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Simple question, is there any class out there that gives you the ability to take power attack as a bonus feat without meeting the prerequisites?
I decided to take the Monk of Many Styles Archetype, and to avoid the multiple ability dependency of the monk I took a -9 strength to increase my wisdom more and eventually get the guided weapon property on my Amulet of Mighty fists. Now I'm planning my character out and I was looking at getting tiger style to apply my negatives to hit from power attack to AC but I would be unable to get power attack to complement it.
Two levels of Ranger and take Two handed weapon fighting style and you can get Power attack without meeting the requirements.
The Two-Handed Weapon combat style for Rangers(see the APG) has Power Attack as a possible bonus feat, so you could get it without a 13 Strength for a two-level dip.
EDIT: Ninja'd
Simple question, is there any class out there that gives you the ability to take power attack as a bonus feat without meeting the prerequisites?
I decided to take the Monk of Many Styles Archetype, and to avoid the multiple ability dependency of the monk I took a 9 strength to increase my wisdom more and eventually get the guided weapon property on my Amulet of Mighty fists. Now I'm planning my character out and I was looking at getting tiger style to apply my negatives to hit from power attack to AC but I would be unable to get power attack to complement it.
Can you even use Power attack with Unarmed strikes?
They are always considered light weapons which means power attack wouldn't affect them. Piranah Strike would be the way to go.
Do you have to use just your unarmed strikes though? A temple sword is a one-handed weapon, and a quarterstaff is a two-hander.
Got Power Attack and double handing mixed up sorry for that.
Piranha strike seems good but the wording in the Tiger Pounce feat specifies power attack so unless there was a GM who ruled it I would think that it wouldn't qualify for the feat.
As for that, are you concerned about meeting the pre-requisites for Tiger Pounce?
Because the Bonus Feat entry for the Master of Many Styles specifically states you don't need those prerequisites (except the Style feat itself and Elemental Fist). So you can take Tiger Pounce without actually having Power Attack. I'm pretty sure you don't have to be 8th level for it either, and can actually take it at 1st level if you're a Master of Many Styles.However, I'm not sure you can apply the attack penalty for Piranha Strike to AC with that feat, that would require some talk to the GM, but taking the feat itself isn't a problem
Unless your really planning on charging alot or using the other special options Dragon Style may not be for you. It won't increase the damage from Guided so keep that in mind as well.
Oh... one thing you might want to consider however: You can use enhancement from items to qualify for feats.
So if you get a belt of +4 strength and wear it for at least 24 hours, then your 9 str is enough and you can get Power Attack and use it, as long as you wear the belt.
Yes, if it gets dispelled or you run into an area of anti-magic etc etc, it goes all away, but if you really want it, that may be a way you can go
Simple question, is there any class out there that gives you the ability to take power attack as a bonus feat without meeting the prerequisites?
I decided to take the Monk of Many Styles Archetype, and to avoid the multiple ability dependency of the monk I took a 9 strength to increase my wisdom more and eventually get the guided weapon property on my Amulet of Mighty fists. Now I'm planning my character out and I was looking at getting tiger style to apply my negatives to hit from power attack to AC but I would be unable to get power attack to complement it.
Can you even use Power attack with Unarmed strikes?
They are always considered light weapons which means power attack wouldn't affect them. Piranah Strike would be the way to go.
A monk's unarmed strike is also considered a natural weapon in addition to a light weapon, according to Core Rulebook, pg. 58. Also, see "Armed" Unarmed Attacks, pg. 182.
And, if you read the Power Attack description, it specifically mentions working with natural weapons.
I'd consider a feat as applying to the "for the purpose of spells and effects that enhance or improve natural weapons" caveat of the monk's Unarmed Strike ability.
They are always considered light weapons which means power attack wouldn't affect them.
You are mistaken in that. Unarmed strikes and light beapons get full damage boni from power attack. In fact the feat does not say anything about light weapons at all.
Only off-hand weapons and secondary natural attacks get a reduced damage bonus.
I don't see any mention in the book that says a monk's fist is treated as a light weapon, unless it's in Ultimate Combat, which I don't have ready access to.
I think the only reference to unarmed strike as a light weapon is in the TWF rules, where it says an unarmed strike always counts as a light weapon for purpose of calculating the offhand penalties.
However I'm pretty sure it says somewhere that you can't use a Unarmed Strike two-handed for the 1.5x str bonus. Which kinda seems logical. And since actually the only difference between light and one-handed is that you can't two-hand it, you could say US is a light weapon.
Not that it really matters, because Power Attack works just fine with light weapons.
Unless your really planning on charging alot or using the other special options Dragon Style may not be for you. It won't increase the damage from Guided so keep that in mind as well."A character who attacks with a guided weapon modifies his attack rolls and weapon damage rolls with his Wisdom modifier, not his Strength modifier."
Dragon Ferocity gives an extra 50% strength damage to my damage rolls. I took this to mean that with the guided weapon property I would add half my wisdom to my damage rolls, is that not the case?
Sadly now because it modifies your str now your GM may rule it will work but by the RAW it does nothing for your Wisdom.
Edit removed snarkiness should really sleep soon.
Strike, Unarmed: A Medium character deals 1d3 points of nonlethal damage with an unarmed strike. A Small character deals 1d2 points of nonlethal damage. A monk or any character with the Improved Unarmed Strike feat can deal lethal or nonlethal damage with unarmed strikes, at his discretion. The damage from an unarmed strike is considered weapon damage for the purposes of effects that give you a bonus on weapon damage rolls.
An unarmed strike is always considered a light weapon. Therefore, you can use the Weapon Finesse feat to apply your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier to attack rolls with an unarmed strike. Unarmed strikes do not count as natural weapons (see Combat).
From the CRB portion of the PRD. This is where i get that they are light weapons.
This is where i get that they are light weapons.
But it still has no effect on power attack.
Got Power Attack and double handing mixed up sorry for that.
Bringing back the snark. As anyone who read the whole thread can see i already said i had messed that one up.
I don't see any mention in the book that says a monk's fist is treated as a light weapon, unless it's in Ultimate Combat, which I don't have ready access to.I think the only reference to unarmed strike as a light weapon is in the TWF rules, where it says an unarmed strike always counts as a light weapon for purpose of calculating the offhand penalties.
However I'm pretty sure it says somewhere that you can't use a Unarmed Strike two-handed for the 1.5x str bonus. Which kinda seems logical. And since actually the only difference between light and one-handed is that you can't two-hand it, you could say US is a light weapon.
Not that it really matters, because Power Attack works just fine with light weapons.
Yeah, I found the reference for unarmed attacks being light weapons. It's in the equipment section, in it's own little buried paragraph.
Core Rulebook, pg. 141, reads "An unarmed strike is always considered a light weapon." Pretty cut and dry.
However, Core Rulebook, pg. 58, reads "A monk's unarmed strike is treated as both a manufactured weapon and a natural weapon for the purpose of spells and effects that enhance or improve either manufactured or natural weapons."
So it would seem that a monk's fist qualifies as both. Or all three.
Only off-hand weapons and secondary natural attacks get a reduced damage bonus.
I had to go and check, but this is true. Amazing. Dagger using killers just got a little bit better in my mind...
Yes, Monk can treat his fists as natural weapons, manufactured weapons or unarmed whichever is more beneficial in the situation.
Theres also no off-hand for a monk using unarmed in the sense of 50% damage. There still is offhand in the sense of -2 on attacks when using TWF/Flurry.
Dragon style doesn't give you 1.5x str it gives you 1x+.5x Ie if you had a 18 str you would add 4 and 2 but in your case its adding nothing since you have a negitve str mod.
Dragon style doesn't give you 1.5x str it gives you 1x+.5x Ie if you had a 18 str you would add 4 and 2 but in your case its adding nothing since you have a negitve str mod.
I agree.
Lets make another example.14 str (+2), 18 wis (+4)
guided weapon with dragon style gives you: +4 wis (100%) and +1 str (50%)
Thats how I understand it. In your case though it gives nothing.
Okay so one last plea to make it work,
Pleading to us doesn't change the RAW, sorry. Pleading to your GM might allow you to apply it to your Wis, after all it's not like you get it for free, you spend feats on it.
But essentially what I'm saying is: Talk to your GM, if he says yes, then you're good. If he says no, than it won't work, no matter what we say here.
So, what I'm reading here, is that you min/maxxed a monk's stats to dump strength for Wisdom, you're not happy with the damage output, and now you're trying to bend or outright break the RAW to make up for your loss? If you want Power Attack in your long-term planning, you're going to have to incorporate either 2 levels of Ranger or an item that increases your strength to 13 or above to compensate. It's that simple.
Can't you just change your stats or has the game already started?
So, what I'm reading here, is that you min/maxxed a monk's stats to dump strength for Wisdom, you're not happy with the damage output, and now you're trying to bend or outright break the RAW to make up for your loss? If you want Power Attack in your long-term planning, you're going to have to incorporate either 2 levels of Ranger or an item that increases your strength to 13 or above to compensate. It's that simple.Ok first of all, don't know if it was intended or not but you're coming off as a big douche. Secondly while yes I did min max my stats I believed a feat worked one way and found out that it didn't and so I agreed that, while not in these exact words, if I couldn't convince other people that it did work my way then I would accept theirs as RAW and work with it. I never tried to break any RAW. Also, The question about Power Attack was answered by about the 4th post and the fact that you are bringing it up now that we are discussing the wording for the Dragon Ferocity feat makes absolutely no sense. I don't understand why you are bringing such hostility into this when I have been nothing but polite but you should really watch that in the future.
No hostility intended. That was meant to be read in a completely neutral tone. That's the problem with electronic communication, one person can read it as douchebaggery while it was intended to be a neutral observation. I apologize if it came off as offensive. Re-reading it, I can see how it can be taken that way. There was no sarcasm intended.
I hadn't gotten to the Dragon Ferocity feat part, but I have no experience with it, so I have no input on it. Good luck with your build.
Actually, solution!
Step 1: Take one level of Synthesist Summoner
Step 2: Get Quad form
Step 3: Get pounce evolution + ability score boost if you can (Now you can flurry all the time!)
Step 4: Your dumped physical scores are now replaced by the Eidolon
Step 5: Get power attack (which you now qualify for)
Step 6:???
Step 7: Profit!
Well then, I apologize as well for my response as it was hostile in response. Hope I didn't offend you too much.So, what I'm reading here, is that you min/maxxed a monk's stats to dump strength for Wisdom, you're not happy with the damage output, and now you're trying to bend or outright break the RAW to make up for your loss? If you want Power Attack in your long-term planning, you're going to have to incorporate either 2 levels of Ranger or an item that increases your strength to 13 or above to compensate. It's that simple.Ok first of all, don't know if it was intended or not but you're coming off as a big douche. Secondly while yes I did min max my stats I believed a feat worked one way and found out that it didn't and so I agreed that, while not in these exact words, if I couldn't convince other people that it did work my way then I would accept theirs as RAW and work with it. I never tried to break any RAW. Also, The question about Power Attack was answered by about the 4th post and the fact that you are bringing it up now that we are discussing the wording for the Dragon Ferocity feat makes absolutely no sense. I don't understand why you are bringing such hostility into this when I have been nothing but polite but you should really watch that in the future.No hostility intended. That was meant to be read in a completely neutral tone. That's the problem with electronic communication, one person can read it as douchebaggery while it was intended to be a neutral observation. I apologize if it came off as offensive. Re-reading it, I can see how it can be taken that way. There was no sarcasm intended.
I hadn't gotten to the Dragon Ferocity feat part, but I have no experience with it, so I have no input on it. Good luck with your build.
You didn't offend me at all. I usually get pretty heated in monk ability debates, because of the general (and incorrect) assumption that just because a monk's raw DPS is sub-optimal, that they are a useless class in combat. Getting around that using things like Vow of Poverty (why yes, my AC is indeed 42 without any armor, clothing, or spellcasting involved. What?!?)and feats such as Ring the Golden Bell (why yes, I did just break your jaw from 8 squares away. What?!?) are favorite things of mine to bring monks back to the fighting arena.
I asked the very same question when I thought of it, and the answer is, they can be permanent.
Just stay awake for more than 24 hours for one day and bam, permanent. Take the feat, and then every time that your Eidolon is up (which should be always when you are not sleeping), power attack.
Once, I was trying to prove a point with a monk. At level 6, it seems that with various feats, it can take on two standard fighters of the same level (big greatsword wielding freaks) at once. It's done mainly by utterly dumping physical ability scores (except con) and buffing wisdom to highs.
Combine with the feat whose name escapes me, allowing you to use (reading liberally) your entire attack as touch attacks, with the first being a stunning fist, while pouncing all the time.
It's impossible to make a character that is primarily a monk too good. :p
Gendarme.
And you get a horse. Or a puppy!
Okay, I was mistaken. There is an "a" in the thing that probably makes that position untenable. But still, touch attack stunning fist:
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats/ki-diversity-combat-faction
Pounce is from the Eidolon's evolution.
An Unarmed Fighter can get a Style feat as a freebie, without qualifying for it. Are you certain you even need Power Attack then?
