Question:
Do people here play that you have to declare the use of Cleave before you roll any attacks? I've always GMed that you can wait and declare cleave after you roll your first to-hit.
Is there a way this would somehow benefit you? If you have the opportunity to cleave and you're not taking a full attack, why would you not do so?
Do people here play that you have to declare the use of Cleave before you roll any attacks? I've always GMed that you can wait and declare cleave after you roll your first to-hit.
Cleave is a standard action.
If you use your standard action to cleave, you gain the benefits and penalties of doing so.
If you use your standard action to do something else, for example to use the attack action, then you do not get the benefits nor penalties of using cleave.
Is there a way this would somehow benefit you? If you have the opportunity to cleave and you're not taking a full attack, why would you not do so?
It's so if he misses the first attack and doesn't get the chance to attack another target, he does not take the -2 penalty to AC until his next turn.
Question:
Do people here play that you have to declare the use of Cleave before you roll any attacks? I've always GMed that you can wait and declare cleave after you roll your first to-hit.
Since it specifically requires an action to use, it must be declared.
Lovely; thanks. Am I right in thinking this is not the case for Cleaving Finish? That is, you attack someone and if you happen to kill them you can attack someone else, even if you didn't declare it initially?
Lovely; thanks. Am I right in thinking this is not the case for Cleaving Finish? That is, you attack someone and if you happen to kill them you can attack someone else, even if you didn't declare it initially?
Cleaving Finish is a feat that happens as needed. It requires no specific game action to activate it's use. It auto activates when the conditions are fulfilled, much like the 3.5 incarnation of the original Cleave feat.
On that note if you use cleave on Goblin A and hit and then crit goblin B with the second attack can you use cleaving finish on Goblin A to try to kill them.
I don't see why not.
Or the following scenario not using cleave:You full attack: Main attack on BBEG. Iterative attack on flunky, dropping them. Finishing cleave on BBEG at full BAB bonus.
-James
You can't do it because attacking in that fashion you're taking a full attack action, and cleave takes a standard action to activate...
unless houseruled otherwise...
He means Cleaving Finish which can happen after any attack that drops a foe to 0 or fewer HP.
So do people even get to use cleave that often? I took it at level 1 with my barbarian, and he's up to level 4 now. I think I've had opponents standing next to each other where I could cleave them maybe twice. The situation just rarely comes up.
It depends on the DM and on the game, in Kingmaker my ranger used cleave twice in 10 levels (i had taken in 3rd level).
So do people even get to use cleave that often? I took it at level 1 with my barbarian, and he's up to level 4 now. I think I've had opponents standing next to each other where I could cleave them maybe twice. The situation just rarely comes up.It depends on the DM and on the game, in Kingmaker my ranger used cleave twice in 10 levels (i had taken in 3rd level).
Indeed. I have a fighter in PFS who generally acts as the meatshield - they've never played a scenario, out of the six so far, where they haven't used cleave at least once.
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I am currently running a 9th level barbarian in a Legacy of Fire campaign who is all about cleave, great Cleave, finishing Cleave (and soon the improved version of Finichgin Cleage). Add in vital Strike, raging Leaper and jumping in from above and a paltry potion of enlarge person and the results are stunning. Enlarge increases the damage die and -- more importantly -- gives reach. Do this and the damage dealing power of the barbarian using cleave and its variants per round is truly amazing.
To quote Azmyth "that's so broken, it's stupid."
I am currently running a 9th level barbarian in a Legacy of Fire campaign who is all about cleave, great Cleave, finishing Cleave and improved version of same. Add in vital Strike, raging Leaper and Death from Above and a paltry potion of enlarge person and the results are stunning. Enlarge increases the damage die and -- more importantly -- gives reach. Do this and the damage dealing power of the barbarian using cleave and its variants per round is truly amazing.
It doesn't seem broken.
If you charge from higher ground (or are allowed to jump as part of the charge, and the jump somehow counts as higher ground) you get an extra +2 to hit, but can't use Vital Strike or Cleave/GCleave.
If you Cleave/GCleave, you can't use VS, and the foes must be adjacent to each other.
If you Vital Strike, you can't use Cleave or Charge.
That seems like a lot of feats that can't ever be used together.
-edit- that's 7 feats, a 9th level barbarian, even if human, should only have 6. Are you getting a feat via rage power?
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I don't have improved Finishing Cleave (yet); nor am I using Death from Above, as such... we have discussed adding it in however and its effects. My PC can routinely jump 50' in one move (high acrobatics skill, raging leaper, ring of jumping and boots of striding and springing) and as a raging leaper he can do it from a standing start. Sometimes, the GM has provided that with a situational bonus effect.
The damage dealing capability of the barbarian so equipped and armed is exceptionally high. I'm routinely doing 90-100 points a round with three attacks (if hasted); often more when a five target great cleave is involved. It is pretty awesome to behold.
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Indeed. I have a fighter in PFS who generally acts as the meatshield - they've never played a scenario, out of the six so far, where they haven't used cleave at least once.So do people even get to use cleave that often? I took it at level 1 with my barbarian, and he's up to level 4 now. I think I've had opponents standing next to each other where I could cleave them maybe twice. The situation just rarely comes up.It depends on the DM and on the game, in Kingmaker my ranger used cleave twice in 10 levels (i had taken in 3rd level).
My barbarian is level 4 in PFS, one scenario from level 5, and I've had cleave and insisted on being at the front of the marching order since day one. As I said, I've used cleave exactly twice. Whenever there are multiple enemies, they're usually trying to spread out and flank us, so they're rarely next to each other. Cleave is great when it's usable, but I just rarely get to use it.
Whenever there are multiple enemies, they're usually trying to spread out and flank us, so they're rarely next to each other.
You need to get in a game with Steel Wind's DM. Five guys in a line!
A large sized barbarian wielding a fauchard is looking at a 15 foot Cleave Zone with an 18-20 weapon. Fun times.
Edit: Technically 10 as the adjacent spots are off limits.
A large sized barbarian wielding a fauchard is looking at a 15 foot Cleave Zone with an 18-20 weapon. Fun times.
Edit: Technically 10 as the adjacent spots are off limits.
It's still a ton of potential spaces, the problem is filling them up so they're still adjacent.
jdragnar, first...nice necro.
Second, yes it is it's own standard action that cannot be combined with other standard actions.
Benefit: As a standard action, you can make a single attack at your full base attack bonus against a foe within reach. If you hit, you deal damage normally and can make an additional attack (using your full base attack bonus) against a foe that is adjacent to the first and also within reach. You can only make one additional attack per round with this feat. When you use this feat, you take a –2 penalty to your Armor Class until your next turn.