RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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Star Voter Season 6
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After this year, we've 128 'superstar items' and between 2008 and 2010 40+* monsters, some with inspired art already out there.
Since they belong to Paizo now, any plans to bundle them into a PDF or *gasp* a 'Bonus Bestiary II'?
Sure 24 of the monsters need to be converted to PFRPG, but it would be kind of cool to a) have these critters and items be official and b) to be able to point to the contributions that people have made.**
Plus it saves me the effort of trying to put everything in a PDF for my own use.
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After this year, we've 128 'superstar items' and between 2008 and 2010 40+* monsters, some with inspired art already out there.
Since they belong to Paizo now, any plans to bundle them into a PDF or *gasp* a 'Bonus Bestiary II'?
That's a very cool idea.
Obviously they'd need some editing and reworking - a lot of them have significant dings against them; you'd have to fix those before you added them as "approved" material.That said, there's a lot marvelous and original stuff there. Touched up and rebalanced, it'd be even better. That'd make for an enticing compendium.
that would be cool, I would buy a copy of that.
That would be useful for those of us who liked the concepts of particular monsters of years past. I, for one, would not need it though. As I read those entries from last year I had already decided which ones I would like to use if certain circumstances arise in my current campaign. One in particular was Benjamin Bruck's Chymick. That was so evocative that as I read it I was already coming up with an adventure that featured these strange not-so-organic critters. If my players decide to bug a certain mage for enchantments I already know what he will ask for in return. To me, that is the sign of a Superstar, someone who can with a single small idea evoke many multiple possibilities for different campaigns and play styles. And as for the Chymick, I haven't statted it up yet because I have no idea when my players will approach a mage (but I am certain they will) so its abilities will be CR dependent.
Heck, They could make a complete Beastiary 3 if they used the afore-mentioned creatures and all the other ones at the end of their adventure path booklets. (unless, of course, those are already going to be used in the Beastiary 2).
So many from last your are too good NOT to use. It would be a shame. I am working on my versions for my home games, actually =-)
And to make it official..I would pay for that book
So many from last your are too good NOT to use. It would be a shame. I am working on my versions for my home games, actually =-)
And to make it official..I would pay for that book
+5 others from my end (me and 4 people who don't post on these threads).
OK, the title made me stop and do this,
ALBATROSS, ALBATROSS for sale. Get your ALBATROSS here.
Ill have the Spam, spam, spam eggs and spam
Every body sing...........
Spam, Spam, Spam, Spam, Lovely spam, wonderful spa-a-m.
Yep, that would be a definite purchase.
Sadly, it is not likely that we will ever see something like this. It has been asked for in the past, but since everything is already online there isn't a real need to publish it. I cant find it now, but I recall someone from Paizo saying that it wasn't in the plans because it would take away from other great projects and is not needed since all the Items were posted online for everyone to see for free.
Thing is, those whose entries would be in the book would purchase copies, not as sourcebooks for their games necessarily, but as proofs: "See? That's me, right there. I wrote that. I is a ri-tar."
Sadly, it is not likely that we will ever see something like this. It has been asked for in the past, but since everything is already online there isn't a real need to publish it. I cant find it now, but I recall someone from Paizo saying that it wasn't in the plans because it would take away from other great projects and is not needed since all the Items were posted online for everyone to see for free.
That can be the RPG Superstar 2012's commission.
Thing is, those whose entries would be in the book would purchase copies, not as sourcebooks for their games necessarily, but as proofs: "See? That's me, right there. I wrote that. I is a ri-tar."That'd sell about 200 copies....
So that's 200, plus those of us who *would* buy it as an actual sourcebook. I'd buy a copy to say, "See? It took stuff *this good* to be better than mine."
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RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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Star Voter Season 6
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So that's 200, plus those of us who *would* buy it as an actual sourcebook. I'd buy a copy to say, "See? It took stuff *this good* to be better than mine."Thing is, those whose entries would be in the book would purchase copies, not as sourcebooks for their games necessarily, but as proofs: "See? That's me, right there. I wrote that. I is a ri-tar."That'd sell about 200 copies....
I'd buy five. :-)
As far as the monsters go, maybe a 'bonus bestiary' for Free RPG day :-)
Sadly, it is not likely that we will ever see something like this. It has been asked for in the past, but since everything is already online there isn't a real need to publish it. I cant find it now, but I recall someone from Paizo saying that it wasn't in the plans because it would take away from other great projects and is not needed since all the Items were posted online for everyone to see for free.
Well, as I said - the items are online, but they're A) scattered across many pages with no real organization, and B) unedited, often somewhat broken or unbalanced. Besides which, I'm sure plenty of gamers who have never heard of RPG Superstar would still enjoy the results.
But maybe the way to go is to include them in larger compendiums of magic items, etc. - the common reader won't care that some of the items are "original" and some are from the contest.
OTOH, after reading 128 Superstar wondrous items, who'd have the heart to write half a bookfull of mediocre ones?
Remember that there are many, many more items than 128, because there are may items "good enough for a book of magic items", but not good enough to make the top 32.
So with between the real deal and the "best of" of the voluntary rejects, not quite-superstar enough , and mockup entries, there likely will be enough material to actually fill a book.
But I doubt that we'll see dedicated book about rpg Superstar. i think its more likely that they'll instead use this pool of ideas at their hand to rework them and incorporate them into their regular releases.
There were quite a few things in the APG that reminded me of things I've seen in or around this contest.
Of course I don't know if they were inspired by the things I'm reminded of or if the similarity is a coincidence, but it would be a shame to let all these free ideas go to waste.
I honestly believe this would sell. The fact is that many of these magical items are excellent and so are many of the monsters. However, none of them have been made "official". That is, they may belong to Paizo but they haven't been edited and published officially. What more, it would spur the interest in this contest even more. People wouldn't submit with only the hopes of getting to the finale (not that we all do that), but would submit just with the hopes of getting their individual item published.
I don't think it would make sense to print the material, though. I think it would suffice as a Web Enhancement. Simply an edited reprinting of what has been put out, in a pretty format with cool pictures for those they decide to have an artist portray.
Ken
Sadly, it is not likely that we will ever see something like this. It has been asked for in the past, but since everything is already online there isn't a real need to publish it. I cant find it now, but I recall someone from Paizo saying that it wasn't in the plans because it would take away from other great projects and is not needed since all the Items were posted online for everyone to see for free.Well, as I said - the items are online, but they're A) scattered across many pages with no real organization, and B) unedited, often somewhat broken or unbalanced. Besides which, I'm sure plenty of gamers who have never heard of RPG Superstar would still enjoy the results.
But maybe the way to go is to include them in larger compendiums of magic items, etc. - the common reader won't care that some of the items are "original" and some are from the contest.
OTOH, after reading 128 Superstar wondrous items, who'd have the heart to write half a bookfull of mediocre ones?
Just my perspective, but I would think that the resource of having this quality content is like having money under the mattress for Paizo. However, the since the content can be looked up in threads, it would only be selling for the art and layout. Some people wouldn't buy what they can look up for free.
On the other hand the PRD is free and gives players a chance to read over the rules before buying the core stuff. The fantastic artwork makes the core rulebook well worth it... something is just awesome about having a dead tree copy. :D
One other thing is that Paizo might want to pay the authors for their work used (IIRC James Jacobs said in a thread a while back if they used an entry they would probably pay for it). I've heard all of the writers at Paizo stay pretty busy and have a steady workload, so I can't blame them if you can't spare the time.
Despite ALL of this, I would LOVE if this was open content, even if only permission was given to do a community project. I would hands-down buy the pdf and print it off myself if Paizo okayed it. One can only hope... :D
Somehow I didn't see Azmahels post in my RSS...
@ Azmahel - Agreed +1!
One important thing to remember is the intent of this contest.
The judges have stated a number of times that they don't pick 32 publication-ready items - they pick the 32 items for which they're most interested in seeing what else the author can do - the ones that show the most promise.
Sometimes, an item has had clear deficiencies, and they've noted so - but that's not the point. The point is to get a large enough pool so that *one* of those authors can get published (actually, these days it's four).
So, cool as it might be conceptually to have all of the Top 32 entries published, I don't necessarily see it as being all that desirable, and it would take significant work on the part of the Paizo staff in order to ensure that all 96/128 of the entries were actually publication-ready.
Chief Technical Officer
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So, cool as it might be conceptually to have all of the Top 32 entries published, I don't necessarily see it as being all that desirable, and it would take significant work on the part of the Paizo staff in order to ensure that all 96/128 of the entries were actually publication-ready.
Yep. That's the biggest hurdle here. It's often going to be easier for our staff and our freelancers to make up their own new content than to "fix" somebody else's stuff that's not quite right.
So, cool as it might be conceptually to have all of the Top 32 entries published, I don't necessarily see it as being all that desirable, and it would take significant work on the part of the Paizo staff in order to ensure that all 96/128 of the entries were actually publication-ready.
Yep. That's the biggest hurdle here. It's often going to be easier for our staff and our freelancers to make up their own new content than to "fix" somebody else's stuff that's not quite right.
The good news is there's some pretty good advice on what wasn't quite done right given by some pretty cool cats!
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 8
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Yep. That's the biggest hurdle here. It's often going to be easier for our staff and our freelancers to make up their own new content than to "fix" somebody else's stuff that's not quite right.
Vic, that's a very fair point. Is there, however, any possibility of the previous contestants rehabilitating their items and monsters to save your staff the work? I know that I personally would do it pro-bono just to have a paizo credit to my name.
I'd bet others would feel the same.-QGJ
Yep. That's the biggest hurdle here. It's often going to be easier for our staff and our freelancers to make up their own new content than to "fix" somebody else's stuff that's not quite right.
Vic, that's a very fair point. Is there, however, any possibility of the previous contestants rehabilitating their items and monsters to save your staff the work? I know that I personally would do it pro-bono just to have a paizo credit to my name.
I'd bet others would feel the same.-QGJ
But then, ummm, who checks the revision?
I see what you're saying, Vic. I knew significant revision would be necessary; that's part of the value I'd see in the product - but Superstar does tend to items with odd/unusual/game-breaking mechanics, and I guess editing and revising a truckload of those would be a lot more work then dealing with simpler items, even written from scratch. And for the contest, coming up with innovative uses of the mechanics is desirable - for actual product, that's less of a goal.
Still, it seems like there's a lot of great items that would add a lot to a new sourcebook, without too much need for tweaking. I can see how trying to prepare the spell anvil for publication would be a nightmare; and dancing monkeys might not be what you want to spend pagecount on. But a lot of the items, like boundary chalk and the last leaves, seem to fit right in - the objects that didn't go gonzo on flavor or mechanics, just did a really good job, or found an unusual niche.
What would be spiff is if all the entries before the final round could get a blanket OGL declaration. Even that would probably be a pain, though.
I think the best bet of seeing something like this would be an anniversary edition or the 'best of superstar' and not as a book of usable material. Largely this could be a book about superstar with articles about the contest and not about the items. Commentary from the judges, for example. Krikey, SKR's autoreject and Clark's feedback threads could feel several columns for example. So could Spicer's "my two cents"-even before he became a judge. A story about what he did the first year to make to the judging the fourth, etc. Pull quotes from judges, winners, random board members. Include the origins such as Lisa's American Idol 'joke'm & the need for new blood. Get Erik, Vic, Wolfgang, James et al. to put in sidebars. notes on what it takes to win, where winners went with their title, a list of groaners, percentages of chalk, coin, & anti-adventuring items etc.
hmmm... now that I think about it right there is your table of contents :) Now: do the numbers, write up a proposal to do a third party publicaton. (chances are your response will be something akin to Vic's though O:)
That'd sell about 200 copies....
Sorry to cast resurrection, but Vic, for splat like what's in question here, what numbers constitute a successful run? I don't know if that's like a crazy trade secret - I know pretty much nothing about publishing - but how many copies do you have to sell in order to keep the lights on?
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Chief Technical Officer
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That'd sell about 200 copies....Sorry to cast resurrection, but Vic, for splat like what's in question here, what numbers constitute a successful run? I don't know if that's like a crazy trade secret - I know pretty much nothing about publishing - but how many copies do you have to sell in order to keep the lights on?
(An aside here—when I mentioned 200 copies, I was talking about just the "vanity purchases" from folks wanting to see their name in lights. I have no doubt that an RPG Superstar compilation would sell more than that.)
To your question, though, I'm not going to be super precise here... but small print-on-demand or PDF-only publishers might be thrilled with selling 200 units. Folks who use professional printers will likely have minimum print runs in the low four digits. All but the biggest in the industry would probably consider a product that sells in the high four digits very successful. If you have five-digit sales, you're probably going to make several "hottest products of the year" listings, and if you have six-digit sales, you're an industry leader.
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RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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Star Voter Season 6
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Yep. That's the biggest hurdle here. It's often going to be easier for our staff and our freelancers to make up their own new content than to "fix" somebody else's stuff that's not quite right.
Vic, that's a very fair point. Is there, however, any possibility of the previous contestants rehabilitating their items and monsters to save your staff the work? I know that I personally would do it pro-bono just to have a paizo credit to my name.
I'd bet others would feel the same.-QGJ
+1 :-)
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RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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Star Voter Season 6
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That'd sell about 200 copies....Sorry to cast resurrection, but Vic, for splat like what's in question here, what numbers constitute a successful run? I don't know if that's like a crazy trade secret - I know pretty much nothing about publishing - but how many copies do you have to sell in order to keep the lights on?(An aside here—when I mentioned 200 copies, I was talking about just the "vanity purchases" from folks wanting to see their name in lights. I have no doubt that an RPG Superstar compilation would sell more than that.)
To your question, though, I'm not going to be super precise here... but small print-on-demand or PDF-only publishers might be thrilled with selling 200 units. Folks who use professional printers will likely have minimum print runs in the low four digits. All but the biggest in the industry would probably consider a product that sells in the high four digits very successful. If you have five-digit sales, you're probably going to make several "hottest products of the year" listings, and if you have six-digit sales, you're an industry leader.
The participants could have signing sessions at our FLGS though :-)
I would just like to say that I'm here-by pre-ordering my copy now. Even if you guys don't publish it, you can use the order for the Advneturing Dice Tube that I ordered a year ago for it.
Another thought about this is wait a year or so and do this project as kind of a 5th year aniversary celebration book.
... but small print-on-demand or PDF-only publishers might be thrilled with selling 200 units. Folks who use professional printers will likely have minimum print runs in the low four digits. All but the biggest in the industry would probably consider a product that sells in the high four digits very successful. If you have five-digit sales, you're probably going to make several "hottest products of the year" listings, and if you have six-digit sales, you're an industry leader.
Exactly the framework kind of answer I was hoping for. I've always kind of wondered just exactly this kind of thing. Thanks for the answer!
Here's a thought
We know the items and monsters are on line for free.
We also know its been asked for lots.
We also know Paizo bods are really busy all the time.
It's a pain navigating to them when you want a quick look up.
Yes, we could have a load of bookmarks, or...
Someone could do the hard graft for Paizo and submit a finished edited pdf for consideration as a forum supporter provided freebie.
Either one of us with time and skillz or even an enterprising intern (or similar trainee monkey) could export the various web pages to a pdf document that could be uploaded and linked on the main RPG Superstar page for anyone to download.
In fact, you might find a volunteer to do this, do some formatting and submit it back to some sort of paizo email drop zone for it. Then all the busy peeps need to do is scan through it to make sure they are happy and then add the link to the page.
And each year, you just add the winners to it as an update - the first ever magical ever growing Item and Bestiary.
Anyway, back to all these other lovely discussions and lurking mode re- engagement.
Swoosh - gone.
Here's a thought
We know the items and monsters are on line for free.
We also know its been asked for lots.
We also know Paizo bods are really busy all the time.
It's a pain navigating to them when you want a quick look up.
Yes, we could have a load of bookmarks, or...
Someone could do the hard graft for Paizo and submit a finished edited pdf for consideration as a forum supporter provided freebie.
Either one of us with time and skillz or even an enterprising intern (or similar trainee monkey) could export the various web pages to a pdf document that could be uploaded and linked on the main RPG Superstar page for anyone to download.
In fact, you might find a volunteer to do this, do some formatting and submit it back to some sort of paizo email drop zone for it. Then all the busy peeps need to do is scan through it to make sure they are happy and then add the link to the page.
And each year, you just add the winners to it as an update - the first ever magical ever growing Item and Bestiary.
Anyway, back to all these other lovely discussions and lurking mode re- engagement.
Swoosh - gone.
I can't believe I'm actually thinking of doing this.
But I probably couldn't resist redesigning or "fixing" some of them.
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After this year, we've 128 'superstar items' and between 2008 and 2010 40+* monsters, some with inspired art already out there.
Since they belong to Paizo now, any plans to bundle them into a PDF or *gasp* a 'Bonus Bestiary II'?
Sure 24 of the monsters need to be converted to PFRPG, but it would be kind of cool to a) have these critters and items be official and b) to be able to point to the contributions that people have made.**
Plus it saves me the effort of trying to put everything in a PDF for my own use.
*** spoiler omitted **
**** spoiler omitted **
Here's a start: Previous Years Entries
And for the record, its:
12 Adventures
32 Countires
6 Encounters
8 Golarion Locations
56 Monsters
16 Monster Stat Blocks
48 Villains
17 Villain Stat Blocks
8 Villain Lairs
96 Wondrous Items
Here's a start: Previous Years EntriesAnd for the record, its:
12 Adventures
32 Countires
6 Encounters
8 Golarion Locations
56 Monsters
16 Monster Stat Blocks
48 Villains
17 Villain Stat Blocks
8 Villain Lairs
96 Wondrous Items
...and a partridge in a pear tree?
You know, amazingly, no one has entered a partridge in a pear tree. Go figure.
...and a partridge in a pear tree?
I suspect that if anyone ever *did* submit a partridge in a pear tree as a wondrous item, we'd never know.
Of course, with the rework of the wolf in sheep's clothing, a partridge in a pear tree is an entirely viable monster :)
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I suspect that if anyone ever *did* submit a partridge in a pear tree as a wondrous item, we'd never know.Of course, with the rework of the wolf in sheep's clothing, a partridge in a pear tree is an entirely viable monster :)
I would think the partridge in a pear tree would be considered a set item. Not enough room to list all 12 items in the set in 300 words or less. :P Could also possibly be an artifact.
I would think the partridge in a pear tree would be considered a set item. Not enough room to list all 12 items in the set in 300 words or less. :P Could also possibly be an artifact.
I suspect that if anyone ever *did* submit a partridge in a pear tree as a wondrous item, we'd never know.Of course, with the rework of the wolf in sheep's clothing, a partridge in a pear tree is an entirely viable monster :)
Well, the whole set isn't composed of wondrous items- the five golden rings, for instance, are certainly not. So it would certainly be acceptable to submit one item from that set and hint that there may be more to come. Though I suspect a lot of the items from the twelve would be the fairly uncreative 'figurine of wondrous power' sort.
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RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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Star Voter Season 6
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Well, the whole set isn't composed of wondrous items- the five golden rings, for instance, are certainly not. So it would certainly be acceptable to submit one item from that set and hint that there may be more to come. Though I suspect a lot of the items from the twelve would be the fairly uncreative 'figurine of wondrous power' sort.I would think the partridge in a pear tree would be considered a set item. Not enough room to list all 12 items in the set in 300 words or less. :P Could also possibly be an artifact.
I suspect that if anyone ever *did* submit a partridge in a pear tree as a wondrous item, we'd never know.Of course, with the rework of the wolf in sheep's clothing, a partridge in a pear tree is an entirely viable monster :)
I'm sure there's something alchemical that can be done with the partridge in a pear tree. I recall one of the Penny Dreadful stories had a Silver Nutmeg/Golden Pear.
You know, amazingly, no one has entered a partridge in a pear tree. Go figure.
...and a partridge in a pear tree?
Oh crap! if you ever figure out who I am I will lose all anonymity!
but I do see a thread starting on the 31st to help us through the wait :)
EDIT:
Somebody should get ahold of the Pathfinder Database Pimp and ask him to do it. I'm sure he'd love to if he could then add it to the Database.