they are my favorite race, hell, lots of people love them as one can see by the numerous books just about these vile elves, but now that WotC is all "we created Drow, and you can't play with us unless you adhere to our Bane-like tyranny", will such a similar race make it into the Pathfinder world? or is such a race already present? and if so, where can i find more info?
Weren't Drow part of the OGL?
If not, WotC certainly doesn't own the concept of "Dark Elves". Personally, I'd prefer for paizo to come up with their own name for them for Golarion, to make them standout from the crowd, and to distance them from the rabid 'Drizzt Fanboys' out there.
EDIT:Krome answered my question before I asked it. :D
they are my favorite race, hell, lots of people love them as one can see by the numerous books just about these vile elves, but now that WotC is all "we created Drow, and you can't play with us unless you adhere to our Bane-like tyranny", will such a similar race make it into the Pathfinder world? or is such a race already present? and if so, where can i find more info?
The next Adventure Path coming out in August, the Second Darkness, has drow in it. Drow are part of the OGL, which Pathfinder is produced under. I don't know how viable drow PCs will be though.
Weren't Drow part of the OGL?
Definitely yes.
Gith*, Beholder, Mind Flayer, plus a few others are not OGL. Drow are safe for better or for worse.
I believe on that thread about the GSL, it was said that Drow are on the list of creatures therein. I know they are in the SRD, but could WotC have somehow got a copyright on them, or whatever it is that blocks Gtih and such others?
Which deity or deities do dark elves in Golorian worship? Do they worship members of the core pantheon or do they have their own? These question weigh heavy on my mind as I prepare for my Saturday game.One word...
Demons.
I would have also guess Zon-Kuthon.
I believe on that thread about the GSL, it was said that Drow are on the list of creatures therein. I know they are in the SRD, but could WotC have somehow got a copyright on them, or whatever it is that blocks Gtih and such others?
The GSL has nothing to do with the OGL.
Beholders, mindflayers, and gith were simply never entered under the OGL. Drow were. Once entered, they can never be retracted.
I believe on that thread about the GSL, it was said that Drow are on the list of creatures therein. I know they are in the SRD, but could WotC have somehow got a copyright on them, or whatever it is that blocks Gtih and such others?The GSL has nothing to do with the OGL.
Beholders, mindflayers, and gith were simply never entered under the OGL. Drow were. Once entered, they can never be retracted.
And the reason they were was becasue they come from real world mythology. Now the GSL will restrict some of D&D's take on the Dark Elves, no more Lolith, no more obsssion with spiders, and maybe no more women on top. Though I hope Paizo keeps that last one.
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And the reason they were was becasue they come from real world mythology. Now the GSL will restrict some of D&D's take on the Dark Elves, no more Lolith, no more obsssion with spiders, and maybe no more women on top. Though I hope Paizo keeps that last one.I believe on that thread about the GSL, it was said that Drow are on the list of creatures therein. I know they are in the SRD, but could WotC have somehow got a copyright on them, or whatever it is that blocks Gtih and such others?The GSL has nothing to do with the OGL.
Beholders, mindflayers, and gith were simply never entered under the OGL. Drow were. Once entered, they can never be retracted.
No. Drow cannot be used for the GSL. They're still fair game for the OGL. The two licenses are unrelated and, in fact, mutually exclusive.
@no specific person:
AH! To hell with those cursed drow!
Since drizzt, playing the "cool, misunderstood good-guy from evil-background hoshy" is just f*cking everywhere!
I REALLY HAVE ENOUGH OF THEM! (sorry)
If you want Drow in your campaign, make them REAL Drow!
No goody outcasts! They get hunted and sacrifices, dammit!
Again: MAKE THEM MORE EVIL THAN YOU EVEN CAN EMAGINE!
Make them cruel, make them sadistic, make them maniacal!
... damn.
@no specific person:
AH! To hell with those cursed drow!
Since drizzt, playing the "cool, misunderstood good-guy from evil-background hoshy" is just f*cking everywhere!I REALLY HAVE ENOUGH OF THEM! (sorry)
If you want Drow in your campaign, make them REAL Drow!
No goody outcasts! They get hunted and sacrifices, dammit!Again: MAKE THEM MORE EVIL THAN YOU EVEN CAN EMAGINE!
Make them cruel, make them sadistic, make them maniacal!... damn.
umm...who said i like the "cool, misunderstood good guy from a evil-background"???
my main PC is a Drow Necromancer Deity who enjoys going around using Know Death to tell people how their going to die....which is usually by his hands moments later. He also invented Dark Elven Wine, which is an alchemical wine that reproduces the affects of Confusion and Touch of Idiocy.
That's why I said: "@ no specific person".
I wasn't directly referring to you. It was just a burst of emotion.
Which deity or deities do dark elves in Golorian worship? Do they worship members of the core pantheon or do they have their own? These question weigh heavy on my mind as I prepare for my Saturday game.
They're demon worshippers, though I guess that some will also worship deities (especially since at least one archdemon made it to goddess - Lamashtu).
One of the demonlords is about vermin, so some of the drow will be verminkissers (not necessarily spiderkissers, though).
Some might be matriarchial (if there's a demoness who hates males), but I doubt that it will be the norm.
One thing I'm sure of: They WILL be evil. No, forget that: They will be Evil. Not the tame: "look how gangsta I am, I just killed my brother to get his place", but "Thought Hook Mountain Massacre was bad? Those ogres are just inbred amateurs. Now witness the work of the masters."
Drow are probably only a LA +1 race these days, though.
Drow are LA +2 in the SRD, and that spell resistance can get pretty damn high.
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no more Lolith, no more obsssion with spiders, and maybe no more women on top. Though I hope Paizo keeps that last one.
I definitely prefer the women on top... umm yeah ok anyway...
Nothing prevents the obsession with spiders. you just can't copy what WOTC has published because of copyright laws. you can rewrite the obsession though. You can't use Lolth, specifically, but can rewrite it all.
I hope not though.
If Drow have to be in Pathfinder I want them to be NASTY. Not just bad, but so evil, demons and devils say "that ain't right!"
Drow are probably only a LA +1 race these days, though.Drow are LA +2 in the SRD, and that spell resistance can get pretty damn high.
I think the thought was more that they're no more than LA +1 compared to Pathfinder races. SR is 11 + level, which means it's 10 + level for a human that encounters the drow. Add the practically mandatory Spell Penetration (and maybe greater Spell Penetration), and it's not so awesome any more.
Creative Director
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Which deity or deities do dark elves in Golorian worship? Do they worship members of the core pantheon or do they have their own? These question weigh heavy on my mind as I prepare for my Saturday game.
The drow of Golarion worship demon lords. Although there are LOTS of demon lords in our world (the current list is at about 30 and still growing), the drow pantheon itself is limited to 12 demon lords overall. Most drow worship one of these 12 (Lamashtu is NOT among these 12, by the way). Some renegade drow worship Rovagug, and there are of course a few others who worship other deities, but for the most part they worship one of the 12 core drow demon lords.
Once Second Darkness kicks into gear, we'll be revealing a LOT about Golarion's drow. And while I'm aware of the fact that they're popular choices for PCs (I've played two drow myself over the last few years), they won't be good choices for Second Darkness, really. The drow of Golarion are EVIL, after all.
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Once Second Darkness kicks into gear, we'll be revealing a LOT about Golarion's drow. And while I'm aware of the fact that they're popular choices for PCs (I've played two drow myself over the last few years), they won't be good choices for Second Darkness, really. The drow of Golarion are EVIL, after all.
Putting the "Ow!" back in Drow? ;-)
The drow of Golarion are EVIL, after all.
Die Drizzt! Die Ugly Abomination!
The drow of the Realms are also evil. Like, super-evil. City of the Spider Queen was really a renaissance of the eviler-than-you-can-imagine drow.
Plus there was that drow chick NPC back in the 3.0 'Realms core rulebook who was pretending to be a drizzt wannabe and gaining acceptance as a hero even though she was really 'normal' and totally evil. That made me laugh. Greenwood and crew are smart people, and they usually realize it when they're handling a cliche.
That said, I would discourage a focus on "dark elves" in this setting unless they are treated to a very fresh reinventing. Not because they aren't cool, but because I think many of us have had our fill of them for awhile.
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I prefer we pronounce drow anyway as long as d-r-o-w is not in it. It just is too connected to the Realms.
I prefer the shadow elves or dark elves, or ANYthing else... please oh please... I don't wanna play in the Realms... I wanna play in Golarion!
BTW Drow as in Out according to the official pronunciation guide.
That said, I would discourage a focus on "dark elves" in this setting unless they are treated to a very fresh reinventing. Not because they aren't cool, but because I think many of us have had our fill of them for awhile.
I don't think that there will be too much about them beyond Second Darkness. Second Darkness will have plenty of drow in it, though
But I also think that they'll get their very fresh reinventing.
Although there are LOTS of demon lords in our world (the current list is at about 30 and still growing),
Very nice. When is the Pathfinder Big Book O'Demons coming out?
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Which deity or deities do dark elves in Golorian worship? Do they worship members of the core pantheon or do they have their own? These question weigh heavy on my mind as I prepare for my Saturday game.The drow of Golarion worship demon lords. Although there are LOTS of demon lords in our world (the current list is at about 30 and still growing), the drow pantheon itself is limited to 12 demon lords overall. Most drow worship one of these 12 (Lamashtu is NOT among these 12, by the way). Some renegade drow worship Rovagug, and there are of course a few others who worship other deities, but for the most part they worship one of the 12 core drow demon lords.
Once Second Darkness kicks into gear, we'll be revealing a LOT about Golarion's drow. And while I'm aware of the fact that they're popular choices for PCs (I've played two drow myself over the last few years), they won't be good choices for Second Darkness, really. The drow of Golarion are EVIL, after all.
I know you don't want to give too much away, but would you have any suggestions for domanions for an evil drow cleric?
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Would now be the time to bring up what should be the proper pronunciation of "drow"?
I pronounce it, 'How now, brown Drow?'
But Drow are fickle. If a non-Drow says Drow, the Drow is going to snottily correct them, even if he has to add extra syllables...
"No, stupid human. It's pronounced Throatwobbler Mangrove."
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Would now be the time to bring up what should be the proper pronunciation of "drow"?I pronounce it, 'How now, brown Drow?'
But Drow are fickle. If a non-Drow says Drow, the Drow is going to snottily correct them, even if he has to add extra syllables...
"No, stupid human. It's pronounced Throatwobbler Mangrove."
And then the drow eats the human's heart and drinks the blood of the halfling! Animates both and asks "anymore stupid questions?"