Lately my DM has been reading a lot game mechanics as RAW. For instance, he forces me to roll handle animal every time my summoned monster attacks or takes damage to determine if the Summoned animal runs away.
I have 3 questions.
1. Since the planes that you summon creatures from are infinitely large, can you just say "I summon an earth elemental that speaks common, the plane of earth is huge so there has to be at least one earth elemental that speaks common." to take care of the language barrier?
2. If the summoned creature attacks your opponents to the best of its abilities as soon as it comes into play, does it automatically know who the bad guys are? As opposed to spending the next few rounds to determine who is friend and foe.
If the creature does know friend from foe, does this mean that in times of non-combat can I summon a creature to determine if someone is hostile toward me?
3. How many tricks does a summoned monster know so that you don't have to make DC 25 handle animal checks to get the animal to attack?
Below is the text for the Summon Monster Spell
This spell summons an extraplanar creature (typically an outsider, elemental, or magical beast native to another plane). It appears where you designate and acts immediately, on your turn. It attacks your opponents to the best of its ability. If you can communicate with the creature, you can direct it not to attack, to attack particular enemies, or to perform other actions. The spell conjures one of the creatures from the 1st Level list on Table: Summon Monster. You choose which kind of creature to summon, and you can choose a different one each time you cast the spell.
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Lately my DM has been reading a lot game mechanics as RAW. For instance, he forces me to roll handle animal every time my summoned monster attacks or takes damage to determine if the Summoned animal runs away.
I have 3 questions.
1. Since the planes that you summon creatures from are infinitely large, can you just say "I summon an earth elemental that speaks common, the plane of earth is huge so there has to be at least one earth elemental that speaks common." to take care of the language barrier?
2. If the summoned creature attacks your opponents to the best of its abilities as soon as it comes into play, does it automatically know who the bad guys are? As opposed to spending the next few rounds to determine who is friend and foe.
If the creature does know friend from foe, does this mean that in times of non-combat can I summon a creature to determine if someone is hostile toward me?
3. How many tricks does a summoned monster know so that you don't have to make DC 25 handle animal checks to get the animal to attack?
Below is the text for the Summon Monster Spell
This spell summons an extraplanar creature (typically an outsider, elemental, or magical beast native to another plane). It appears where you designate and acts immediately, on your turn. It attacks your opponents to the best of its ability. If you can communicate with the creature, you can direct it not to attack, to attack particular enemies, or to perform other actions. The spell conjures one of the creatures from the 1st Level list on Table: Summon Monster. You choose which kind of creature to summon, and you can choose a different one each time you cast the spell.
buy RAW, no common speaking elementals
attacks whom you think is your enemy. they are linked to you
they only get what is in the book.
now as to making roll's. they are magical construcks that do your bidding even to sucide. dont know hy he thinks otherwise, except confusing Animal compainions with summons.
The Beastie will attack your enemies to its best of ability. No need for any check there.
Now, for about anything alse (including 'Move over there and help our rogue flank that one!'), you need to convey your intent somehow.
Handle Animal. Animal Empathy. Feral Speech. Speak their language. Cast Tongues. Summon critters with truespeech or telepathy. Whatever.
Lately my DM has been reading a lot game mechanics as RAW. For instance, he forces me to roll handle animal every time my summoned monster attacks or takes damage to determine if the Summoned animal runs away.
I have 3 questions.
1. Since the planes that you summon creatures from are infinitely large, can you just say "I summon an earth elemental that speaks common, the plane of earth is huge so there has to be at least one earth elemental that speaks common." to take care of the language barrier?
2. If the summoned creature attacks your opponents to the best of its abilities as soon as it comes into play, does it automatically know who the bad guys are? As opposed to spending the next few rounds to determine who is friend and foe.
If the creature does know friend from foe, does this mean that in times of non-combat can I summon a creature to determine if someone is hostile toward me?
3. How many tricks does a summoned monster know so that you don't have to make DC 25 handle animal checks to get the animal to attack?
Below is the text for the Summon Monster Spell
This spell summons an extraplanar creature (typically an outsider, elemental, or magical beast native to another plane). It appears where you designate and acts immediately, on your turn. It attacks your opponents to the best of its ability. If you can communicate with the creature, you can direct it not to attack, to attack particular enemies, or to perform other actions. The spell conjures one of the creatures from the 1st Level list on Table: Summon Monster. You choose which kind of creature to summon, and you can choose a different one each time you cast the spell.
You shouldn't need to communicate with the summoned creature in order for it to attack. However unless you can communicate with said creature it will attack who it deems to be the largest threat.
This will usually be who ever you summon the creature next to. So in conclusion.
1. Yes it attacks the nearest or largest threat as it sees fit.
2. For more advanced tactics (Holding actions, Flanking, specific targets, ect) you will need to Handle Animal/Communicate with it
3 In no way should your summoned creature run away. Its a summoned creature bound to do as you command. And being a summoned creature it is in no real danger.
4. You get a generic creature with a summons. You also cant summon a specific creature(The same elemental every time). In fact there was a series of summon spells that allowed you to summon the same creature but used a summoning of a lower level just for that.
So your DM is partially correct. You will need to be able to communicate with the creature if you want it to do something more then just attack. However it should never run from the combat.
No you can only summon typical creatures with the spell, no summoning elementals that have 10 int instead of 4 or speak common in addition to terran for example.
As a rule of thumb I assume the summon knows what is happening since you start summoning it the last round of actions. If a creature is apparently standing still doing nothing hostile or threatening than it probably shouldnt be identified as an enemy unless you can communicate with the summon.
Unless noted otherwise I assume a summoned creature does not know tricks, if you can not communicate with the creature in some fashion it will only attack according to it's insights. Communication does not necesarily have to be languages ofcourse but it is usually the easiest, animals will only attack by default unless you can direct them somehow.
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Lately my DM has been reading a lot game mechanics as RAW. For instance, he forces me to roll handle animal every time my summoned monster attacks or takes damage to determine if the Summoned animal runs away.
WHAT GAME is your DM and YOU reading/playing?!?!?!?!
1) Summoned monster/animals ALWAYS "attacks your opponents to the best of its ability". They do not and cannot "run away" under their own accord/volition.
2) Only Summoned "animals" need to use the handle animal check. This is because they have less then 3 Int. *EDIT: Left this out, this also applies to monsters you do not share a language with.
3) Summoned monsters that you share a language with. For example, Earth Elementals speak Terran and if you speak Terran via learning it by placing points in Linguistics, you can COMMAND it to do ANYTHING. (As morbid as this sounds... yes... you can even tell it to jump off the bridge, do evil stuff, whack itself..etc.) It will try its best to do it.
4) Summoned monsters do not REALLY DIE. They reform back on their planes where they come from. Why? See 5), here is a hint, it starts with "M" and its 5 letters long.
5) Its a SPELL its "MAGIC", there is no LOGICAL explanation for it! Otherwise how do you even "teleport" some monster from the "elemental planes" into this world? Answer: MAGIC!
I hope this helps you, just as it is been entertaining for me.
Given my DM's attitude toward summon spells. I am tempted to summon as many creatures as I can ~3-5 and then hand the sheets to the DM and say OK you run them since I can't control them.
(Insert Sarcasm Below)
If there is one thing that I know, DMs love to control monsters.
Given my DM's attitude toward summon spells. I am tempted to summon as many creatures as I can ~3-5 and then hand the sheets to the DM and say OK you run them since I can't control them.
(Insert Sarcasm Below)
If there is one thing that I know, DMs love to control monsters.
You can do that.. ofcourse if the GM doesnt like it he would just say you can only have one or two summons active at a time.
Actually that is what I did, just because I do not want to slow down the game much and dont want to focus on summons rather than players, the players knew this all in advance ofcourse so it causes no problems.
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Given my DM's attitude toward summon spells. I am tempted to summon as many creatures as I can ~3-5 and then hand the sheets to the DM and say OK you run them since I can't control them.
(Insert Sarcasm Below)
If there is one thing that I know, DMs love to control monsters.You can do that.. ofcourse if the GM doesnt like it he would just say you can only have one or two summons active at a time.
Actually that is what I did, just because I do not want to slow down the game much and dont want to focus on summons rather than players, the players knew this all in advance ofcourse so it causes no problems.
Are you trying to tempt the DM to kill your character Mogart? :P
Are you trying to tempt the DM to kill your character Mogart? :P
The character is level 5 and I have been told that if I throw him off a cliff I will be forced to restart as a level 1. The character has also been nerfed to a point where he is not fun to play anymore. So if the DM should decide to kill my character then I can bring a new one in at level 5 as I did not suicide him.
So in a round about way.........Yes.
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Are you trying to tempt the DM to kill your character Mogart? :PThe character is level 5 and I have been told that if I throw him off a cliff I will be forced to restart as a level 1. The character has also been nerfed to a point where he is not fun to play anymore. So if the DM should decide to kill my character then I can bring a new one in at level 5 as I did not suicide him.
So in a round about way.........Yes.
Oh my... mercy on you poor thing.
Be Brave. Now go tell that DM the facts* in his face.
*How your game sucks...etc.
Well, I've been DMing for over 25 years and I ALWAYS gave total control of summoned creatures to their caster. Use them as cannon fodder for all I care. (I'm a busy guy; I have other NPCs to control, lol)
I guess it depends on the DM's view of things.
Ultradan
Just have your character retire. Pool up your money for a few more sessions, buy a nice house. Maybe some tools to make baskets.
Answer your true calling, which is to make baskets.
And summon creatures to help you make baskets.
I once wanted to make a Summoner who was basically HedonismBot from Futurama. why is he a summoner? Because he's too lazy to do things himself.
Your DM doesn't know how the game works.
No offense, but sounds like you are suffering from what I call Jerkus DMikus. If he has nerfed your character post-char gen, he should at least let you redesign your character. The aim of RPGs, after all, besides killing monsters and stealing their loot, is to have fun, and it sounds like you are not having fun.
The fact that he's claiming to run things by RAW but getting this wrong s either another issue entirely or an indication that he is deliberately putting "hate" on your character.
Post creation rule changes are the big problem. Especially when he is the one who asked me to play a Summoner.
I find that I have a vested interest and care about most characters that I create, but at this point I could care less about this character. The DM doesn't want me to suicide or retire the character so lately I have been in a front line position.
The changes to the character's summon abilities have only been implemented within the last game so I don't think he fully realizes just how irritating this will be. My hope is that by having him control every creature that I summon he will realize that it is just a better idea to let me have total control over the creatures and ignore the extra rules that he pulled for controlling non-extra planar animals.
Given that I was told about the handle animal checks after I had already allocated skill points I am going to love asking him..."How many tricks does my summoned creature get or do I have to push the creature (Handle Animal DC 25) whenever I want it to perform an action? Even if the roll is impossible for me to make, I'll still roll it and total it up, just to emphasize that the game has become the opposite of fun.