half of the creature is visible, thus reducing the cover bonus to +2. (Partial cover, subject to GM's discretion)
Grick - Just want to get your meaning of border. Some GMs consider this situation cover, some don't.
Example:
xxxE
CAxx
Does E (enemy) have cover from C (character) because his line travels along the border of A (ally)?
Grick - Just want to get your meaning of border. Some GMs consider this situation cover, some don't.
Does E (enemy) have cover from C (character) because his line travels along the border of A (ally)?
Using this example
Cover: "To determine whether your target has cover from your ranged attack, choose a corner of your square. If any line from this corner to any corner of the target's square passes through a square or border that blocks line of effect or provides cover, or through a square occupied by a creature, the target has cover (+4 to AC)."
Choosing a top corner of C's green square, and drawing a line to a bottom corner of E's red square. Does that line pass through a border?
The same situation would occur if E moved left 2 squares to be directly diagonally adjacent to C (above A). That seems silly, so I would probably rule that top border doesn't provide cover or block line of effect.
With your interpretation you wouldn't have a clear shot in the following situation:
XAXX
CXXE
XAXX
and that seems like it must be wrong. You would always have cover in a 5-foot wide hallway, so maybe borders don't work like that? You can resolve this if colinear sightlines and borders don't count as "passing through"
With your interpretation you wouldn't have a clear shot in the following situation:
If you mean me, I said in the above example that the enemy would not have cover. This would also apply to your example.
You can resolve this if colinear sightlines and borders don't count as "passing through"
There are two things to consider in the rule:
A) Does the line pass through a square or border?
and
B) Does that square or border block line of effect or provide cover?
I'm more comfortable ruling that it does pass through the border, but that border does not provide cover.
|
I think if you keep in mind that it says through a border, not along a border, then it is a lot clearer. The targeting lines have to penetrate a square that provides cover by going through a border, not merely move along the edge of a border, in order for there to be cover.
While the typical cover is provided by a character or obstacle that is in between the archer and target, the situation in which a border is penetrated, but the targeting line does not go through the square would be when the target is in the same square as the obstacle that provides cover. Examples might include shooting at a helpless creature in the same square as the target, a target behind cage or screen that was determined to provide cover, etc.
There is not -4 to your attack roll because you an ally is providing soft cover. There is a +4 to the enemies AC if someone is in in between you and the target.
Mathematically it makes no difference if those are the only two, but in game terms a penalty to your attack roll, and cover for an opponent are two different things.
Soft Cover: Creatures, even your enemies, can provide you with cover against ranged attacks, giving you a +4 bonus to AC. However, such soft cover provides no bonus on Reflex saves, nor does soft cover allow you to make a Stealth check.
|
I didn´t know this; we always thought it was hard enough with a -4 to hit when firing into meleé, but -8! Who would ever want to play an archer? Is this really correct?
Asmo
Because players can take feats to negate those penalties. Precise Shot can be taking at level 1 by any human if they take Point-Blank Shot first, or any fighters at level 1. Ranged rangers can take it at level 2.
Improved Precise Shot is much harder to obtain, but a ranged ranger can take it at level 6.
You make it sound like it's impossible to do, when it in fact it's extremely easy to get good ranged characters created.
And if used cleverly, a 5-foot step can get you out of that trouble, too, and you're still able to use a full-attack action the same round.
Ruyan.