Kind of curious as to what people's thoughts are on what the best non-WotC 3.5 material they use in their games. I just recently bought the Advanced Players Manual and Advanced GameMasters Guide by Green Ronin, and I'm waiting for it to ship. So, while I'm waiting, what's the best (non-WotC) 3.5 material you use?
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Kind of curious as to what people's thoughts are on what the best non-WotC 3.5 material they use in their games. I just recently bought the Advanced Players Manual and Advanced GameMasters Guide by Green Ronin, and I'm waiting for it to ship. So, while I'm waiting, what's the best (non-WotC) 3.5 material you use?
are you looking player prospective or DM prospective?
I've only DMed latly, so I can give you those thoughts....
Anything Paizo: best blend of fluff/crunch I have seen bar none
Advanced Besiary (green ronin) - Tons of templates to slap on any creature, to make it fit whatever situation.
Tome of Horrors (Necromancer Games) You like the classics that didn't make the MM1? 99% of them are here. and the stats were more solidly built than MM2.
I rate any of the above higher than 90% of their WotC counterparts
are you looking player prospective or DM prospective?
Why, both of course!
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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GM:
Secrets of Pact Magic/Villians of Pact Magic by Radience house. Excellent rules for Binders, lots of options and a hint of a inquisition style campaign setting
Untapped Potential/Races of the Mind/Etc from Dreamscarred Press. Their stuff is excellent for the Psionics fan. I recommend it over Mindscapes. not to slight Bruce, but Dreamscarred comes from different directions than he, as the 3.0PH and XPH writer may have not thought of.
McWoD. An excellent magic system, that alone is worth the price.
Book of X Might/Luck lots of ideas. Love the Gutter Mage.
Kobold Quarterly aka "Look WotC, let me show you what happens when you leave a vacuum."
Hamanauptra.
Testiment, even if you never play Mosses, it is an invaluable book for culture and ideas.
Pretty much anything that has Paizo written on it.
Player:
Kalamar's Goods and Gear. Because you can never have enough stuff to pound on the bad guys with.
Races of Krynn: gives some of the old races a new look. Also has a section called "How to play a Kender without being beat in the parking lot after the game."
Green Ronin's Planetouched book. more options.
d20 guide to freeport, and their rules free/light freeport books. Good rules, good reading.
Tricky Owlbear's "Behind the X" and compilations, great if you want to take a signature spell, say Vampiric Touch, and build a character schtick out of it.
That's off the top of my head.
~laughter~ I will have to pick up the Races of Krynn sometime!
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Book of Fiends (Green Ronin) - best devil/demon/daemon bestiary ever.
Beyond Countless Doorways (Malhavoc) - best planar book ever.
Advanced Bestiary (Green Ronin) - best template book ever.
Tome of Horrors series (Necromancer) - best generic bestiary, only MM 3 gets any close.
The Wurst of Grimtooth's Traps (Necromancer) - best traps book ever.
En Route series (Atlas Games) - best collection of travel-related sidetreks, ever.
[minor threadjack]I've heard a lot of good things about the Tomes of Horror, 1-3 and the Revised first Tome, and I tried to purchase them in hardback form some months ago. Unfortunately, I was unable to do so. I couldn't find them on Paizo and encountered a lot of difficulties at Necromancer Games' site. Is there any way to get these supplements other than PDF (and preferably new rather than used), and if so, how?[/minor threadjack]
[minor threadjack]I've heard a lot of good things about the Tomes of Horror, 1-3 and the Revised first Tome, and I tried to purchase them in hardback form some months ago. Unfortunately, I was unable to do so. I couldn't find them on Paizo and encountered a lot of difficulties at Necromancer Games' site. Is there any way to get these supplements other than PDF (and preferably new rather than used), and if so, how?[/minor threadjack]
Amazon.com or ebay. Try there. That is how I got the Tome of Horrors II and III. I have the PDF of the Tome of Horrors I (3.5) but not the print edition. I need to see if I can get Kinkos to print it out sometime.
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RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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[minor threadjack]I've heard a lot of good things about the Tomes of Horror, 1-3 and the Revised first Tome, and I tried to purchase them in hardback form some months ago. Unfortunately, I was unable to do so. I couldn't find them on Paizo and encountered a lot of difficulties at Necromancer Games' site. Is there any way to get these supplements other than PDF (and preferably new rather than used), and if so, how?[/minor threadjack]
Write Clark a really nice letter thanking him for announcing the rerelease of TOH I-III revised, in hardcover format.
No, he hasn't announced this, but if enough people mail him, he might see a profit margin to keep Necromancer afloat while WotC fiddles on the GSL. I have II and III in dead tree, and would love to have I revised the same way.
McWoD. An excellent magic system, that alone is worth the price.
Book of X Might/Luck lots of ideas. Love the Gutter Mage.
I was unable to decipher your abbreviations ("McWoD" and "Book of X Might/Luck"). Please elucidate!
McWoD = Monte Cook's World of Darkness
Book of X Might/Luck- The Book of Eldritch Might 1-3, the Book of Hallowed Might 1-2, and the Book of Experimental Might 1-2, all by Monte Cook, and the Book of Iron Might by Mike Mearls, and the Book of Roguish Luck by Wolfgang Baur, all published by Malhavoc Press.
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RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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Thank you, too used to people using the shorthand.
Looking over my library, I'd add Relics and Rituals Olympus for some specialized setting play. Same thing goes for Nyambi, though for a Dark Africa instead.
Eldrich Sorcery is a little known Necromancer games product that is to spells what the ToH is to monsters. A few old friends, all dressed up in new SRD clothing. Lots of new stuff there too.
Thank you, Robert, for clearing up my confusion. I have heard of the Malhavoc books, but I didn't know that there had been that many variations published under similar titles. (I'm pretty good at deciphering the WotC abbreviations, but it gets a bit more difficult once one leaves the fold!)
Is the World of Darkness book based on White Wolf's setting(s)?
Thank you, Robert, for clearing up my confusion. I have heard of the Malhavoc books, but I didn't know that there had been that many variations published under similar titles. (I'm pretty good at deciphering the WotC abbreviations, but it gets a bit more difficult once one leaves the fold!)
Is the World of Darkness book based on White Wolf's setting(s)?
Monte Cook's World of Darkness is published by White Wolf and features the creatures from standard World of Darkness, but it isn't the same setting as the White Wolf World of Darkness, and it's built on the 3.5e mechanics. The setting is basically post-Apocalyptic Earth and the WoD-themed monsters are a result of Earth's contact with Elder God-like forces that nearly destroyed reality. (All the monster races have only been around for about a year.)
In MCWoD, races and classes are basically the same thing (so the classes are Vampire, Werewolf, Demon, Mage, & Awakened), meaning the classes don't immediately translate to another d20/3.5e game, and mechanics involving those race-classes are specific to MCWoD games, but while those don't translate to other games very well, the magic system is great and should be easy enough to transpose on another game. It's a build-your-own spell system with aspects of the spells broken down into points and mages draw from their pools of points to build their spells. Common combinations of spell parts are called rotes and they have an easier DC to cast than spells assembled on the fly. (It's possible that a character could develop their own rotes that they use over and over again as well.)
It's a cool book and I'd actually like to run a MCWoD game at some point but I'll probably incorporate the magic system into another campaign before I get around to running an actual MCWoD game.
Glad to be of help!
Unfortunately my previous post was made right before clocking out from work, so I didn't get to chime in with my own "Best of" recommendations.
Bar none, my favorite 3.x product is Monte Cook's Arcana Evolved. Sure, the setting isn't for everyone, but there is a lot of good material here. The races are well balanced against one another, the magic system is just plain better than core D&D's (IMHO), the melee classes have a lot more options and are more balanced against the casters, and you don't have to multiclass or buy half a dozen splats just to play an effective fighter-caster or agile swashbuckler from 1st level. More to the point, even though it is an alternate PHB, you can use it alongside other 3.x compatible material with minimal conversion. (No more than PFRPG is obviously going to require, anyway.)
A close second is the Complete Book of Eldritch Might. While the rest of the Books of...series by Malhavoc is good, this book, which collects all three BoEM volumes into a revised 3.5 edition is one of my favorite gaming books. I've owned this book for almost five years, and I am still finding little gems I had missed or forgotten each time I pick it up. From the variant Bard class to the expanded rules for intelligent items,to the fantastic locations, quirky magic items, and flavorful spells, this book never ceases to provide me with ideas for my games.
The rest of my list shares a common theme: They are all monster books. As a DM I like to keep my players guessing about what they might encounter next, so most of my d20 collection consists of things that creep, crawl, slither, and stomp about the unexplored corners of the world. Of my collection, I have to agree that the Tome of Horrors series by Necromancer Games are excellent resources, especially since their OGL status means that their contents can show up in other companies' adventures. Ditto for the Advanced Bestiary from Green Ronin. I also have a soft spot for the first Creature Collection (revised) from Sword and Sorcery, although later volumes failed to grab my attention as completely. Denizens of Avadnu, from Inner Circle Games is also a great book, chock full of alien and aberrant creatures that evoke the feel of the Sword and Planet sub-genre. Finally, no AE fan can list his favorite bestiaries without mentioning Legacy of the Dragons. Some of my fondest gaming memories involve insidious Valloreans, implacable Akashic Seekers, and vomiting Dothrogs, and I can't imagine my games without them.
Robert "Oh, And Any Paizo Adventure, But I Assumed That Was A Given" Ranting
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I love the "Pale Designs: A Poisoner's Handbook" from Bastion Press.
The alternate poison damage rules are pretty cool, but steep. I think the concept was really awesome, but the damage poison does is a bit much. I think it should be more expensive to get poison under the alt damage rules.
BUT
It puts fear back into poison like 1st and 2nd Edition D&D did and I LOVE that.
Lots of good stuff here everyone!
"Paths of Magic" from some company I can't remember had an idea in it I really liked -- there were "schools" you could go to pay (in both gold and exp) and learn new tricks from. The longer you stayed with the school (paying more in gold and exp) the better the tricks got (anywhere from fire resistance, to creating fire, to a fiery aura thing).
First off great stuff, put me down for most of Necro, and MH press stuff as well. If I can add but a few.
Most books for WoWC RPG: They use the magic system of Arcana Evolved but the classes work well as standard fair. Why the recomendation? Two reasons, better goblins (in my game I call them Steam Goblins) and best tech rules for high fantasy, including prebuilt items, how to build your own and related feats. Yes I like IK system as well, but thats IMHO too setting specific to work well genericly, but a good setting nevertheless.
R&R Excalibur: If you like high fantasy but less Tolkin or WoWish, then this is for you. The Knight class in the game might be underpowered compaired to later Wizards or Pathfinder classes, but up against the 3.5 core, he's just fine and better concept then most. Also its version of the Hobgoblin is what I always imaged that they should be. Great book.
Mythic Rases: This is 3.0 book but it still holds up well, and has at lest 5 races in it that I declared standard for my game. Including a golem like race created by Dwarves as well as a race to support the Sorc. concept.
Most Race/Class books by GR.What can I say I like classes, but I don't like over the top classes that Wizards pumped out, with names like Duskblade so that were made up for copyright protection. How about Noble, Archer, Pirate, Courter, Shaman, Cavaler, Elementalist and the like. Wizards gave us none of that. GR and a few other companies did.
I know we are looking at 3pp but if I may recomend Dragonlance Setting book for the Mystic alone. Its sort of 3 party, but its just a great class.
TTFN DRE
"Most books for WoWC RPG: They use the magic system of Arcana Evolved but the classes work well as standard fair."
Sorry, Andre, but this just is not true. The World of WarCraft RPG uses a lot of things from Arcana Evolved, like hero points, racial levels, and the idea of spellcasting classes with subclasses that fit themes, but it certainly doesn't use the magic system. I have been playing AU/E for a very long time, and I own both editions of the WoW RPG and most of the supplements, and the two are very different.
Arcana Evolved's Spell System...
1) Uses different spells than those in the SRD. Sorcerous blast, not fireball, etc.)
2) Has 10th level spells in addition to 0th-9th levels.
3)Has a heightened and diminished version for each spell (except 0th and 10th level spells, which are the bookends of the system.)
4) Does not use the metamagic feats out of the SRD, and instead has its own series of feats to alter spells by applying template effects or ladening spells by spending multiple slots of the same level.
5) Restricts spell access by complexity (Simple, complex, exotic) and grants access by descriptor and feats.
6) has seperate charts for both spells readied and spell slots, allowing every class to have more spells "on hand" than they have slots to cast them.
7) allows you to ready all of your spells in one hour, and to take one hour to re-prepare your spells readied list if you come across an obstacle for which you don't have the spell handy, rather than waiting a whole day.
By constrast, WoW RPG....
1) uses the SRD spells, plus a few setting specific ones.
2) has only 9th level spells
3) does not have heightened or diminished versions of spells.
4) uses the SRD's metamagic feats.
5) Restricts spell access by arcane/divine distinctions and class lists
6) Has a single chart for spells prepared (like the SRD Wizard) for the Arcanist and Healer.
7) Requires that you spend one minute per spell level to prepare your spells each morning, increasing the time it takes to prepare spells as you gain more of them. Moreover, you can't stop and change them later in the day, you have to wait for the next day.
Wilderlands of High Fantasy Box Set from Necromancer Games.
Pure old-school goodness.
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Contributor
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Now I'm biased as hell on this but I'd add in:
The Great City Campaign Setting, 0onegames
The Road to Revolution, 0onegames
of course, I'm a writer on these; so, like I said - totally biased.
Arcana Evolved is both awesome and completely whack at the same time. Loved it.
I've also got to commend Goodman Games' Dungeon Crawl Classics line. Nothing like a big "old skool" dungeon romp wherein you kick down doors, kill goblins and take their lewt.
RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
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Anything Scarred lands (I love the setting sue me)
I picked up several of the books over the last two weeks, and I'm inclined to agree. It has the same kind of atmosphere, with big unanswred questions looming in the background, as Eberron, but it provides some way for the DM to address them.
Fantasy Flight Games.
Awesome - check out "traps and treachery I & II". Full diagrams of traps and how they work - and how to disarm etc. Also the "seafarers handbook". These guys are brilliant.
Yeah the fantasy flight are great books but they have one of the most broken pretige classes ever. There Force Mage in Path of Magic is very broken just a side note but these books are all great
"Most books for WoWC RPG: They use the magic system of Arcana Evolved but the classes work well as standard fair."Sorry, Andre, but this just is not true. The World of WarCraft RPG uses a lot of things from Arcana Evolved, like hero points, racial levels, and the idea of spellcasting classes with subclasses that fit themes, but it certainly doesn't use the magic system. I have been playing AU/E for a very long time, and I own both editions of the WoW RPG and most of the supplements, and the two are very different.
Arcana Evolved's Spell System...
1) Uses different spells than those in the SRD. Sorcerous blast, not fireball, etc.)2) Has 10th level spells in addition to 0th-9th levels.
3)Has a heightened and diminished version for each spell (except 0th and 10th level spells, which are the bookends of the system.)
4) Does not use the metamagic feats out of the SRD, and instead has its own series of feats to alter spells by applying template effects or ladening spells by spending multiple slots of the same level.
5) Restricts spell access by complexity (Simple, complex, exotic) and grants access by descriptor and feats.
6) has seperate charts for both spells readied and spell slots, allowing every class to have more spells "on hand" than they have slots to cast them.
7) allows you to ready all of your spells in one hour, and to take one hour to re-prepare your spells readied list if you come across an obstacle for which you don't have the spell handy, rather than waiting a whole day.
By constrast, WoW RPG....
1) uses the SRD spells, plus a few setting specific ones.2) has only 9th level spells
3) does not have heightened or diminished versions of spells.
4) uses the SRD's metamagic feats.
5) Restricts spell access by arcane/divine distinctions and class lists
6) Has a single chart for spells prepared (like the SRD Wizard) for the Arcanist and Healer.
7) Requires that you spend one minute per spell level to prepare your spells each...
Sorry Robert Ranting, I miss-spoke ehhh typed. You are quite correct, I was talking about how they used magic using classes. As to hero points many games have a version of that, and I ignore all. As to Racial Levels I don't think thats unique to Arcana Evolved, they might not be in the SRD but Wizards has them, and to a lesser extent most OGL D20 type games. In Either case my point was that the Tech system, Goblin, and Tinker from WOW RPG is for me a must have.
TTFN Dre
Besides paizo, I love what Green Ronin did the last few years, be it the advanced rulebooks, classes and races books, historical settings or Freeport.
Stefan
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[minor threadjack]I've heard a lot of good things about the Tomes of Horror, 1-3 and the Revised first Tome, and I tried to purchase them in hardback form some months ago. Unfortunately, I was unable to do so. I couldn't find them on Paizo and encountered a lot of difficulties at Necromancer Games' site. Is there any way to get these supplements other than PDF (and preferably new rather than used), and if so, how?[/minor threadjack]Amazon.com or ebay. Try there. That is how I got the Tome of Horrors II and III. I have the PDF of the Tome of Horrors I (3.5) but not the print edition. I need to see if I can get Kinkos to print it out sometime.
I think the subject was brought up numerous times:
Tome of Horrors I revised was never published in print, it's **only** available as pdf. Only the 3.0 version was printed. If you look for current stats and a somewhat clearer layout, I rather recommend printing out the revised version (I did so).|
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[minor threadjack]I've heard a lot of good things about the Tomes of Horror, 1-3 and the Revised first Tome, and I tried to purchase them in hardback form some months ago. Unfortunately, I was unable to do so. I couldn't find them on Paizo and encountered a lot of difficulties at Necromancer Games' site. Is there any way to get these supplements other than PDF (and preferably new rather than used), and if so, how?[/minor threadjack]Write Clark a really nice letter thanking him for announcing the rerelease of TOH I-III revised, in hardcover format.
** spoiler omitted **
... or go to this thread. After all Paizo is Necromancer Games' new publisher:
Current count: 185 postings.Kr,
Günther
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Creature Collection II Revised is pretty good.
I take it that you meant Creature Collection I Revised (Creature Collection II already is 3.5e).
I second that proposal: Its 3e version was the first 3e monster book ever (appearing even before th 3e MM) and it has some really neat critters usable in every fantasy setting.
I also recommend the "Scarred Lands" setting by Swords & Sorcery including the class supplements and the Relics & Rituals books which invented some nice new magic rules.
Additional recommendations:
- A Magical Medieval Society By Xpeditious Retreat Press: Great treatment of d20 campaigning in a medieval setting.
- If the Advanced Bestiary is mentioned, I can also recommend its "twin": The Book of Templates Deluxe by Goodman Games. As thick, as good, as expensive as the Advanced Bestiary.
- If you want to tinker with standard monsters and want to perfectly understand the mechanics of monster creation, Beast Builder by Xpeditious Retreat Press is a good choice.
- Looking for a cheap collection of OGL spells: Choose Mongoose Publishing's Renegade Wizard's Spell Book/ Renegade Cleric's Tome (new price for these thick hard covers = 19 $$ each!)
- Complete Book of Eldritch Might and Book of Hallowed Might I + II: good add-ons for arcane and divine spell casters (the two books for rogues and fighters are judged differently, I can't comment on those)
- If you look for adventures with an old edition feel to them, the Dungeon Crawl Classics series by Goodman Games (up to adventure #52 = before their shift to 4e) are very recommendable. Unfortunately the 3.5e line was discontinued last month. I like Necromancer Games' adventures even more, though.
- Atlas Games created some really great supplements for specific campaign styles under their Penumbra brand: Demagogues & Dynasties for political campaigns, Crime & Punishment for crime adventures, and finally Love & War for chivalric campaigns.
Also a good choice is the Nyambe setting for african campaigns, easily insertible in Golarion in the Mwangi Expanse.
Also have a look into other postings in the forum folder: There were similar inquiries with other good tips in them.
Cheers,
Günther
I take it that you meant Creature Collection I Revised (Creature Collection II already is 3.5e).
Point of clarification - Creature Collection II is 3.0. Tome of Horrors II is 3.5. (Creature Collection II came out in 2001.)
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Creature Collection II Revised is pretty good.I take it that you meant Creature Collection I Revised (Creature Collection II already is 3.5e).
I second that proposal: Its 3e version was the first 3e monster book ever (appearing even before th 3e MM) and it has some really neat critters usable in every fantasy setting.
Yes. My mistake. I have been very very pleased with using Creature Collection Revised in my games. Creatures such as the Ice Haunt are very very well done. There is, indeed, no II associated with it. Just Creature Collection Revised. Its surprisingly good.
I cannot underscore enough how elegant ToH I, II, and III really are. They have the abundant feel of first edition (for those of us who remember it well), and yet the creatures function superbly in a 3.5 or Pathfinder game.
I love using OGL stuff from time to time. Here are some of my favorites:
The Quintessential Books by Mongoose publishing. Particularly the Fighter, Monk and Wizard books. One of the few series of books (ogl or otherwise) that I've found to be useable without changes.
The one word title AEG books. The best is Mercenaries, but War, Evil and Good are all cool. Be warned some of this definately needs tweeking before using.
If you have good players the Occutlism book is good, but only for experienced play (probably very experienced players).
The Path of books (can't remember the publisher). A few small balancing issues but the Legendary classes are one of the most inovative options I've seen, I would love for my players to work on developing new ones.
There is one OGL book that a friend of mine told me about that I would love to find again. Unfortunately I can't remember anything about the title or publisher. Basically it looked at the impact of magic on medievil society. Stuff like what sort of taxes would be levied on magic items and how that would be enforced. The impact of certain magic items on various professions and what that would be for the society. A list of real world punishments for various crimes, plus the way magic would add to the list of offenses and punishments. One of the most well thought out and historically realistic (not the same as accurate) D&D books I've ever heard of. If anyone knows the title and/or publisher let me know please.
...There is one OGL book that a friend of mine told me about that I would love to find again. Unfortunately I can't remember anything about the title or publisher. Basically it looked at the impact of magic on medievil society. Stuff like what sort of taxes would be levied on magic items and how that would be enforced. The impact of certain magic items on various professions and what that would be for the society. A list of real world punishments for various crimes, plus the way magic would add to the list of offenses and punishments. One of the most well thought out and historically realistic (not the same as accurate) D&D books I've ever heard of. If anyone knows the title and/or publisher let me know please.
That sounds like A Magical Medieval Society to me.
The Quintessential Books by Mongoose publishing. Particularly the Fighter, Monk and Wizard books. One of the few series of books (ogl or otherwise) that I've found to be useable without changes.
The one word title AEG books. The best is Mercenaries, but War, Evil and Good are all cool. Be warned some of this definately needs tweeking before using.
If you have good players the Occutlism book is good, but only for experienced play (probably very experienced players).
The Path of books (can't remember the publisher). A few small balancing issues but the Legendary classes are one of the most inovative options I've seen, I would love for my players to work on developing new ones.
There is one OGL book that a friend of mine told me about that I would love to find again. Unfortunately I can't remember anything about the title or publisher. Basically it looked at the impact of magic on medievil society. Stuff like what sort of taxes would be levied on magic items and how that would be enforced. The impact of certain magic items on various professions and what that would be for the society. A list of real world punishments for various crimes, plus the way magic would add to the list of offenses and punishments. One of the most well thought out and historically realistic (not the same as accurate) D&D books I've ever heard of. If anyone knows the title and/or publisher let me know please.
Your "Path of . . . " books are from Fantasy Flight Games. Some of my favorites as well, along with the Scarred Lands material from White Wolf, the Quintessential books, and a few from Bastion Press (Guildcraft, Faerie, and Alchemy and Herbalism: particularly the last).
That sounds like A Magical Medieval Society to me.
...There is one OGL book that a friend of mine told me about that I would love to find again. Unfortunately I can't remember anything about the title or publisher. Basically it looked at the impact of magic on medievil society. Stuff like what sort of taxes would be levied on magic items and how that would be enforced. The impact of certain magic items on various professions and what that would be for the society. A list of real world punishments for various crimes, plus the way magic would add to the list of offenses and punishments. One of the most well thought out and historically realistic (not the same as accurate) D&D books I've ever heard of. If anyone knows the title and/or publisher let me know please.
I believe that may be the right book. Although I think some of the players might scream bloody murder if I attempted to enforce the taxation rules.... Still I think I may pick that up for fun and future torture.
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I love using OGL stuff from time to time. Here are some of my favorites:
The Quintessential Books by Mongoose publishing. Particularly the Fighter, Monk and Wizard books. One of the few series of books (ogl or otherwise) that I've found to be useable without changes.
[...]
Then you'll be happy to see that many of the Quintessential Books and many other OGL books are available online for free.
AfaIk only copyrighted material was withold from publication. Still it's worth just for the free rules content found there.
Here is the link.
Enjoy!
Günther