Veldrin, Lord of Undead.'s page

Okay. Would you perhaps allow a Dread Vampire with the normal weaknesses? I'm largely interested in the Polymorph, Children of the Night, and Flight abilities, as they seem appropriately 'demigodly,' and I'll have limited access to comparable abilities as I'm planing on going with Mesmerist for my primary class.

Also/alternatively, would the variant +0 vampire templates (mastermind, noble dead, etc.) be allowable? They make sense for the Third Vampire to have.

Regarding ascension, I'm not sure how it would work from a lore perspective if he were waiting until something the other two weren't patient enough for, considering he's the weakest of the three. That said, I think I might be able to make something work.

Daedalus,

I'm thinking of making Veldrin a psychic vampire, wanna link up characters some?

Edit: Assuming of course Divinity is okay with possibly taking two vampire characters.

I was thinking of making him a lich, but I feel the psychic vampire template fits his overall theme much better.

Okay, I can up that preliminary info you have above now, and a longer post tomorrow, as it's 4am for me. However, Veldrin is a PC I've been playing for over 10 years, so it'll be easy create him for this.

Veldrin d'Sharen a nascent divine drow of necromancy and undeath.

Portfolio Necromancy, undeath, forbidden lore.

Domains: Death, Evil, Knowledge, Magic.

Would you guys mind if I also portrayed Veldrin? Yea, I am running the game, but I am also playing, and this a cooperative story, so I want to make sure you're cool with me playing 2 gods.

Lyn, you really need to join the undead side. We gave up worrying about Con scores millennia ago.

Also, in many cases, such a transformation cures the various aliments one suffers from.

I think I do that then, to allow specific outsider servitor races to function like standard ones.

Could I not just grant immortality myself via the clause in my decree without the need for a concept?. Not that I don't have the AP for it, just wondering.

Question,

What's the best way to make outsiders that are immortal aka Devils or Celestials are in normal PF, but not a specific type?

In other words, create the concept, for lack of a better term, of outsiders but the specifics are left up to the deity they serve.

Sorry if this isn't making much sense, functioning on very little sleep.

I was intending to gift to a servitor.

The skeleton is quiet for a few moments, thinking. "The most important restriction is that this can not be done very often or for too many at a time. Doing so not only violates my decree, but I will also require a reason for each soul to be reborn, and frankly, I don't want to listen to dozens of reasons at a time. Reforging the souls who worship you into higher beings is very different than them being reincarnated as mortals to once again roam the world. Its also important to make reincarnation a rare enough occasion that most mortals can not expect it to happen to them. Otherwise they will loose respect for not only death, but also life. Who cares what harm you cause, what trouble you get into, if you can die and come back as something else?"

As the infusion of power from ascending washes over Veldrin, he knows his next move. He enters his throne room, and gestures to his throne. Already an impressive object, it grows in size and ornamentation, as black and dark purple sapphires, pale moonstones, and blood red rubies dot its surface, along with veins of silver.

Thus was created The Throne of Bone, an artifact of immense necromantic power.

"As I said before, my realm is only for those who have chosen not to worship one of us, who have renounced their faith, or otherwise lack an afterlife befitting them. So, it will not grow full any time soon. Nor even in the next several centuries, as I imagine most mortals will choose to follow one of us. As for ascension, that is up to each of you, though I would caution not to choose too many who would rise to such lofty heights, as that would violate my decree"

The skeleton shakes its head, causing it to rattle "I do not like there being such loose, flimsy strictures for a possible reincarnation. I fail to see how a base set of guidelines can not be created and adhered to"

Meanwhile, back on the Isle of the Damned, Veldrin strides the halls of his palace, contemplating what to do next. As he does so, energy from each death flows to him, and he grows in power. Crackling black lightning dances around him, as he himself ascends.

"To what end do you seek to allow a number of your followers to come back? As a reward? To accomplish specific tasks that take more than one life to complete? I will say this, without a sound reason, and some sort of specific set of qualifications, I will not allow this. Period"

How many AP did we decide it took to get to the next rank? I checked the site, and it looks like there's no cost.

Also, could my decree go towards the Afterlife AND Souls domains? If so, I believe I have enough actions to get both those domains.

Veldrin forms a large skeleton, outfitted in pitted black armor and wielding a vicious ebony sword and sends it forth to the meeting with Allianda and Baxtra My shard.

It greets the two goddess, speaking in a hollow, dead voice "Well met ladies. Now then, you wanted to speak to me about reincarnation, correct?"

As Allianda goes to travel to Abbadon, Veldrin stops her "No, you are not permitted in the plane of Death, Mother of Life. I fear what would happen were you to enter there, not the least of which could be your own rather violent destruction as the forces of death and life crash together."

He looks around at all the life that has sprung up around her, and shakes his head. Summoning vast reserves of power, fueled by all those who have died in the recent war with the Moonstruck, he unleashes a black wave a pure death, killing everything Allianda created, but leaving her unharmed.

"My isle will always remain dead, for I am Death"

Until such a time as we figure out the rules to altering planar traits, and I figure out mine, yes, I would prefer if my plane isn't visited.

I have some research to do it would seem.

Edit:

When I said I wanted a link to the website in the campaign info, I meant the one you personally had created for this game. Especially since you apparently have changed or altered various costs.

I am asking because there's some things I want to give Veldrin, but I want to make sure I have the costs right.

There's nothing sudden about this change. I just did not think to spend AP in order to actually prevent the living from going there.

Sitting on his throne deep in the heart of the Forsaken Palace, Veldrin looks out into the world, and notes the birth and rise of more and more mortal races, beyond all the animals Allianda created.

Such beings lived their lives, and of course, died. Many of their souls went to the side of their parent deity, but many more wandered the mortal world. Some tormented the living, others were hopelessly lost.

The god of Death decided something needed to be done and thus he gathered his power and carved out a new reality, one that was cut off from the rest of the cosmos and the living. For this new realm was only for the dead and was actually dangerous to those who yet breathed.

Veldrin then spoke to all the gods, informing them of his new creation "My fellow deities, I have taken note of all the restless souls that have plagued our lands and peoples. I took steps to fix this, and created a place for them to dwell. Those who have earned your favor may of course spend eternity by your side, but those who have not, or have shunned you or not chosen to venerate any of us, will find themselves consigned to my new realm, Abbadon."

The point of Abbadon has always been a place only for the dead. Of course, I can always allow access to the plane, but its not for me to go and hide in, rather its simply thematically appropriate that those who are alive should not be able to visit the realm of the dead. Except in special circumstances.

Look to real world myth. How often do the living go to Hades' Underworld in Greek myth? Heracles does, as does Orpheus I believe, and I *think* one other mortal.

Now, granted they were demigods so they had "protection", but for my plane, I would likely give it the negative energy trait, and make it as strong as possible. Pretty sure even gods can't just waltz into the negative energy(Or positive for that matter) plane, and be totally fine.

Because she's alive, just like all the other Gods, and anything else trying to enter that aren't dead or undead.

Outsiders would also be barred, as their souls generally go directly to their home plane.

Hmmm, could I spend another 5 AP to alter my planar traits? I never actually gave them much thought.

Edit: Jazzai, unless I am missing something, I do not see a link to your website in the campaign info.

All caught up. Sorry I haven't been active lately, but with nonsense with work, busy with rl stuff, and some writer's block, I just didn't have it in me to keep up.

I will admit, I skimmed through a lot, because there was just way too much for me to want to read.

That being said, question:

If I want to make it so only the dead, or undead can enter Abbadon, and thus block Allianda, how do I need to go about that?

What sort of AP expenditure would it be to alter an existing race?

Also, sorry for not being around as much, new job plus complications with my old have taken up a lot of my time.

Hey Jazz, does your website have all the AP costs listed? I haven't been able to check it out as I've been kinda busy, and always seem to forget when I have free time.

Veldrin causes a great black throne to rise from the ground, right underneath him. He is thus several inches above the ladies as they speak. "So you wish loop holes in my decree, but why? And how would you limit this? Were I to agree to this, it could not be that any and every soul can return to life, even via reincarnation, as that would defeat the purpose of my declaration." Its obvious he is not all that happy with this idea, but might be swayed.

Veldrin descends from the heavens, landing near Allianda and Baxtra, right before the later turns and leaves. "Have I kept you two waiting? I was in Abbadon, overseeing the arrival of all the lost and forsaken souls who were stuck on Anya."

That seems overly complicated. The idea of portfolios, in both Lords of Creation and normal D&D/PF, are the areas of influence you have. There's no mechanical benefit whatsoever. Adding in these sub-domains, and granting bonuses and such seems to just add more complexity to an already complex game.

No, that's a bit too restrictive. As it stands, I would loose one portfolio aspect that way.

Because they don't do anything rules wise, unlike Domains, its OK to have several per domain. They add definition and some depth to what you're all about.

For example, Muthadh has Darkness as a Domain, focused on Night, as he said above.

While I have Darkness as a portfolio aspect, but for me, its definitely more Darkness tied to Death, Undead, fear, etc. While Night could be included, its not needed as an aspect, really.

Which leads me to my next point: You can have one portfolio per domain. I would to officially request the part of your portfolios to be referred to hereafter as Aspects. I think this will make it much easier to discuss and help separate things nicely.

I'm not sure if in the normal LoC rules a portfolio is tied to a specific domain or not, but I feel like they should be.

Lastly, I would like to ask if I can switch Necromancy for Undeath/life as my second domain. Necromancy makes far more sense as an aspect than an actual domain.

Domains are indeed rather broad, and the portfolio attached to each costs you nothing, even when gaining a new one. While one can have several aspects in a portfolio, they should all at least sort of make sense to the actions you have taken when gaining the new domain.

For example, if you end up taking War as a domain, but never did anything even sort of related to tactics then I would suggest not having that as a portfolio aspect.

Of course, with this system, its not difficult to meet such a requirement. If one of the actions you took to qualify for taking War was to create a warrior society or organization of any sort, that would certainly allow you to also qualify for tactics, in my mind.

I'm unsure how we should add portfolio aspects to an existing Domain. I suppose we could do something akin to the actions needed to take a new domain, but say maybe only 3-5 APs worth. I do not think one needs to actually spend AP to take a new portfolio, just spend some on stuff that is associated with the aspect.

I do not want it to be that one can just add a portfolio aspect whenever they feel like it, because then it sort of ignores the RP intention of this game, which is pretty much all this, a giant cooperative role-playing session.

I kinda like Paizo's naming of the months for Golarion after the gods. Granted, we don't have enough gods for all the months, but its a good start.

By the way, I am all caught up, and yes I do know people are waiting on responses from me. Kinda crazy week for me IRL and I am going out tonight to just chill. Will try to post later or tomorrow.

I agree with the twilight being a serious stretch based on altering the activity period of your race. Also, I am unsure if Twilight would truly be considered a domain. Night obviously is, and while there is a god of dawn in certain myths, and even among various D&D esque pantheons, I just think both dawn and twilight do not cover enough for a domain. There isn't really even a god or domain for Day, so much as Sun or something similar. This is likely due there being a far more specific set of beings, activities and such associated with night vs day.

If you wanted to become a god of Time, or something like periods of the day, I could see dawn and twilight as portfolios.

Had a very busy holiday weekend, from Fri to Mon, and am only now catching up. Need some time to formulate thoughts, actions and responses.

As for Shadow Magic, Illusions, etc I am not seeing how they would be different??

I think you should be able to modify it, though I don't know if it should cost you points, especially in this case. You're kinda new to the rules, and it was just something that could have been worded better. Not an actual screw up, or one you want to radically change.

Sitting on his throne deep in the heart of the Forsaken Palace, Veldrin looks out into the world, and notes the birth and rise of more and more mortal races, beyond all the animals Allianda created.

Such beings lived their lives, and of course, died. Many of their souls went to the side of their parent deity, but many more wandered the mortal world. Some tormented the living, others were hopelessly lost.

The god of Death decided something needed to be done and thus he gathered his power and carved out a new reality, one that was cut off from the rest of the cosmos and the living. For this new realm was only for the dead and was actually dangerous to those who yet breathed.

Veldrin then spoke to all the gods, informing them of his new creation "My fellow deities, I have taken note of all the restless souls that have plagued our lands and peoples. I took steps to fix this, and created a place for them to dwell. Those who have earned your favor may of course spend eternity by your side, but those who have not, or have shunned you or not chosen to venerate any of us, will find themselves consigned to my new realm, Abbadon."

So, oddly, I didn't see any posts in here last night. Very strange, as I went out of my way to make sure I caught up on all my threads yesterday.

Anyways, Veldrin would also be interested in Illusion magick, although if its something Muthadh really wants, perhaps I will create an entire separate form of Shadow Magick. Such ties into Necromancy nicely.

Do we have anybody with Cold as their domain yet? That's another Veldrin would like. I have it as part of my portfolio, but I think I would like it as an actual Domain.

Ok slow down a bit. We seem to be teetering on an argument, so lets try to avoid that.

I am currently at physical therapy right now so once home I too will look stuff over and together we can figure this out.

Please bear in mind that each LoC can and does use their own variations on the official rules. Thus, they are more like guidelines.

Couple of things, posting as one of the mods for this game:

1) Yes, all Cosmic Decrees should at least be posted here in the discussion thread before they are issued in game. Not to pick them apart, or tell you not to make them, but just to see if the other players have any feedback or suggestions. Even my simple "mortal life shall end, eventually" was posted here first, just in case.

2) Per the rules of the game, one should always at the least ask before taking action versus another god's creation(s).

Now, granted nothing was really done to the Shadovar, but they can't be driven mad. They are more or less an extension of Veldrin's divine will, made manifest. The only way they change in personality or outlook is if He does so first.

They have free will, to be sure, and they have a society, though I suppose its more like an order or something than an actual real society, which I can easily change in game.

Point being, while they are not truly autonomous, they are too tied to Veldrin's Will to be driven mad. So unless you feel like engaging me in deity combat, we'll just ignore that.

3) What exactly happened with those Moonstruck on an isle? Was that supposed to be happening on the Dead Isle? If so, Veldrin is currently there, and would instantly crush all intruders, to a "man". No survivors. Then, he would raise them as undead servitors.

Which, I suppose would be Nightwaves. Word.

4) Finally, just to make it easier to read, please try to format properly. "This is speaking while "This tends to be thinking" and ::"This is often telepathy"::

Also, please spoiler your actions and AP expenditures, to keep things neat as well as making it simpler to find them later on, if necessary.

Veldrin nods "Of course Mother." She'll note that the way he says it is an honorific title, not in any way even sort of literal. Who knew where a being such as Veldrin came from originally? "The Shadovar are infused with my own spark mixed with the essence of darkness. Thus, they need not eat, nor sleep. They do not reproduce, normally. If more of their number is needed, I can either create them, or they can slay mortals and raise new members from their corpses. As to how they end the lives of those who seek immortality, and escape my grasp, they wield powerful death magicks."

"Not troubling, no. At least, not that. Every deity tends to have a favorite race or two and they might seek to deny them my cold grasp. Such is OK, once or twice, maybe, but more than that will result in war among us. I will not allow too many to escape my embrace. Hence why I created the Shadovar, to seek out and reap those who would live forever, without my blessing. A war between the gods could result in our new world, and perhaps even our very universe dying."

He unleashes his power, and wave of black energy ripples forth touching every living being. Both those currently alive and those yet to be born or created feel the force of his Will.

"All mortals must eventually die, save for those who have my blessing. To do otherwise will incur the unrelenting, unending wrath of my Shadovar"

Veldrin does indeed send a shard of himself, that of solid shadow, to accompany Allianda. As it goes with her, he enters into the throne room of the Forsaken Palace, and causes a great onyx throne to rise up out of the floor. It's bedecked with skull motifs and various eldritch markings that mean death, and dying, were one to able to decipher them.

He takes a seat, and looks out across the world and beyond, out in to the infinity that is the universe with his deific senses.

About to make the "All mortals must die" Cosmic Decree, that's OK, yes?"

Veldrin actually smiles, a rare sight indeed, at Alli's compliment. "Thank you Great Lady. While I understand your desire to give life to our world, having a place to call home, here on the material plane, is a good idea. Its helpful to be able to dwell in the same realm as our peoples. As for my undead, their main purpose will be to assist the Shadovar, yes. But, they will also serve to cull those societies who have grown far too populous, and have tipped the balance between life and death."

He muses, walking inside his great cathedral and motioning for the Mother of the World to follow "Do these plant beings have a society? Sentience? If so, that is enough. I am not asking for elaborate ceremonies for every people, just that the dead are respected, in accordance to each race's beliefs. That's all I desire."

Veldrin does not seem bothered by her presence, nor by her granting life to the land she stood on. "Just here, on this, the largest of isles. My Shadovar's citadel, the Forsaken Palace is here. Tis where they will bring those souls who seek to escape death to be punished and also where a portal to my realm of the dead will be placed. The other dozen or so islands all still have the life you birthed them."

I'm going to issue a cosmic decree "All mortal life will eventually come to an end" aka all mortals die.

This OK with everybody?

Veldrin walks among his islands, and where he treads, nothing will ever grow again. He creates a large wasteland, and then raises up a dark, brooding city, all black stone and jagged buildings. A necropolis, in both look and purpose. He wills into existence a pale skinned people, and suffuses them with the very shadows themselves. "You will be my Shadovar, minions of both death and darkness. It will be your job to seek those who deny death without my favor and reap them"

Veldrin nods at the offering of the Bone Eagles "A great gift indeed. Allow me to return the favor, and help in creating this world" With that he cuts his palm, and several drops of shadowy blood drop from his wound, into the bowl she handed him.

"I will not currently contribute something specific, yet I ask a small favor in return instead. All those who create a society, please instill in them the need for burial rights and graveyards. I will gather some of my servants from the later, and from the former will come respect and honor for those who have passed, as opposed to fear and remorse for what was lost"

"I think it unwise for me to touch you, Allianda, unless you wish to have this great idea die before you ever give it life" Veldrin says ominously.

I want to contribute, but that requirement to touch you is killer. HA!

Each of us can create mundane life for free when we use Alter/Create Land. That takes care of normal life.

I think each of us should create our own land, as I believe using Forge Plane does automatically grant continents. Not sure though.

Are we looking to combine AP to just create the planet? Or is there more you want to collaborate on?

In the other LoC I'm in, each god kinda did their own thing. One created the planet, and then others raised continents, islands, created races, etc.

Its up to the group, and I am OK either way, just trying to get a handle on what's going on.

A cold wind blows into the forge room, and the flames sputter but do not go out. The temperature and lighting both drop in the room, as a man cloaked in shadows steps in among the gods. His right arm is that of a skeleton, and his eyes are distressingly black with a pair of red pinpricks within their center.

He looks at all present "Life, it is good, for it leads to Death, and to Me. I am Veldrin, Lord of the Dead and and the Undying."

Profile complete.