Secane
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You can blend the power of your performance and spellcasting.
Prerequisites: Cha 13, bardic performance class ability, able to cast 1st-level spells.
Benefit: You can combine your bardic performance and your spellcasting in two ways. First, you can conceal the activity of casting a bard spell by masking it in a performance. As a swift action, you may combine your casting time of a spell with a Perform check. Observers must make a Perception or Sense Motive check opposed by your Perform check to realize you are also casting a spell. This uses 1 round of your bardic performance ability, regardless of the spell's casting time.
Second, as a move action, you can use 1 round of bardic performance to maintain a bard spell with a duration of concentration. You can cast another spell in the same round you are using bardic magic to maintain concentration; if you do this, your concentration on the maintained spell ends when you end the bardic performance the spell is part of.
For the first use of Spellsong, does it just allow you to "spend" Bardic Performances to conceal your Spell or does it allow you to "combine" a Bardic Performance like Inspire Courage WITH your Spell?
| Abraham spalding |
Yeah it hides the fact you are casting a spell. Also you may spend a round of bardic performance to continue a spell you stopped concentrating on. One such spell is detect magic.
So if you were trying to put some orcs to sleep with deep slumber but didn't want them knowing what you were doing you could take a swift action while casting the spell and roll a perform check. The orcs would roll a perception or sense motive check -- if they don't beat your perform check they don't realize you are casting a spell and the spell goes off.
Later you have a concentration based spell going but you need to cast another spell without letting go of the concentration based spell so you spend a round of bardic performance to keep the concentration spell and have a standard action to cast the other spell you needed to cast (normally concentration spells take a standard action each round to keep going).
Though you should wait more than an hour to bump.
Secane
|
Yeah it hides the fact you are casting a spell. Also you may spend a round of bardic performance to continue a spell you stopped concentrating on. One such spell is detect magic.
So if you were trying to put some orcs to sleep with deep slumber but didn't want them knowing what you were doing you could take a swift action while casting the spell and roll a perform check. The orcs would roll a perception or sense motive check -- if they don't beat your perform check they don't realize you are casting a spell and the spell goes off.
Later you have a concentration based spell going but you need to cast another spell without letting go of the concentration based spell so you spend a round of bardic performance to keep the concentration spell and have a standard action to cast the other spell you needed to cast (normally concentration spells take a standard action each round to keep going).
Though you should wait more than an hour to bump.
Sorry, for the early bump.
The question is, this "performance check" does it means I could use Inspire Courage AND cast a spell? Or does it means I just roll a d20 and add my performance skill to "hid" the fact I'm casting a spell?
| Cheapy |
Dumb Paladin, you're acting smart.
Stop it.
Secane, a perform skill is not necessary for any bard. The only Bardic Performances that it affects are Counter Song and Distraction.
That's it. It has no effect on any other performances.
There are two mechanical reasons why a bard would put Ranks into Perform. I do not consider those two above uses as good enough reasons:
1) Versatile Performance
2) Spellsong feat
Both of these are amazing abilities. Spellsong lets you get around all Bard spells having Verbal components. You can now disguise it as orating! And no one would be the wiser if you pump Perform(Oration).
In 3.5, the bardic performa-- sorry, Bardic Music, was tied to Perform(Sing). A lot of people still think that it is tied to Perform skills. But it's not. It's more akin to the Barbarian's Rage than anything else.
I hope some of that helped.
| Grick |
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The question is, this "performance check" does it means I could use Inspire Courage AND cast a spell? Or does it means I just roll a d20 and add my performance skill to "hid" the fact I'm casting a spell?
You can't activate the bardic performance and use Spellsong in the same action.
For example, a 7th-level Bard could:
Move action: Begin bardic performance - Inspire Courage
Standard action: Cast Haste
Swift Action: Use Spellsong to conceal the spell with a perform check
That doesn't really get him anything, though, as you're sort of rallying your allies for battle, so who cares if you cast haste?
Perhaps a better example:
Move action: Begin bardic performance - Fascinate on the three guards.
Standard action: Cast Unnatural Lust on the princess.
Swift Action: Use Spellsong to conceal the spell with a perform check
If the check succeeds, no-one realizes he cast a spell, thus Fascinate is not broken, and it's rock star groupie time.
| Paul Murray |
I'm looking at this feat for purposes of combining "Charm Person" with a performance (act) check - to give the party a leg up in organised play.
"The question is, this "performance check" does it means I could use Inspire Courage AND cast a spell? Or does it means I just roll a d20 and add my performance skill to "hid" the fact I'm casting a spell? "
Depends on what you mean.
If you are already performing, you can maintain the performance as a free action and also cast a spell - this is just standard even without the feat.
As I read it, you cannot BOTH commence a bardic performance to inspire courage as a standard action, and also cast a spell as a standard action. But after you level up a bit, this is no longer an issue, because you will be able to commence a performance as a move action.
What you can do is burn a bardic perform round to conceal the casting of a spell. As I read it, you don't also need to be in bardic performance mode to do this. (Although it might seem a little odd flavour-wise if your character bursts into song or starts strumming thier lute for no reason, if the point of the exercise is to conceal the fact that you are casting.)
IOW: it does the same job as a stilled/silenced spell in a social situation, IF you beat their perception, and at the cost of using a perform round.
| shroudb |
bumping this up to add my own question:
the sentence that baffles me is the last one in the feat description:
"if you do this, your concentration on the maintained spell ends when you end the bardic performance the spell is part of."
(and to not take the above out of context the full feat description of this part is: Second, as a move action, you can use 1 round of bardic performance to maintain a bard spell with a duration of concentration. You can cast another spell in the same round you are using bardic magic to maintain concentration; if you do this, your concentration on the maintained spell ends when you end the bardic performance the spell is part of.)
maintaining a bardic performance is a free action, the way the feat is worded i can see one of many things happening, please enlighten this poor GM:
option 1)
round 1)
bard is already inspiring courage from before, he casts silent image as a standard action and lets say he moves as a move action
round 2)
he is still inspiring courage, spends an additional round of bardic performance and uses his move action to maintain his silent image, casts "insert random spell here"
round 3)
he is still inspiring courage, he also as a free ction (maintaining a bardic performance) maintains silent image, can use both move and standard action as he wants
option 2) as above but maintaining this "special" bardic performance is a move action and not a free like all other bardic performances
option 3) as option 1 but instead of actually starting a second performance the concentration is integrated on his already started performance (not costing him additional rounds apart from the first to activate it)
option 4)as option 1 but since he can't maintain 2 bardic performances the moment he uses spellsong to maintain a spell, his inspire courage ability drops
option 5)something other that and i misintepreted the feat
tyvm
p.s. personally atm i am running it as option 3, because the actual text says "the bardic performance the spell IS PART OF"
| Varalash |
*True Resurrection*
I stumbled across this feat and had them same question, my interpretation was also option 3, but this opens up a few possibilities, What happens if I cast a second silent image? can I just keep maintaining multiple spells with a duration of concentration as long as I can pump spells out? Combining this with harmonic spell seems to have great potential, same with lingering performance. Though, I'm not too sure how good the bard spells of "concentration" duration are, other than the images...