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Tough, I decided to post here. It's relevant. Don't like it? C'est la vie.
I think it's important to note that on more than one occasion you have used foreign expressions in place of home-grown Americanisms. Please consider our linguists when you're posting.
As for the print quality: c'est magnifique!
I'd love to print in the U.S. of A. Really, I would. Not only would it be faster, but shipping would be cheaper from the printer to Paizo. But the reality is that the U.S. printing business isn't even in the same universe as that from China.
You're doing the right thing, Lisa. By pursuing maximum efficiency and profit for your business you're helping both your customers and the US economy as whole. And as your profit increases your business expands (you're hiring more people, right?). This is why the US has the most productive workers in the world and the highest standard of living. You're also doing more to alleviate poverty in China than any 100 UN aid programmes. As for US manufacturing, it's doing quite well, thanks, and being replaced by even better things. This is the basic concept of comparative advantage at work in the microcosm of the games industry.
flymm,
I looked at your profile, you've posts going back to 2005,
If you weren't causing trouble, I'd assume, in two years on these boards you know how to look at other threads.
This means if you looked, you'd see the other threads.
Thus, the term 'troll' fits.
And as to the original trade quality. How do you adjust for bleed-through on images. I'm honestly curious.
A) Learn to spell. Or at least make whittier attempts at repartee than intentionally spelling someone's name wrong.
B) Wow, you really did your homework on me by checking out my "profile". If you knew me, you'd know that I could care less about "etiquette". You'd also possibly be aware of the fact that I was doing what I could to bring this topic to the forefront AGAIN (and AGAIN, and AGAIN, and AGAIN), regardless of whomever else might have said something.
So, now that you're done attempting to pigeonhole and feel that you've shown yourself as an uber-poster...Perhaps we can get to know each other :)
Flynn
Tough, I decided to post here. It's relevant. Don't like it? C'est la vie.I think it's important to note that on more than one occasion you have used foreign expressions in place of home-grown Americanisms. Please consider our linguists when you're posting.
As for the print quality: c'est magnifique!
If you genuinely feel that supporting ourselves and taking pride in our own goods is determined by the words or phrases one uses...Well, perhaps you need to rethink your approach to things.
Flynn
Hey, I've never been called suave before. Thanks Flynn. :)
Denada!
I understand (and in some regards agree with) your concerns about jobs going overseas, but our messageboards aren't really the place to talk about that. It's a big, scary, political topic that would make a lot more sense on the messageboards for the Republican National Party or the Democratic National Party or large printing companies. Your time would be better spent writing your congressman or even asking a big printing corporation about why they cost so much.We have to go with the cheapest printers we can find. Right now, those printers are in China.
Mike, I couldn't disagree with you more. We HAVE to start talking SOMEWHERE. People blindly consume. They're more concerned about a t-shirt that costs $1 less than jobs here at home. And with regards to your comment about voting...well...I personally feel that not only are Dems and Reps two sides of the same coin, but that our dollar is eventually the best ballot to cast.
Fair enough Paizo has had to utilize the cheapest printing it could. Fair enough it wants good quality. At this point I'm taking the stance that we should have an option as subscribers to opt for PDF only. And whereas not everyone will be as willing as I am, I am suggesting that it be at the same price as getting it in the printed format.
Insane, possibly. But dammit, *something* has to happen to change things in our country. If we could get people to start looking at things and the way they spend their dollars...and where that money goes...maybe other things will change as well (dear lord I sound like a Hippie or something right now...HEMP rules!!! You can wear it!!!).
I acknowledge that there is NO perfect answer here. But change has to start somewhere.
Flynn - dedicated Paizo customer
For the love of God, Flynn, learn some basic economics.
*yawn*...yeah...sure...toilet reading....
And as a point of etiquette you _are_ being rude by infesting unrelated threads with your fanaticism. Grow up.
Out of curiosity, Krypter...do your wheaties taste any better with that healthy does of piety thrown in ?
Just kidding, of course (or am I ? :)
Fanatacism. Interesting.
Grow up? Used in such close proximity to "Fanatacism"...not something I'd have expected given the preceding diatribe...but hey, one can only imagine you were going for that comedic "twist" at the end...
Flynn
A) Learn to spell. Or at least make whittier attempts at repartee than intentionally spelling someone's name wrong.
Like "whittier"? I just hate to see the pot call the kettle black; otherwise I'd keep out of this.
B) If you knew me, you'd know that I could care less about "etiquette".
...or grammar, evidently, since you bring up spelling. If you "could care less," that implies a level of caring sufficient to endure loss. To imply that you don't care at all, "couldn't care less" would be more effective (and more correct).
...regardless of whomever else might have said something.
Sorry; more grammar. "Whom" applies to a direct object. In this case, you use it to refer to the person who has said something--a subject relationship--in which case "who" is correct.
And watch out for "rogue," or Fake Healer will jump all over you, too. We may be a bunch of penny-pinching users of Chinese-printed goods around here, but spelling and grammar are taken seriously!
A) Learn to spell. Or at least make whittier attempts at repartee than intentionally spelling someone's name wrong.Like "whittier"? I just hate to see the pot call the kettle black; otherwise I'd keep out of this.
B) If you knew me, you'd know that I could care less about "etiquette"....or grammar, evidently, since you bring up spelling. If you "could care less," that implies a level of caring sufficient to endure loss. To imply that you don't care at all, "couldn't care less" would be more effective (and more correct).
...regardless of whomever else might have said something.Sorry; more grammar. "Whom" applies to a direct object. In this case, you use it to refer to the person who has said something--a subject relationship--in which case "who" is correct.
And watch out for "rogue," or Fake Healer will jump all over you, too. We may be a bunch of penny-pinching users of Chinese-printed goods around here, but spelling and grammar are taken seriously!
lol, too funny Kirth.
Personally, I agree with Jacobs. If this is such a problem for you simply do not buy the products anymore. Boycott. That is very American form of protest.
Paizo has already said if they did not print in China they would not exist, what is better? Paizo or no Paizo?
And the bottom line is: Paizo officials have told you that they disagree with you and that it is THIER company and that they will run it as THEY see fit. Your ideas have been weighed measured and found wanting by the Paizo staff. That really is the end of the debate. So assert yourself with honor and take the rejection gracefully instead of being rude to people.
Hey now.. I'm no old codger and I want printed too. Can't sit on my toilet and read Dragon if it's digital. :P
Krypter wrote:
For the love of God, Flynn, learn some basic economics.
*yawn*...yeah...sure...toilet reading....
Hey! I thought we agreed that the digital version of Dragon would be the only thing read on the toilet! Now you want to add Foreign Affairs and economics to that? Wow. I don't know if I have enough time in the day to read all that material while on the toilet.
I'm taking a trip to Seattle this weekend to crash the Paizo office! I do it at least once a year, just to be a pain.
If you make it over to Victoria I'll buy you another Scotch and we'll talk Starmage. Or you can join our Pathfinder game Saturday evening (but you'll have to play a goblin like everybody else).
And the bottom line is: Paizo officials have told you that they disagree with you and that it is THIER company and that they will run it as THEY see fit. Your ideas have been weighed measured and found wanting by the Paizo staff. That really is the end of the debate. So assert yourself with honor and take the rejection gracefully instead of being rude to people.
Wow, come down bud. You're flying kinda high :)
Listen, all I've asked of Paizo directly is if I can opt to go PDF only, with the idea that maybe others may want to do it too.
And you know what a beautifull thing about this country is? You, my dear fellow gamer...can feel free to give your money to whomever you wish. You can buy products made wherever you wish (except Cuba). I merely am asking for an option. And that is something that we as Americans are all allowed too.
Go put your head some place cool. Mom will be home soon.
Flynn
so you conceed you're a rude whiner with a mission. Good for you.
Rather than discuss things and learn, you throw your own poo and think it smells good.
Got it. At least now I know who to ignore.
Ahhh..the old "/ignore" retort...bet you still think you're pretty darned cool, don't ya ? :)
And I'm rude because I'd like to see our economy do better? Doesn't that likely include you - your family - and your friends??? Rude whiner...uhhh, yeah. Ok. I'll take that mantle. Oh...AND let's not forget the ULTIMATE sin of not being more quiescent and accept the current and popular pablum...
Jeez people. All I'm trying to do is bring this issue to the front. AGAIN. On top of other threads. The more who read it, are HOPEFULLY the ones that wake up.
Flynn
And the bottom line is: Paizo officials have told you that they disagree with you and that it is THIER company and that they will run it as THEY see fit. Your ideas have been weighed measured and found wanting by the Paizo staff. That really is the end of the debate. So assert yourself with honor and take the rejection gracefully instead of being rude to people.Wow, come down bud. You're flying kinda high :)
Listen, all I've asked of Paizo directly is if I can opt to go PDF only, with the idea that maybe others may want to do it too.
And you know what a beautifull thing about this country is? You, my dear fellow gamer...can feel free to give your money to whomever you wish. You can buy products made wherever you wish (except Cuba). I merely am asking for an option. And that is something that we as Americans are all allowed too.
Go put your head some place cool. Mom will be home soon.
Flynn
Paizo has been very clear from day one that you can buy JUST the PDF, but if you subscribe you will get that for free. Had you been paying attention you never would have needed to ask such a question.
You jingoism is cute, but nothing more than amusing. Also, since I am Chinese, I CAN buy from Cuba. While your country has embargo on Cuba, mine does not. Perhaps you should make far less assumptions about people, and listen more. If you did you never would have had to ask.
I wish that Sebastian or Moff Rimmer were here, because they're really good at troll baiting. I just get offended and annoyed.
Flynn, please cease and desist. As James Jacobs has said, this is not the place to make political stands. You've been asked nicely. You however, continue to respond with overt rudeness and obstinacy. In no way do I wish to express an opinion about your 'topic', I just ask you to please take your crusade elsewhere. If you choose not to, I can only hope that you get smacked with the ban-hammer for which you seem to be crying out.
Please, pipe down.
I wish that Sebastian or Moff Rimmer were here, because they're really good at troll baiting. I just get offended and annoyed.
Flynn, please cease and desist. As James Jacobs has said, this is not the place to make political stands. You've been asked nicely. You however, continue to respond with overt rudeness and obstinacy. In no way do I wish to express an opinion about your 'topic', I just ask you to please take your crusade elsewhere. If you choose not to, I can only hope that you get smacked with the ban-hammer for which you seem to be crying out.
Please, pipe down.
Nope. Thanks for playing. You don't have to read this thread. And yes, my contribution to this thread IS on topic.
"overt rudeness and obstinacy". Cool :)
Flynn
I wish that Sebastian or Moff Rimmer were here, because they're really good at troll baiting. I just get offended and annoyed.
Flynn, please cease and desist. As James Jacobs has said, this is not the place to make political stands. You've been asked nicely. You however, continue to respond with overt rudeness and obstinacy. In no way do I wish to express an opinion about your 'topic', I just ask you to please take your crusade elsewhere. If you choose not to, I can only hope that you get smacked with the ban-hammer for which you seem to be crying out.
Please, pipe down.
Well said that man. Now, can we move on to something more than one person (rightly or wrongly) cares about.
Elcian
Well said that man. Now, can we move on to something more than one person (rightly or wrongly) cares about.Elcian
You can feel free to ignore my posting. You don't have to address it.
Flynn
Wow! I've forgotten what this thread was originally about.
While I do share many of the same concerns as Flynnster, and am personally alarmed by the corporate out sourcing that has become so common in the U.S., I do think Flynnster could have used a little more tact in his initial post. That being said, he is right, the message must be put out there and people must be made aware. Whether this particular thread was the place to do it seems unimportant now, as this topic has taken over the thread itself.
I sympathize with Paizo's cost/quality dilemma: I'm happy with everything I've seen by them (sadly haven't yet had the chance to pick up the new Pathfinder series) and I do get the feeling that they care deeply about their customer base from all the posts and threads I have perused over the last 9 months. I have to say, they are, perhaps right in pointing us to printers and manufacturers here in this country who's prices are so high.
I am curious as to why exactly the costs are so high here in the U.S.? I understand that there are material costs, and the employees have higher wages and safer work places , but the fact that it costs publishers 2 to 3 times as much to publish here in the states is baffling to me. I can understand the cost being more, but that much? How much money do the employees make? How much money are the individuals who are heads of these printing presses getting? Are the materials here in the U.S. more expensive and why? Also how many of these printers have dual presses here and in China (if any)? These are question I would like to see answered, just to generate more questions really. Some of this I can, and will, research myself, and maybe some of the answers appear elsewhere on the boards, which i am going to look through.
So while I agree with Flynnster, (though thought he was a bit untactful there to start), there's a lot of questions I myself would like to find out the answers to.
Well said that man. Now, can we move on to something more than one person (rightly or wrongly) cares about.Elcian
You can feel free to ignore my posting. You don't have to address it.
Flynn
It wasn't the content I was addressing, just the repetitive nature of the argument. You have a point. Its made. Move on.
That said I will follow your advice and ignore your posts from now on.
Elcian
Wow! I've forgotten what this thread was originally about.
While I do share many of the same concerns as Flynnster, and am personally alarmed by the corporate out sourcing that has become so common in the U.S., I do think Flynnster could have used a little more tact in his initial post. That being said, he is right, the message must be put out there and people must be made aware. Whether this particular thread was the place to do it seems unimportant now, as this topic has taken over the thread itself.
I sympathize with Paizo's cost/quality dilemma: I'm happy with everything I've seen by them (sadly haven't yet had the chance to pick up the new Pathfinder series) and I do get the feeling that they care deeply about their customer base from all the posts and threads I have perused over the last 9 months. I have to say, they are, perhaps right in pointing us to printers and manufacturers here in this country who's prices are so high.
I am curious as to why exactly the costs are so high here in the U.S.? I understand that there are material costs, and the employees have higher wages and safer work places , but the fact that it costs publishers 2 to 3 times as much to publish here in the states is baffling to me. I can understand the cost being more, but that much? How much money do the employees make? How much money are the individuals who are heads of these printing presses getting? Are the materials here in the U.S. more expensive and why? Also how many of these printers have dual presses here and in China (if any)? These are question I would like to see answered, just to generate more questions really. Some of this I can, and will, research myself, and maybe some of the answers appear elsewhere on the boards, which i am going to look through.
So while I agree with Flynnster, (though thought he was a bit untactful there to start), there's a lot of questions I myself would like to find out the answers to.
On the whole I agree with you, though I have to say since I live in the UK, US jobs or Chinese jobs? Either way the UK doesn't benifit so I'll go with best cost. Thats Capitalism for you.
Elcian
PS. OK I have a soft spot for the US so I would pay a bit more, just dont ramp the price up.
On the whole I agree with you, though I have to say since I live...
Ok...one order beef curry over chips...two galaxy ripples...and a pint of diesel...or YOU pay 40 quid a copy!
Flynn - <northern monkey blackmailer>
So while I agree with Flynnster, (though thought he was a bit untactful there to start), there's a lot of questions I myself would like to find out the answers to.
tact...TACT...tact...hmmm...
Nahh, I prefer my method. I get paid to be tactful. Not on my own time though :)
Flynn
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RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32
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I am curious as to why exactly the costs are so high here in the U.S.? I understand that there are material costs, and the employees have higher wages and safer work places , but the fact that it costs publishers 2 to 3 times as much to publish here in the states is baffling to me. I can understand the cost being more, but that much? How much money do the employees make?
The new minimum wage standard in China, at it's lowest (since it is determined by region) is 352 yuan/month. At it's highest, it's 684 yuan/month.
352 yuan = $46.67
684 yuan = $90.69
Minimum wage in the US is $5.85 per hour. Assuming your printers are earning that rate (and they're likely earning more), your American print shop worker brings in $936.00/month (assuming 40 hours a week and 4 weeks a month).
So, a Chinese worker who is earning the minimum wage in a high-paying region costs $90. An American at minimum wage costs 10 times that. Most print shop jobs are not something that an American would take at minimum wage, so it's likely an even bigger difference than that.
Make sense now?
I am curious as to why exactly the costs are so high here in the U.S.?
It is a combination of factors really...
I will repeat that I do not know the printing business, but I will go off of what I know about manufacturing.
1) Worker wages. US wages are at least twice as much, and sometimes up to ten times as much, as similar overseas jobs. That is taking into account currency differences, but not cost of living differences. (Just because overseas jobs pay less, does not mean they are worse off.)
2) Management. US managers tend to get paid large amounts of money for far less amount of work than overseas managers.
3) Supply. It is often cheaper, and easier, for overseas manufacturers to get the supplies they need as compared to American based manufacturers getting American based supplies. That cost savings gets passed on.
4) Health care, and other benefits. Lets face it. Many US companie are shelling out large sums of money for their packages. Some one has to pay, and it is usually passed on to the consumer.
In fact, as far as manufacturing goes, the only reason that more work isn't shipped overseas is the skill of the worker. But with the way most American manufacturing workers address their jobs, combined with the skill improvements overseas, that number will be increasing.
NOTE: I am not taking a side on weather any of this is good, or bad. I am just sharing what knowledge I have on the subject.
Hi all,
Just got Pathfinder #1 in the mail yesterday (got the download a few days ago) and I wanted to say thanks to Paizo for choosing to make this such a high print quality product. My wife says she'll bug me less for spending $20 a month on it - she thought it was a magazine and I was happy to be able to show her otherwise. Cheers!
M
Does anyone know: for purposes of sending this publication into Canada is it considered a magazine or a book?
When I purchase publications from other companies, I pay customs fees, but I don't on magazines.
From the discussions here, I would really like to have a physical copy, but alas, between $20 + shipping + customs vs ~$14 for just the PDF...
Does anyone know: for purposes of sending this publication into Canada is it considered a magazine or a book?
When I purchase publications from other companies, I pay customs fees, but I don't on magazines.
From the discussions here, I would really like to have a physical copy, but alas, between $20 + shipping + customs vs ~$14 for just the PDF...
I just got mine today (in Canada), and didn't have to pay any customs fees. According to the declaration, this counts as a toy.
I just got mine today (in Canada), and didn't have to pay any customs fees. According to the declaration, this counts as a toy.
Thanks...
You also have to consider the cost of shipping raw materials in the U.S., the wage hike and subsequent drop in productivity if unions are involved, as well as the much higher health care costs. The last I checked (and I will have to try and remember where I got the figure) it costs less to ship a container across the Atlantic than a few hundred miles in the U.S..
The last I checked (and I will have to try and remember where I got the figure) it costs less to ship a container across the Atlantic than a few hundred miles in the U.S..
You're not incorrect in that assumption at all. Ocean Carriers have a very, very lean profit margin due to low freight rates and high bunker costs.
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And the bottom line is: Paizo officials have told you that they disagree with you and that it is THIER company and that they will run it as THEY see fit. Your ideas have been weighed measured and found wanting by the Paizo staff. That really is the end of the debate. So assert yourself with honor and take the rejection gracefully instead of being rude to people.Wow, come down bud. You're flying kinda high :)
Listen, all I've asked of Paizo directly is if I can opt to go PDF only, with the idea that maybe others may want to do it too.
And you know what a beautifull thing about this country is? You, my dear fellow gamer...can feel free to give your money to whomever you wish. You can buy products made wherever you wish (except Cuba). I merely am asking for an option. And that is something that we as Americans are all allowed too.
Go put your head some place cool. Mom will be home soon.
Flynn
Well...you COULD buy things made in Cuba...but you didn't hear that from me ;0)
Dude...I do see your point and I think it would be a great idea to make Pathfinder available for purchase as a PDF only. A couple of the guys in my group would SOOO totally eat that up. I mean heck if your willing to pay the retail price for a PDF why wouldn't they go for that?
Can't you buy the other GameMastery moduals as PDF's only?
as far as your China issue, I also see Paizo's point as well. It's unfortunate that they have to go over sees to companies willing to take our cash rather than give it to decent hard working americans like myself but if they are going to stay in business it's an unfortunate path for them to take (did I just make a pun? I'm too tired to tell). I completely agree with you. Things need to change here in the U.S. so that companies like Paizo can compete and have access to resources here at home. Who and how do we make that change? Is it citizens, corporations, government? again...I'm just too tired after dealing with 900+ students today to figure that out right now.
But again if they did a Pathfinder PDF ONLY option that would be awsome.
I am curious as to why exactly the costs are so high here in the U.S.?It is a combination of factors really...
I will repeat that I do not know the printing business, but I will go off of what I know about manufacturing.
1) Worker wages. US wages are at least twice as much, and sometimes up to ten times as much, as similar overseas jobs. That is taking into account currency differences, but not cost of living differences. (Just because overseas jobs pay less, does not mean they are worse off.)
2) Management. US managers tend to get paid large amounts of money for far less amount of work than overseas managers.
3) Supply. It is often cheaper, and easier, for overseas manufacturers to get the supplies they need as compared to American based manufacturers getting American based supplies. That cost savings gets passed on.
4) Health care, and other benefits. Lets face it. Many US companie are shelling out large sums of money for their packages. Some one has to pay, and it is usually passed on to the consumer.
In fact, as far as manufacturing goes, the only reason that more work isn't shipped overseas is the skill of the worker. But with the way most American manufacturing workers address their jobs, combined with the skill improvements overseas, that number will be increasing.
NOTE: I am not taking a side on weather any of this is good, or bad. I am just sharing what knowledge I have on the subject.
Thanks for the responses Disenchanter and Fatespinner.
I would not advocate a reduction in pay for general laborers in any of these printing press, though perhaps the upper management and the executives...It seems, from the posts that have been put on here in response to my question(s), and according to newstories I catch here and there, that things need to change with manufacturers in this country. Unfortunantly, those changes comprise is a long, long, long, long list: Find a way to reduce cost of materials, shipping, make managers and executives more productive for their pay, and don't get me started with Health care.
There is simply not a quick nor easy solution, never will be, but people need to be informed. Whether or not a game forum is a good way to do that is debateable (and has been).
Strange Flynnster, I'm incredibly untactful in real life, but here online, I tend to be, sort of the opposite of you.
Thanks for your responses, I'm going to read through the thread on this subject that's elsewhere on the boards.
I was wowwed when I opened the nice envelope Pathfinder came in and found such a high-quality product. Here's to a job well done, I for one would not be willing to pay more than the already $20 just so that it could be printed here in America. If Americans refuse to lower themselves to competitive rates, why should industries support us?
Flynn, please cease to exist.
seconded!
note:some editing done with the original quote.
Chief Technical Officer
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I just got mine today (in Canada), and didn't have to pay any customs fees. According to the declaration, this counts as a toy.
Actually, that was a mistake. Pathfinder (which is both a book and a game in our system) was incorrectly mapped to "toy" for customs purposes; going forward, it's correctly mapped to "book." (Oddly, we've heard this will make duties more expensive for some people, and less expensive for others—but that's what it has to be.)
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Paizo has been very clear from day one that you can buy JUST the PDF, but if you subscribe you will get that for free. Had you been paying attention you never would have needed to ask such a question. You jingoism is cute, but nothing more than amusing.
What's even more amusing then his jingoism is the fact that he completely ignored your post. :)
Paizo has been very clear from day one that you can buy JUST the PDF, but if you subscribe you will get that for free. Had you been paying attention you never would have needed to ask such a question. You jingoism is cute, but nothing more than amusing.What's even more amusing then his jingoism is the fact that he completely ignored your post. :)
Not suprising though, his agenda is not to actually do anything other then propigate his agenda - why let little things like facts get in his way? ;)
Hey, Flynn,
I appreciate your beef - and I agree though typing on a Chinese-made computer transmitting through a Chinese-made DSL modem and Chinese-made copper line while sitting on a Chinese-made sofa probably makes me a bit of a hypocrite - *BUT* you're screwing up *MY* thread which was intended to congratulate Paizo on giving us such a quality product.
Seriously. Dude. Relax. You wanna change the world then buy American. Half of the folks on these boards aren't even from our great country and probably aren't all that interested in your Ameri-centric economic concepts. Please. Stop the ranting - or do it on your own thread.
M
Hey, Flynn,
I appreciate your beef - and I agree though typing on a Chinese-made computer transmitting through a Chinese-made DSL modem and Chinese-made copper line while sitting on a Chinese-made sofa probably makes me a bit of a hypocrite - *BUT* you're screwing up *MY* thread which was intended to congratulate Paizo on giving us such a quality product.Seriously. Dude. Relax. You wanna change the world then buy American. Half of the folks on these boards aren't even from our great country and probably aren't all that interested in your Ameri-centric economic concepts. Please. Stop the ranting - or do it on your own thread.
M
RANT RANT RANT.
Flynn
*MY* thread which was intended to congratulate Paizo on giving us such a quality product.
Yes. Right. The original intent of the thread. It's really hard to ignore the troll waving the red cape in front of my eyes. It makes me see red as I grow angry for such inconsiderate petty behavior. I shall do my best to elevate myself above the reaction of a bull though (from here on out at any rate), and offer something worthwhile.
I have managed to read about half of my Pathfinder #1 so far and I'm really quite blown away. The content is wonderful - a really fun and interesting adventure by James Jacobs. I have particularly enjoyed the relaxed pace of the adventure. There is enough space in Pathfinder that they haven't felt the need to cram all the information into a few short pages. Thus there is all sorts of wonderful color and background which really helps spark some fun ideas as a GM for how to run encounters and characters. Awesome stuff.
But to continue with the OP's original intent, I must say that the quality of the printing, the paper, the cover, and the binding is really quite excellent. It imbues the product with even greater value. A cheap plastic digital watch may tell time almost as well as an expensive metal watch, but there's something about the material, the heft of the thing, which gives you a sense of the quality within. The magazines were very good, and I'll miss them, but Pathfinder has that same heft as a nice watch. The magazines and the books both tell stories, but Pathfinder is clearly a big step up in quality.
Thanks Paizo.
RANT RANT RANT.
Flynn
Oh, I see. I just now realized you are only five years old. I should have known from your earlier posts. Well, then. Run along and play. Watch that street.
M
In the spirit of the OP:
The quality of the Pathfinder publications is quite impressive. My FLGS got a copy of Pathfinder 1, and several copies of the Player's Guide. During a break in our weekly Red Hand of Doom game session, one of the players wandered up front, bought the player's guide, and brought it back to the table.
He was looking through it, and several others got completely distracted (they were right in the middle of meeting Warklegnaw) admiring it. Next thing I know, that same player has wandered up front and bought Pathfinder 1.
I wasn't going to say anything, but my husband spoke up and said, "Umm, she's planning to run that when this campaign is over."
The player immediately stopped flipping through it, and said "Okay, I'll just buy them and keep them on the shelf til we get through with them. I'd rather read them when the entire adventure is out anyway." He's seriously intending, after maybe five minutes of perusal, to purchase them all and shelve them until he's allowed to read them. (He'll do it, too. And no, he wasn't aware of these products prior to seeing them on the store shelf.)
I realize the plural of "anecdote" isn't "data" - but I think this anecdote still indicates Paizo's print quality etc. can make a difference to those browsing the shelves in the store.
You can feel free to ignore my posting. You don't have to address it.Flynn
Is there an ignore button? IIRC EnWorld has an ignore option. And II"continue to"RC that option completely removes the ignored persons posts from my view.
This would be a good thing. Vic?
ON TOPIC
Love the print quality. However...left my copy in my car for about an hour (it was not in direct sunlight for even a moment). It became very brittle. It crackles now when I open it. I have never had a book do this to me. Perhaps the book sweats when exposed to excessive humidity. It was very humid.
And before you ask, yes I did leave the windows cracked a bit for the book. I didn't want it to become to hot for the little sucker.
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Hi all,
Just got Pathfinder #1 in the mail yesterday (got the download a few days ago) and I wanted to say thanks to Paizo for choosing to make this such a high print quality product. My wife says she'll bug me less for spending $20 a month on it - she thought it was a magazine and I was happy to be able to show her otherwise. Cheers!
M
I was finally able to get mine the other day from my LGS. Shipping delays and routing errors had me pulling out my hair.
I have to agree the quality is top notch. I was a bit skeptical that it would be worth the price tag. I am pleased to say my worries turned out to be unfounded.
The art style is awesome. I would love to see wallpapers for all of the covers. The bestiary is very cool, adding new monsters and all. My favorite would have to be the Attic Whisperer ... extremely cool.
The only niggling negative would be the font size. My old eyes would love a slightly larger font, but I can live with that minor gripe =)
Good job all.