Otter77's page

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Fatespinner wrote:
Otter77 wrote:

I apologize for taking forever to get back to you on this. I finally finished reading the game thread and it looks like a fun story to jump into. I can roll a rogue to replace Shador, if you wish. I would prefer to start a new PC, rather than try to pick up in his place.

So... is there a "Mechanics" thread where all the behind the scenes magic happens? Also, what level will I be starting at?

Actually, I had forgotten that Stunty was on the waiting list since, oh, last May or so, so I gave him the slot. We're actually waiting for my schedule to become less insane so that I can get the game started back up right now. I just haven't had the time to get things put back together. Sorry.

Not a problem. Let me know if something opens up.

I apologize for taking forever to get back to you on this. I finally finished reading the game thread and it looks like a fun story to jump into. I can roll a rogue to replace Shador, if you wish. I would prefer to start a new PC, rather than try to pick up in his place.

So... is there a "Mechanics" thread where all the behind the scenes magic happens? Also, what level will I be starting at?

Fatespinner wrote:
Is that a "count me in?"

Let me read up a little of the back story to see if I am evil enough for you guys. Also, what classes did you lose?

Dragon Snack wrote:

Well, I'm sure you could keep up, I guess my players aren't that munchkiny. They have their flashes of it though (but then I *am* a Killer DM).

If you are still interested, I'll ask my players about it this Sunday. Since the other player had left an opening to return we had really only asked one other person (that 2 of us had gamed with previously).

We meet at my house in Henrietta (I have a German Shepard) every other Sunday from 4-10ish. 12th level, Forgotten Realms, 32 point buy (we do set HPs too).

There's about a dozen of use 2 hours east of you in the Utica area. I feel for you, it took me forever to find a decent group.

Fatespinner wrote:
Well, Lich-Loved and Sovereign have not resurfaced in the alloted time. Therefore, this game is now open and looking for one more (possibly two) additional players! Again, mature players only. Please visit the game thread and make sure this is something you want to be a part of before applying. Thanks!

This sounds fun. What's the name of the original thread.


NM, I missed the linky.

I'm really going to try to swing this. You would have to pick a date that is really close to finals.

On a brighter note, I think I have enough points for a free flight.

tbug wrote:

Okay, that's not at all what I had in mind.

Good luck with that, though. :)

Yeah, the issue with having a large convention is that we don't know the magnitude of who will show up. From the interest we've seen so far, I'm not sure that the costs of the Con would be covered. We're not in this to make money, but I seriously doubt any of us have expendable income to throw at this.

Personally, I'll be flying cross-country to attend, which carries a significant expense itself. Convention space at a hotel is in the thousands for a weekend's worth of time.

Takasi wrote:
tbug wrote:
So you're the con organizer? These people would be your assistants?

I am the Paizocon "organizer" on the Meetup site:


For the first convention I think we should start small with a simple Meetup at a hotel close to the Paizo office in Bellevue. Events should also be very simple. A tour of the office would be excellent.

As for the hotel arrangements, I don't think a conference hall is necessary. Some hotels provide tables in guest rooms, and if rooms can be booked close together we can order pizzas and organize games in each other's rooms. At this point I don't think we need sponsors or any special venues; we should keep it as fan based as possible.

Go to Seattle. Meet Paizo and other fans. Eat pizza and play games. Simple.

I agree, this would be more aptly titled "Paizo Meetup" than Paizocon. At least at this point.

Core wrote:

Good job Paizo for pulling off a successful contest.

If I had any suggestions it would be to make the next one for amateurs only, and to perhaps leave the judges comments out until public voting is over. 'Finding the next great RPG designer' seems a bit contradictory when out-of-work professionals are in the pool, and I think the judges comments direct the masses a good bit of the time.

All in all though, good fun, I look forward to the future entries to see what all people come up with.

While I agree that I like the purpose of the contest to be about uncovering a relatively new talent, I don't think that previous experience should be an outright disqualifier. Granted I would love for the overall winner to be some schlep, night worker at a hotel(like that would ever happen!). That's the dramatic underdog victory that makes you feel all warm and fuzzy and helps you sleep at night.

Truthfully, this contest is about giving people the chance to participate at the level of a working professional. They have set deliverables, a timeframe, restrictions. Just because someone has submitted to web contests, Dragon magazine, etc and had one or two items picked up (and possibly printed), it doesn't necessarily qualify them as a professional.

It's the equivalent of someone who sings in a local band competing on American Idol. They may have years of formal training, they might have had tons of paying local gigs, but they can still compete because they are relatively unknown to the mainstream.

To quote Takasi from DMChat:

Takasi wrote:
think the spirit of the contest is giving credit to good writers, new or old, who haven't had a lot of credit yet.

Lisa Stevens wrote:
Takasi wrote:

Just an update; in January we'll finalize a location and date. Now's the time to join and provide feedback.


If you guys decide to have this in Seattle, there is a really, really good chance that Paizo would get involved. We have talked about having a convention like this in our back yard, but have lacked the staff to put it all together. Let me know how the planning comes and if there is a way we can participate, then we will. Heck, there may even be a chance to see the Death Star Theater and Vic's and my Star Wars collection! :)


Such a quandary surrounding location. To be true to the message, a Washington location seems right. We are gathering to celebrate Paizo, let us celebrate in their backyard. However, this tends to alienate people that are from points east (and west) making their travel longer & more expensive. However, the die hards will attend regardless.

I'll have to grind the gears a little harder on this one.

Grimcleaver wrote:
Just don't want the entourage getting bored and wrecking havoc.

So take a day for the meetup/convention and let your ilk run rampant... there might be a thing or two happening around town.

This grew out of some discussion in DMCHAT. I believe that the centralized location was pushed to facilitate people from both US coasts. This of course does not take in account any foreign Paizo fans, to which I apologize.

I think that Vegas was presented not for it's geographic location, but for the thought that there may be cheap facilities and perhaps better deals for a flight in, as many airlines offer regular flights there for the casino and general tourism. If anyone here works in the travel & tourism industry, it might be nice to have an inside track on travel costs from different regions.

As for Paizonian support, well that's undecided at this point. Certainly they aren't promoting the event, and I'm not sure we want to ask them too. I'd personally much prefer a user-run event. I know at the least that there is a NYC Paizo meetup on a regular basis and I would not be surprised to hear of more like it. I'd say coordination between the regional groups would be the best starting point. I don't think looking to Paizo for prizes and/or other "Schwag" is out of the question, but I will say that if we have a success for the first gathering, and can say to them "We had XXXX number of fans get together last year", they will be more likely to support future endeavors.

Personally I think that the time frame for the gathering as the first item agreed upon. A solid date will dictate availability, weather, travel costs.

Lastly, to whomever brought up the idea of starting with a Paizo "room" or section of an existing Con... this might not be a bad idea. It would at least be an indicator of interest amongst us.

I would think that early summer would be best to facilitate those people on break from school and to dodge major holidays. Also, depending on the venue, it might be nice to schedule them around or near other major cons going on so people could do both. Just a few thoughts.

jraynack wrote:
Otter77 wrote:

I agree on both accounts. Truthfully the item is modeled after the strand of prayer beads and both the mentioned keys are included to help with doors that might be trapped.

As for the pricing, sadly I forgot to multiply by CL & spell level, which would price my item more appropriately.

Pricing aside, that is a good item to model it after - maybe dispel is usable only once, then becomes inert (like bead of summons) or if used to unlock a door it has a chance to dispel magical traps enchanted on just the door (this way, it limits the versatility of dispel magic and doesn't prevent traps protecting the area in front of the door).

Either of those suggestions drops the price significantly. Like I said, it needs some tweaking. Maybe someone can start a tweak item thread to make these "losing" items winning ones.

Definite possibilities. This item actually spawns from a campaign in which no one wanted to play a rogue. We had a scout to detect trapped doors, but no means to get by them. I initially was thinking of having the item grant the pick locks as a class skill, but I was afraid that was too powerful and was uncertain of how to price it.... perhaps I should have gone with that and tied it to a wish or miracle spell.

jraynack wrote:
Otter77 wrote:

I'm not sure what did me in, most likely a "Swiss Army Item". Either way, I'd be interested in what people think about my item.

Skeleton Key Ring

You want to see a "Swiss Army Knife" mine is it - The Belt of Heroic Action.

Personally, the Copper Key and Platinum Key doesn't really fit with the theme of a skeleton key. Secondly, the item does not take up a body slot, so essentially you have 4 wands on a stick without every losing their charges - and is usable by every class. The price is perhaps a little off . A wand of Dispel Magic is 11,250 gp. That in itself is an indicator your item is too powerful.

I like the idea and theme, but needs some fine tuning. I would drop the two keys I mentioned and work from there. Maybe instead of metal keys, what about actually skeleton or undead fingers (lich, zombie, ghoul, etc.)

I agree on both accounts. Truthfully the item is modeled after the strand of prayer beads and both the mentioned keys are included to help with doors that might be trapped.

As for the pricing, sadly I forgot to multiply by CL & spell level, which would price my item more appropriately.

I'm not sure what did me in, most likely a "Swiss Army Item". Either way, I'd be interested in what people think about my item.

Skeleton Key Ring
This item appears to be a ring of keys made from several different types of metal with a skull at the base of each key. A skeleton key ring includes one or more keys, each with a different magic power.

Key Type-Spell-Like Ability Granted
Copper Key- Detect Magic
Silver Key- Knock
Gold Key- Arcane Lock
Platinum Key- Dispel Magic

Each key can be used three times per day, except for the platinum key, which works twice per day. The owner must be holding the specific key for whichever effect they desire.

The power of a key is lost if it is removed from the ring. Reduce the price of a skeleton key ring that is missing one or more keys by the following amounts: copper key – 1125 gp, silver key -1800 gp, gold key – 3675 gp, platinum key -4050 gp.

Faint or moderate (many schools); CL0(Copper), CL3(Silver, Gold), CL5(Platinum); Craft Wondrous Item; and one of the following spells per key, as appropriate: Detect Magic(Copper); Arcane Lock(Gold); Knock(Silver); Dispel Magic(Platinum): Price 10,650 gp.

Awesome item Gortch, though I have to wonder about the "glows in the presence of Zombies" part. How does it fit in with the rest of the abilities? Paranoia?

Hairpiece of the Peacock

This hairpiece is not just an accessory, it’s a statement: “You’re as evil aligned as you wanna be!”

Fashioned from Peacock feathers, it is close-cropped on top, to accommodate even the snuggest of helms, yet sports brilliant flowing locks in the back that would make even the most vibrant peacock jealous.

This hairpiece demands respect! If the hairpiece is not partially covered, all male creatures within 25 ft. must make a will save (DC 20) or become shaken for 1 hour. All female creatures within 25 ft. must make a will save (DC20) or become enthralled for 1 hour.

Faint Enchantment; CL 3rd; Craft Wondrous Item, Enthrall; Price 6,000 gp; Weight 1 lb.

EDIT: I must admit, this was inspired by Mothman's Hairpiece of Handsomeness.

Former Marine, Systems Engineer.

For now, I get paid a lot of money to talk on the phone and make Power Point presentations.

I'm also on the 10 year college plan.

Sir_Wulf wrote:

If it wasn't monkeys, it would have to be ninjas, and I haven't seen any of THEM around here.

Of course, I could have failed my Spot check.

SHHH!! They're all being saved for the Villain competition.

Damn you downstate people! I really need to get out of this black hole of gaming.

Ragwaine wrote:

All I know is that as I enter each round I'm going to change my hairstyle every time.

Oh wait I forgot, a lot of you don't watch American Idol so you probably won't get that. Communists! You probably don't drive Chevy's or eat apple pie either!

In Soviet Russia Chevy's drive you!!!

Well, since this really took off, I suppose I should add my entry.

Boots of Striding and Streaking

Upon donning the Boots of Striding and Streaking, the wearer must make a will save (DC 15), or have the uncontrollable urge to strip naked and streak “the Quad”. Only a remove curse spell enables the wearer to be rid of the boots once their true nature is revealed.
Moderate Enchantment, CL 3, Craft Wondrous Item, Command, Bestow Curse, Price 30,000 GP.

Accosted by the CUPCAKE OF DOOM!1!11!!!ELEVEN!1

I applied as well, though I am currently in a guild. will accepting a new invite switch me?

Serpent wrote:

The first wondrous item entry in the SRD:

This amulet is a golden disk on a chain. It usually bears the image of a lion or other powerful animal. The amulet grants the wearer an enhancement bonus to Constitution of +2, +4, or +6.

2 sentences of fluff, 1 sentence of crunch.

The second entry:

This amulet grants an enhancement bonus of +1 to +5 on attack and damage rolls with unarmed attacks and natural weapons.

No fluff at all. 1 sentence of crunch.

The third entry:

This amulet, usually crafted from bone or beast scales, toughens the wearer’s body and flesh, giving him an enhancement bonus to his natural armor bonus of from +1 to +5, depending on the kind of amulet.

1 sentence of fluff and crunch knit together.

Conclusion: Three similar items have three distinct ways of dealing with the fluff or no fluff issue. I prefer the third approach, but that's just me.

I'm not sure I consider any of these examples fluff. Basic item appearances are listed for almost ever wondrous item in the SRD and are more of a description. I consider history and non-unique ability descriptions fluff.

In the spirit of MTG:Unhinged, I thought it would be fun to list some of the more... unorthodox ideas that some of us have come up with. Truthfully it was inspired by some funny posts that I've already read. I'd love to get "official submission" style postings of some items that might not otherwise be selected.

Please keep them at a PG-13 rating and realize that this is an exercise in hilarity, not an additional contest, or anything that might resemble a serious matter in any way, shape or form.

With apologies to the original owners of these items, here are the items that spurred this exercise:

Kruelaid – Panties of the succubus, Britches of Stink Suppression

Nighthunter - Banana Hammock of the Todd

Ragwaine - Chair of Swordliness: when wielded as a weapon this large overstuffed chair acts in all ways as a long sword.

If you three would care to expand upon these ideas, I think it would be fun. For anyone who came up with similarly ridiculous items, feel free to post them.

Tap into your inner Zen and repeat this mantra:

Less is More

Wait, you supposed to need a magic item to talk to goats?
*looks around warily*

Nothing to see here, move along.

Cool is subjective. I vote for solid or utility. Which do you prefer: an item that has a function that is really powerful, but seldom used, or an item that is weaker, in relation, but used all the time?

D20 is OGL. Sites like D20SRD.org will most likely be around far after Wizards stops printing 3.5 books, giving your potential audience access to mechanics, spell descriptions and lots of other logistical information.

People are still on the fence about 4e. If you're close to being ready to release, go for it. If the project takes off, entertain the idea of updating to 4e. Like most projects now, some sort of community should develop, especially if you have an online presence, with forums. Put the question to the community and see where their interests lie. Heck, you might even get a few of them who are willing to collaborate on making the conversion.

Scott & Le Janke wrote:
... Kosher Sandwich Toasting


Midrealm DM wrote:

I had a player in my campaign who had been granted a huge undeveloped tract of land (several acres). He traded it to a local merchant for a tiny house in the warehouse district because the home had once belonged to the original founder of the city.

I understand the value of items introduced into the story or events of a campaign. I even agree that content based items are, on a whole, more interesting and fun to use. My point is that very rarely to do find an item in a book that I want based on its history.

In your above example, it was not as if you player opened up a supplement and said, "Wow! A house owned by the founder of a city. I MUST HAVE IT!!"

Most likely his interest came about due to events that transpired during the campaign.

Conversely, as a DM I will accede to the idea that item history is very valuable for campaign development/story telling. Though I generally tend to use artifacts or named weapons for this purpose and very seldom are they items I've found in print. Usually I make them up.

Fortunately for you, we are now in the information age. You have available to you, the best marketing tool ever implemented: the internet(thanks Mr. Gore!).

Once you are ready to go, jump on some forums and release your work. If it truly is a great system/world, then it will take off. Look at successes such as Slashdot, MySpace, even Google. None of these sites were commercially marketed, yet they are some of the most visited sites around. Why? Because of the content on them.

Understandably, your game system is not exactly the same product as those examples, but the idea is the same. Publish content available for all. If people like it, social networking will expose your product to markets that you wouldn't even dream of, let alone be able to pay to get too.

Clark Peterson wrote:
I even re-wrote a few entries in several of my posts to show what a difference a few changes would make to a submission to make a rejected submission acceptable and then we discussed those.

This brings up an interesting question. How do you compare an item as written against an item that has the potential to be great, with a few minor changes?

Wicht wrote:

Actually, a PDF with the best 100 or so entries (assuming there are far more than that) would be kind of nice. With or without commentary from the judges.

I was thinking something similar to this. It would be nice to at least start a thread here for people to list their submissions, once the judges have made their selections. I'd like to see what other people have submitted.

EP Healy wrote:
Nani Wahine wrote:
They only want to read 200 hundred words and thats it.
That's a long item description! :P

You'd be surprised how quickly you get to 200. Don't forget that if the item has a spell function, you need to add caster level info and the other details that are needed for a crafter to make the item.

Some people work better under pressure.


I hear you Serpent, and I even agree with you. I'd much prefer an ancestral weapon to any vanilla + weapon out there. I have a whole campaign designed around 2 intelligent swords that are at war with each other.

greysector wrote:

I'm looking at that table right now. The example for the cape of the mountebank (a wondrous item) states it is spell level * caster level * 1,800gp.

WOW! Time for me to get my eyes checked.

greysector wrote:

BTW following that formula and dividing by five because it is a once per day item, and multiplying by 1.5 because a cape is an uncustomary body slot for a movement item gives a price of 19,440gp, not 10,080gp as listed for the item. So unless I am missing something even their example item doesn't follow their own rules.

Oddly the math follows exactly, minus the last x 1.5 for being non-affinity.

4 (level of spell) * 7 (CL for Wizard) * 1800/ 5(once per day)=10,080

greysector wrote:

I don't see how it is debatable. The decanter says it functions on command, thus making it a command activated item.

From the description:

D20SRD wrote:
If the stopper is removed from this ordinary-looking flask and a command word spoken, an amount of fresh or salt water pours out.

Just speaking the command word is not enough. I would call removing the stopper a use-activation. Also, the effect of water pouring out is continuous until the command word is spoken to stop this. Unlike the cape of mountebank's dimension door, which is an instantaneous effect.

greysector wrote:
The chart states you multiply both by caster level and by spell level. The decanter is also explicitly a command activated item, not a use activated item.

This is true for all items except wondrous items. For those you use the subtable Table: Estimating Magic

Item Gold Price Values

According to that table, you only use level of spell, not caster lvl * spell lvl.

The command word vs. continuous effect is debatable at best. but since the values are within a few thousand gold pieces, I don't think its extreme enough to call one right over the other.

Aww shucks!! I submitted mine under the subject [SUBMISSION]Item Name, before I read this thread. Any chance that it was still accepted?

greysector wrote:

For example, can you use those formulae to explain the pricing of the decanter of endless water?

An on command item that 'duplicates' the spell control water at CL 9 should cost 4 * 9 * 1,800gp, or 64,800gp, yet the decanter only costs 9,000gp.

I don't think you're calculations are quite correct.

In this case, you choose the control water spell, which varies in level, based on who is casting it. 4 for druids and clerics, 6 for sorcerers and wizards. Personally, I would choose the spell create water, which is a 0 level spell, automatically halving the cost, but according to the d20srd it's control watter.
It is important when using this chart that you multiply by spell level not caster level.Also, I would use the caveat on items with continual effects:

Online D20SRD wrote:
If a continuous item has an effect based on a spell with a duration measured in rounds, multiply the cost by 4. If the duration of the spell is 1 minute/level, multiply the cost by 2, and if the duration is 10 minutes/level, multiply the cost by 1.5. If the spell has a 24-hour duration or greater, divide the cost in half.

With that in mind, I see the calculation as

4(DRD or CLR spell) * 2000(cost for a continuous item)* 1.5 (for being a spell 10min/level) = 12000 gp

6(SRC or Wiz spell) * 2000(cost for a continuous item)* 1.5 (for being a spell 10min/level)= 18000 gp

If you get really nit picky about the item effect truly being continual, as in you can open the decanter and have it work 24/7, then divide the total again by 2 and you would get 6000 and 9000 gp, the second of which is the listed item cost.

Alternately, you could not use the duration caveat and just do:
4(DRD or CLR spell)* 1800(cost for command word item)= 7200 gp

6(SRC or Wiz spell)* 1800(cost for command word item)= 10,800 gp

Both of which are very close to the listed price and would probably be considered close enough.

I guess this really does emphasize the "Black Art" comment of the OP.

Much cooler for flavor, I agree. It comes down to play style I suppose. In a campaign it would be cool to design portions of it around Icingdeath. Perhaps Drizz't lost the sword in a battle or he rewarded the party with it for some help. If you (or your DM) like(s) to include High Profile NPC's in the story, items like that make great contributions. But I think they approach on the territory of artifacts, like the Books of Vile Darkness, and Exalted Deeds.

I suppose I am looking at this whole contest differently. The task set forth was to create a wondrous item with respect to the examples provided in the d20srd. To me, this is analogous to going to the supermarket to buy food. I buy food because I need to eat, not because I enjoy the process in which it is produced and its journey to the store. This is not to say that some people don't do just that.

Serpent wrote:
In short: Backstory is what makes your item cool or badass.

On this point, I'll have to disagree. While I enjoy the history of items in game, it is the functionality of the item that makes me want to purchase it for my character. When was the last time any of your characters bought or used an item because it had a really cool story?

In an extreme example, which of the following 2 would you pick?

Candlestick A

Candlestick A has an illustrious history. It belonged to 7 generations of kings and 3 democratically elected rulers of the kingdom. It dutifully lit the chamber in which it was placed until the last ruler, in a drunken stupor, inadvertently knocked it over, starting the fire that led to the complete decimation of the kingdom.
It holds a candle.
It looks pretty.

Candlestick B

Candlestick B was crafted by a wizard and sold to a merchant.
It holds a candle.
It looks pretty.
On command it functions as a daylight spell.
Once per day, it can cast fireball as a 20th level wizard.
Once per day, it can cause purple raindrops to fall from the sky.
On command, it grants enough experience for it's owner to reach level 20. You win the game. Also, you win at life.

I know which one I'd pick.

Actually, I was thinking of the Gnome Artificer from Magic of Faerun, but either case holds the same issue, as you said.

Not really an answer, but artificer is not a D20srd base class. I believe it first appeared in Faerun. That's not to say that items can't be submitted revolving around them. I only mention this because I initially had an idea that revolved around the class.

That's a good question, the SRD handles it both ways. In the example you use, it lists them separately. Yet with an item like the STRAND OF PRAYER BEADS it lists lesser, standard and greater all under 1 listing. That may be due to the fact that you can actually purchase a custom strand by selecting only the beads you want, but I'm not sure.

I prefer the latter example as it doesn't leave you following breadcrumbs to get to the complete description.

I thought briefly about some sort of background story, but as I turned to the wondrous item section of the d20srd I realized that there are none there. They simply explain what the item is, what cool feature it has, how it functions, what a crafter would need to create it and how much it costs.

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