Not that I can do anythign about it or influence the people who come onto these boards, but I need to know if I'm sugar-coating my memories when I think of the paizo boards pre 4-E announcement as a nicer and more polite environment.
I remember being stunned at the civility of the boards when I first started having come from the flaming troll-pool of the WoTC boards. Lately it's seemed to me that people are taking 4E and Pathfinder as excuses to be arrogant and rude for no reason other than that there are no real consequences. I remember being stunned at the literacy of the posters who treated these boards as what they are: a forum for the literate and civil discussion of a mutually enjoyed hobby.
So where are those glory days of yesteryear? Are they only in my memories or did they never actually exist?
You're not wrong.I think all the jerkiness you're seeing is a natural result of the RPG Beta being released. Something about new game mechanics really brings the jerks crawling out of the woodworks.
After some time it'll abate.
Then the final Pathfinder RPG will come out and the jerks will come out again.
And then, once more, it'll abate. Nerd rage is like the ebb and flow of the tides. It's beautiful in it's primal simplicity.
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They did. They existed. That's part of the reason I get so mad over this junk. I feel like all of the sudden all these trolls are popping up everywhere, trying to drag my internet Tanelorn into the damn abyss.
I hope when it's all said and done, it'll be back to the once in a while Takasi/penultimate whiner/whatever to briefly interrupt the placidity. I think it's just a sign of the times though.
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You're not wrong.I think all the jerkiness you're seeing is a natural result of the RPG Beta being released. Something about new game mechanics really brings the jerks crawling out of the woodworks.
I pretty much agree with this, nerd rage is running wild for now until something new and shiney distracts them.
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You're not wrong.I think all the jerkiness you're seeing is a natural result of the RPG Beta being released. Something about new game mechanics really brings the jerks crawling out of the woodworks.
After some time it'll abate.
Then the final Pathfinder RPG will come out and the jerks will come out again.
And then, once more, it'll abate. Nerd rage is like the ebb and flow of the tides. It's beautiful in it's primal simplicity.
Agreed. Except for the beautiful :-)
As a refugee from the WoTC boards I'll admit I've likely brought along some of my angst/baggage/prejudices. Still healing from the burns you see.
Sad thing was I tried to be a neutral party, most of the time, and I still got flamed. Even attempts at jokes/peace brokering/tongue-in-cheek failed.
Over time we refugees will blend into our new homes. Paizo goodness heals all wounds!
I've seen some 4e wars on these boards before but just now a saw a nasty thread by Psychic_robot. Now I know what you mean with this thread....
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Yes, but more specifically I think it was the cancellation of the magazines where things turned first. And I think the open PF playtest had the unexpected effect of bringing out into the open a lot of people with some with some very odd notions of board ettiquette. The 4e stuff is actually a lot calmer now - PF seems to be the controversial area. So yeah, but I also think it goes up and down in waves. Unfortunately, this seems to be a rising tide at the moment, probably coinciding with the release of the beta.
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I remember being stunned at the civility of the boards when I first started having come from the flaming troll-pool of the WoTC boards. Lately it's seemed to me that people are taking 4E and Pathfinder as excuses to be arrogant and rude for no reason other than that there are no real consequences. I remember being stunned at the literacy of the posters who treated these boards as what they are: a forum for the literate and civil discussion of a mutually enjoyed hobby.
So where are those glory days of yesteryear? Are they only in my memories or did they never actually exist?
Right after the announcement, there was a lot of hand-wringing and histrionics, which quickly devolved into name-calling, and, unfortunately, a lot of people brought baggage from other sites (such as WotC or ENWorld) and accused everyone on the other side of calling them things or saying things about them that, in some cases, didn't even get said, *on this site* or *by these people.*
Lines were drawn up and everybody was either a grognard, fatbeard, hater, fascist, irrational, etc. or whatever they called the enthusiasts. (I hear they called them fanbois on other sites, but never saw that here. I myself am guilty of calling them name-callers, whenever one of them would call me crazy or stupid or 'afraid of change' or 'blinded by nostalgia' or whatever.)
As far as I've seen, the name-calling is over. There are still threads that concern-troll or incite knee-jerk reactions, almost always easy to recognize and avoid, because they'll use keywords like '4E' or 'like WoW' or 'not the D&D I know.' This makes them easy to avoid.
Eventually, you'll recognize the same names cropping up, and notice that these particular posters *never* post any sort of character build advice or helpful commentary or rules help, just attempting to build and maintain their fires by starting thread after thread challenging some straw man they've constructed and trying to lure people into defending it as their own.
I've tried to stick to posting more helpful information and rules discussion and stuff, and ignoring those waving figures standing by the fire, gesticulating wildly for my attention.
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I went lurking at the WotC boards for a little while yesterday. It's still a bunch of trolls, flames and moderator warnings. I thought about how much nicer the Paizo boards are, and that was in comparison to yesterday's threads. The edition wars may have people a little worked up right now, but Paizo folks are still more civil even when we diametrically disagree.
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RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 16
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They did. They existed. That's part of the reason I get so mad over this junk. I feel like all of the sudden all these trolls are popping up everywhere, trying to drag my internet Tanelorn into the damn abyss.
I hope when it's all said and done, it'll be back to the once in a while Takasi/penultimate whiner/whatever to briefly interrupt the placidity. I think it's just a sign of the times though.
I know what you mean bout getting mad. I miss the old days. What really fries me is that anymore it is common for someone to make a rude post and when several people call them on it is suddenly the people calling for civil conversations who are in turn called rude.
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I've tried to stick to posting more helpful information and rules discussion and stuff, and ignoring those waving figures standing by the fire, gesticulating wildly for my attention.
I know what you mean. Earlier today I finally closed the 4th Edition Forum in my account. The early discussions are now moot, since it is already out, and my frequented FR thread is in the 3rd Edition Forum now. Since I don't play 4th Edition, I have nothing constructive to add to rules discussions. Once in a while I might check in for something interesting about DMing or characters, but it is easier to just stay away.
Han shot first!
NO! George Lucas is a god. Whatever he ret-cons is the infallible truth! RAAAWWWR! NEERRRRRRD! ;)
I started posting here a little while before the mags were canceled and it certainly has changed.
Sniff. Sniff.
<Walks away gripping a dangling six pack by an empty loop.>
Pop. Fizz.
I know what you mean bout getting mad. I miss the old days. What really fries me is that anymore it is common for someone to make a rude post and when several people call them on it is suddenly the people calling for civil conversations who are in turn called rude.They did. They existed. That's part of the reason I get so mad over this junk. I feel like all of the sudden all these trolls are popping up everywhere, trying to drag my internet Tanelorn into the damn abyss.
I hope when it's all said and done, it'll be back to the once in a while Takasi/penultimate whiner/whatever to briefly interrupt the placidity. I think it's just a sign of the times though.
Been on the receiving end of that. Still, these forums are WAY better so I can weather the occasional storm.
And though I'm not trying to kiss up to any posters in particular I find the general conversations here to be pretty intelligent, both in game and general knowledge.
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Dichotomies.
The cancelling of the magazines was bad. But it spawned Pathfinder, which was good.
D&D 3.5 being canned was bad. But it led to the Pathfinder RPG, which was good.
The Pathfinder RPG brought a lot of new people to these boards, which was good.
But a very vocal minority turned out to be absolute tools, which was bad.
Loving this nerd rage idea. Can somebody stat up what happens to a peturbed nerd? I'd adore you forever.
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Done. Please adore me.
Nerd-Rage
A nerd can fly into a rage a certain number of times per day. In a rage, a nerd temporarily gains a +4 bonus to Intelligence, a +4 bonus to their Leadership score, and a +2 perfection bonus on Will saves. In addition, he/she take a -4 penalty to Wisdom. The increase in Intelligence increases the nerd’s skill modifiers by 2 points (most effective on Knowledge [Useless Trivia] checks). While raging, a nerd cannot use any Charisma-, Wisdom-, or Intelligence-based skills (except for all Knowledge skills, and Search checks to find information on Wikipedia), the Concentration skill, or any abilities that require patience or concentration, nor can he/she understand the words of other people (this has the added benefit of making the nerd immune to any ability that requires language to function). He/she can use any feat he/she has except any feat that would be considered a Fighter bonus feat. A fit of rage lasts for a number of rounds equal to 3 + the nerd’s (newly improved) Intelligence modifier. A nerd may prematurely end his rage, but only by consuming at least $10 worth of Mountain Dew. At the end of the rage, the nerd loses the rage modifiers and restrictions and becomes fatigued (-2 penalty to Strength, -2 penalty to Dexterity, can’t perform any physical activities while he/she sits in place shaking) for the duration of the current messageboard thread (unless he is a 17th-level nerd, at which point this limitation no longer applies).
A raging nerd always considers themselves to be the foremost expert on the subject being discussed, even if they have never actually experienced the subject. Reading about the subject on the internet gives the nerd enough references to make an raging argument. Even if a raging nerd has already lost an argument, they can continue the thread even when warned to cease by authorities by making a Will save against a DC equal to the Diplomacy check of the relevant poster.
A nerd can fly into a rage only once per thread. At 1st level he/she can use his/her rage ability once per day. At 4th level and every four levels thereafter, he/she can use it one additional time per day (to a maximum of six times per day at 20th level). Entering a rage takes no time itself, but a barbarian can do it only by posting a message, even in response to someone else’s post. Some conditions might trigger an involuntary rage. In the following cases, the nerd must succeed on a Will save (at the listed DC) or fly into a rage immediately, expending a use of their rage ability as normal.
Involuntary Nerd-Rage Triggers and Save DC to Avoid
Han Shot First - DC 12
Psionics - DC 15
Family Guy Compared to Simpsons - DC 18
Magic: Banned Tournament Cards - DC 20
Called a "Fanboy" - DC 22
Save or Die? - DC 25
Character vs. Character: Who Would Win? - DC 28
New Edition - DC 30
Tom Bombadil - DC 50
A Player may request from a DM additional triggers, change the matching of triggers to DC, or to swap triggers for other potential events, but must always have the same set of DCs in the same quantities.
Jal Dorak, you're new rage rules are useless! I don't even get anything to spend my rage points on. And what I do get is either overpowered or not worth taking! Insert inappropriate off-colour insult here! I know I'm right without even playtesting because I'm smarter than all of you!
You, Jal Dorak, are so beatiful... to me.
Done. Please adore me.
Nerd-Rage
Jal Dorak, you're new rage rules are useless! I don't even get anything to spend my rage points on. And what I do get is either overpowered or not worth taking! Insert inappropriate off-colour insult here! I know I'm right without even playtesting because I'm smarter than all of you!
<G> Nicely done!
Jal Dorak, you're new rage rules are useless! I don't even get anything to spend my rage points on. And what I do get is either overpowered or not worth taking! Insert inappropriate off-colour insult here! I know I'm right without even playtesting because I'm smarter than all of you!
Explosion of Gamer Rage seems like a well reasoned and intelligent person. I agree with every point he made. I'm glad someone finally said it.
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Jal Dorak, you're new rage rules are useless! I don't even get anything to spend my rage points on. And what I do get is either overpowered or not worth taking! Insert inappropriate off-colour insult here! I know I'm right without even playtesting because I'm smarter than all of you!
I added some new descriptions to the ability, but didn't have time to consider your input because the page was giving me errors.
EDIT: Presenting the all-new Nerd-Rage Powers
As a nerd gains experience, she learns to harness her rage in new ways. Starting at 2nd level, a nerd gains one rage power. She gains an additional rage power for every two levels of nerd attained after 2nd level. A nerd can use her rage powers only while raging, with each power consuming a set number of rage points. A nerd cannot select an individual power more than once. Unless otherwise noted, these abilities are swift actions that must be performed during the nerd’s post.
Animal Fury (Ex): The nerd may lash out with animal instinct. While writing a post, a nerd can treat all posters as their enemies, attacking every other poster in the thread at once. A nerd can use this power while losing an argument. If the post is succeeds, the nerd gains a +2 bonus on all checks to avoid losing the argument. (1 rage point)
Clear Mind (Su): A nerd may reroll a failed Will save. This power is used as an immediate action after the save is failed. The nerd must take the second result, even if it is worse. A nerd must be at least 8th level before selecting this power. (3 rage points)
Increased Suppression Reduction (Ex): The nerd gains the ability to overcome one post suppression per thread per 4 rage points spent. The nerd cannot increase her post suppression reduction by more than 3 with this power. A nerd must be at least 12th level before selecting this ability. (4, 8, or 12 rage points)
Idiotic Rage (Su): All of the nerd’s attacks deal an additional 1d6 points of ability damage for 1 round. The ability damage must be to Intelligence, Wisdom, or Charisma. This ability damage does not stack with ability damage dealt by special abilities if it is of the same type. A nerd must be at least 12th level before selecting this power. (12 rage points)
Guarded Stance (Ex): The nerd gains the ability to prevent other posters from quoting their posts a number of times per round equal to 1/2 their nerd level (2 rage points)
Intimidating Glare (Ex): The nerd can make an Intimidate check against one other poster as a free action as part of their post by using emoticons. If the nerd successfully demoralizes her opponent, the foe is shakenand unable to post for 2d6 hourse. (4 rage points)
Knockback (Ex): Anyone targeted by the nerd's post is forced into another thread. This power is used before any posts are made. (4 rage points)
Imaginary Insult (Ex): The nerd’s senses suddenly sharpen and she gains the ability to see posters attacking her even if their efforts are concealed (2 rage points)
Mighty Swing (Ex): The nerd attacks a prominent member of the community. This power is used as an immediate action once that community member has posted. A nerd must be at least 8th level before selecting this power. (120 rage points)
Moment of Clarity (Ex): The nerd does not take any of the penalties from rage for 1 post. This includes the penalty to Wisdom and the restriction on what actions can be performed. (4 rage points)
RSS Sight (Ex): The nerd’s senses grow incredibly sharp while raging and she gains the ability to monitor multiple threads at once. A nerd must have imaginary vision as a rage power or a valid e-mail account to select this rage power. (4 rage points)
Powerful Blow (Ex): The nerd can quote a number of posters equal to her nerd level. This power is used as a swift action before the post is made. (4 rage points)
Quick Refresh (Ex): The nerd can make an additional post above the normal limit of their browsers refresh time. This power is used as an immediate action when an opponent makes a post mentioning the nerd. (4 rage points)
Renewed Vigor (Su): The nerd heals 1d8 points of damage + her Constitution modifier. This power is used as a standard action. A nerd must be at least 6th level and possess a bag of Cheetos before selecting this power. (6,000,000 rage points)
Rolling Beard (Ex): The nerd gains a beard bonus to her Armor Class equal to 1/2 her nerd level for 1 round against ranged attacks. (2 rage points)
Roused Anger (Ex): The nerd may enter rage even if fatigued. This power is used as a free action when the nerd enters rage. (4 rage points)
Strength Surge (Ex): The nerd adds her nerd level on one Strength check. This power is used as an immediate action. (2 rage points)
Surprise Accuracy (Ex): The nerd adds her nerd level to the accuracy of one post. This power is used as a swift action before the post is linkified. (4 rage points)
Swift Fingers (Ex): The nerd gains an enhancement bonus to her typing speed for 1 post equal to 10 words per minute per 2 rage
points spent. Her speed cannot be increased by more than 30 wpm in this way. (2, 4, or 6 rage points)
Terrifying Howl (Su): The nerd unleashes a terrifying howl as a standard action. All non-nerds within 30 feet must make a Will save (DC equal to 10 + 1/2 the nerd’s level + the nerd’s Intelligence modifier) or be confused for 1d4+1 rounds. Once an enemy has made a save versus terrifying howl (successful or not) it is immune to this power for 24 hours. A nerd must have the intimidating glare rage power to select this rage power. A nerd must be at least 8th level before selecting this power. (8 rage points)
Unexpected Strike (Ex): The nerd can create a thread that avoids the post-eating monster once per day. A nerd must be at least 8th level before selecting this power. (1 rage points)
Apologies to any Paizonians who take offence at the beautiful Beta project being abused for humour in this manner.
I moved here from the WOTC boards a couple of years ago, not sure exactly when (I think it was right around the end of the Shackled City AP.)
I do think the cancellation of the mags and the announcement/release of 4th edition has created yet another rift in the greater nerd community, but I still think this is the only board I can go to and not get regularly ripped apart (perhaps even rended) by internet trolls. No one has ever personally attacked me on these boards, ever. People have disagreed with me, but no one has ever called me an idiot.
I have noticed that things have been heated, but compared to other places I frequent, this place is an oasis of sanity.
I have noticed that things have been heated, but compared to other places I frequent, this place is an oasis of sanity.
Damn straight- I think we should be thankful for small mercies.
Paizo is still head and shoulders above most other sites in terms of civility, and it's an indication of just how nasty the 4E schism has been that it's tainted the boards so badly.
Director of Narrative
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I would like to formally invite anyone with a sense of humor into my neighborhood over in the Off Topic forums here. Pull up a croissant and be ridiculous.<Looks around>
I thought we were already in your hood mate?
Yeah, okay....so maybe I don't pay that much attention sometimes. ;) ...and it's late in Texas right now.
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They did. They existed. That's part of the reason I get so mad over this junk. I feel like all of the sudden all these trolls are popping up everywhere, trying to drag my internet Tanelorn into the damn abyss.
I hope when it's all said and done, it'll be back to the once in a while Takasi/penultimate whiner/whatever to briefly interrupt the placidity. I think it's just a sign of the times though.
This pretty much sums up my take on the current situation as well.
I haven't been here for the longest time but things have really changed (in a very bad way) over the past few weeks. I came here to get away from the constant asshattery going on over at the WotC forums and now it's come here too. It saddens me to see the community so fractured.
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They did. They existed. That's part of the reason I get so mad over this junk. I feel like all of the sudden all these trolls are popping up everywhere, trying to drag my internet Tanelorn into the damn abyss.
I hope when it's all said and done, it'll be back to the once in a while Takasi/penultimate whiner/whatever to briefly interrupt the placidity. I think it's just a sign of the times though.
I know what you mean bout getting mad. I miss the old days. What really fries me is that anymore it is common for someone to make a rude post and when several people call them on it is suddenly the people calling for civil conversations who are in turn called rude.
The one that gets me is over on PF, which is "too important" to be worried about petty things such as civility. And if you suggest civility might be nice, you are just being stupid or not grasping "the importance". Meh, f!#$ 'em. I'm not even that sure I am really that happy with PF RPG, it is pretty clear my real-world group want to convert to 4e when we start playing D&D again in a few months after our RQ campaign, and this stuff is off-putting for me and actually colouring my view of the project.
Keep it quiet you little bastards!
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Yep ive noticed it as well. Ive always held the view that if you wouldent say it to someones face in real life then dont post it up in a forum. It is not political correctness to ask someone to communicate the same way you would communicate to someone face to face in real life. Simple fact is since odds are there never gonna see the other person in the flesh and they can hide behind some web nickname they feel they can be as rude and condesending as they want.
I do agree, cancellation of the magazines did change the nature of both Paizo and Paizo forums, after which there was lots of generic spite and venom in the air (on which I too contributed, apologies).
Announcement of Pathfinder could definitely be seen as a departure of Paizo from the road WotC was taking, and that caused some division...which was still further boosted by speculation and announcement of 4th edition soon afterwards.
I might comment more on that and of my general opinions about WotC, but that is kind of thing we are talking about here, right? So I won't.
But as far as Internet in general goes Paizo messageboards are still great, full of interesting, intelligent and entertaining people.