Critique my Bardic Archer!


Advice


I'm prepping some character concepts, and I'm going for my "barcher" here. 15 point build for now until GM allows it to be increased.

Going for ranged damage with utility spells to support the party, not sure if I should dip into the Arcane Archer prestige class or not. Here goes:

Davan:

Male elf arcane archer 6/bard 8
CG Medium humanoid (elf)
Init +9; Senses low-light vision; Perception +17
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Defense
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AC 27, touch 17, flat-footed 20 (+9 armor, +7 Dex, +1 natural)
hp 71 (14 HD; 8d8+6d10)
Fort +5, Ref +16, Will +6; +2 vs. enchantments, +4 vs. bardic performance, language-dependent, and sonic
Immune sleep
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Offense
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Speed 30 ft.
Ranged +5 adaptive composite longbow +27/+22/+17 (1d8+10/×3)
Special Attacks bardic performance 21 rounds/day (move action; countersong, dirge of doom, distraction, fascinate [DC 17], inspire competence +3, inspire courage +2, suggestion [DC 17]), enhance arrows (distance), enhance arrows (elemental), enhance arrows (magic), imbue arrow, phase arrow, seeker arrow
Bard Spells Known (CL 12th; concentration +15)
4th (3/day)—break enchantment, cure critical wounds, mass ghostbane dirge[APG] (DC 17), neutralize poison
3rd (5/day)—cure serious wounds, haste, remove curse, see invisibility
2nd (6/day)—cat's grace, cure moderate wounds, fox's cunning, ghostbane dirge[APG] (DC 15), versatile weapon[APG] (DC 15)
1st (6/day)—abundant ammunition[UC], cure light wounds, feather fall, grease, hideous laughter (DC 14), identify
0 (at will)—daze (DC 13), detect magic, light, mending, prestidigitation, read magic
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Statistics
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Str 18, Dex 24, Con 11, Int 18, Wis 7, Cha 16
Base Atk +12; CMB +16; CMD 33
Feats Clustered Shots[UC], Deadly Aim, Manyshot, Point-blank Shot, Precise Shot, Rapid Shot, Weapon Focus (longbow)
Traits dangerously curious, reactionary
Skills Acrobatics +22, Appraise +8, Climb +6, Escape Artist +9, Intimidate +7, Knowledge (arcana) +25, Knowledge (dungeoneering) +12, Knowledge (engineering) +12, Knowledge (geography) +12, Knowledge (history) +12, Knowledge (local) +12, Knowledge (nature) +12, Knowledge (nobility) +12, Knowledge (planes) +25, Knowledge (religion) +12, Perception +17, Perform (act) +20, Perform (oratory) +20, Ride +9, Sleight of Hand +9, Spellcraft +21 (+23 to identify magic item properties), Stealth +17, Survival +2, Use Magic Device +21; Racial Modifiers +2 Perception, +2 Spellcraft to identify magic item properties
Languages Celestial, Common, Draconic, Elven, Infernal, Sylvan
SQ bardic knowledge +4, elven magic, lore master 1/day, versatile performances (act, oratory)
Combat Gear wand of cure light wounds, wand of gravity bow (50 charges); Other Gear celestial armor, +5 adaptive composite longbow (+5 Str), arrows (100), smoke arrows (5), amulet of natural armor +1, belt of physical might +4 (Str, Dex), bracers of archery, greater, handy haversack, headband of mental prowess +4 (Int, Cha), backpack, bedroll, belt pouch, flint and steel, hemp rope (50 ft.), ink, black, inkpen, journal, mess kit, mirror, pot, soap, torch (10), trail rations (5), waterskin, 109 gp
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Special Abilities
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Bardic Knowledge +4 (Ex) Add +4 to all knowledge skill checks.
Bardic Performance (move action, 21 rounds/day) Your performances can create magical effects.
Clustered Shots Total damage from full-round ranged attacks before applying DR
Deadly Aim -4/+8 Trade a penalty to ranged attacks for a bonus to ranged damage.
Elven Immunities - Sleep You are immune to magic sleep effects.
Elven Magic +2 to spellcraft checks to determine the properties of a magic item.
Enhance Arrows (distance) (Su) Every nonmagical arrow you fire has the distance special ability.
Enhance Arrows (Electricity, Electricity) (Su) Every nonmagical arrow you fire adds elemental energy.
Enhance Arrows (magic) (Su) Every nonmagical arrow you fire has a +1 enhancement bonus.
Imbue Arrow (At will) (Su) You can cast an area effect spell on an arrow before firing it.
Lore Master (1/day) (Ex) Can take 10 on any trained knowledge checks. Activate to take 20 as a standard action.
Low-Light Vision See twice as far as a human in low light, distinguishing color and detail.
Manyshot You can shoot two arrows as the first attack of a full attack action.
Phase Arrow (1/day) (Su) Fire an arrow that ignores cover, concealment and armor modifiers.
Point-Blank Shot +1 to attack and damage rolls with ranged weapons at up to 30 feet.
Precise Shot You don't get -4 to hit when shooting or throwing into melee.
Rapid Shot You get an extra attack with ranged weapons. Each attack is at -2.
Seeker Arrow (2/day) (Su) Fire an arrow that ignores cover and concealment modifiers.
Versatile Performance (Acting) +20 (Ex) You may substitute the final value of your Perform: Act skill for Bluff or Disguise checks
Versatile Performance (Oratory) +20 (Ex) You may substitute the final value of your Perform: Oratory skill for Diplomacy or Sense Motive checks

Davan #2:

Male elf bard 14
CG Medium humanoid (elf)
Init +9; Senses low-light vision; Perception +17
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Defense
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AC 27, touch 17, flat-footed 20 (+9 armor, +7 Dex, +1 natural)
hp 71 (14d8)
Fort +4, Ref +16, Will +7; +2 vs. enchantments, +4 vs. bardic performance, language-dependent, and sonic
Immune sleep
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Offense
--------------------
Speed 30 ft.
Ranged +5 adaptive composite longbow +25/+20 (1d8+10/×3)
Special Attacks bardic performance 33 rounds/day (swift action; countersong, dirge of doom, distraction, fascinate [DC 20], frightening tune [DC 20], inspire competence +4, inspire courage +3, inspire greatness, soothing performance, suggestion [DC 20])
Bard Spells Known (CL 14th; concentration +17)
5th (2/day)—mass cure light wounds, deafening song bolt[APG], greater dispel magic
4th (4/day)—break enchantment, cure critical wounds, mass ghostbane dirge[APG] (DC 17), neutralize poison
3rd (5/day)—cure serious wounds, dispel magic, haste, remove curse, see invisibility
2nd (6/day)—cat's grace, cure moderate wounds, delay poison, fox's cunning, ghostbane dirge[APG] (DC 15), versatile weapon[APG] (DC 15)
1st (6/day)—abundant ammunition[UC], cure light wounds, feather fall, grease, hideous laughter (DC 14), identify
0 (at will)—daze (DC 13), detect magic, light, mending, prestidigitation, read magic
--------------------
Statistics
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Str 18, Dex 24, Con 11, Int 18, Wis 7, Cha 16
Base Atk +10; CMB +14; CMD 31
Feats Clustered Shots[UC], Deadly Aim, Manyshot, Point-blank Shot, Precise Shot, Rapid Shot, Weapon Focus (longbow)
Traits reactionary, vagabond child (urban)
Skills Appraise +8, Climb +6, Disable Device +23, Escape Artist +9, Intimidate +7, Knowledge (arcana) +28, Knowledge (dungeoneering) +15, Knowledge (engineering) +15, Knowledge (geography) +15, Knowledge (history) +15, Knowledge (local) +15, Knowledge (nature) +15, Knowledge (nobility) +19, Knowledge (planes) +28, Knowledge (religion) +15, Perception +17, Perform (act) +20, Perform (dance) +20, Perform (oratory) +20, Ride +6, Sleight of Hand +9, Spellcraft +21 (+23 to identify magic item properties), Stealth +17, Survival -1, Use Magic Device +20; Racial Modifiers +2 Perception, +2 Spellcraft to identify magic item properties
Languages Celestial, Common, Draconic, Elven, Infernal, Sylvan
SQ bardic knowledge +7, elven magic, jack-of-all-trades, lore master 2/day, versatile performances (act, dance, oratory, wind)
Combat Gear wand of cure light wounds, wand of gravity bow (50 charges); Other Gear celestial armor, +5 adaptive composite longbow (+5 Str), arrows (100), smoke arrows (5), amulet of natural armor +1, belt of physical might +4 (Str, Dex), bracers of archery, greater, handy haversack, headband of mental prowess +4 (Int, Cha), backpack, bedroll, belt pouch, flint and steel, hemp rope (50 ft.), ink, black, inkpen, journal, mess kit, mirror, pot, soap, torch (10), trail rations (5), waterskin, 109 gp
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Special Abilities
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Bardic Knowledge +7 (Ex) Add +7 to all knowledge skill checks.
Bardic Performance (swift action, 33 rounds/day) Your performances can create magical effects.
Clustered Shots Total damage from full-round ranged attacks before applying DR
Deadly Aim -3/+6 Trade a penalty to ranged attacks for a bonus to ranged damage.
Elven Immunities - Sleep You are immune to magic sleep effects.
Elven Magic +2 to spellcraft checks to determine the properties of a magic item.
Jack-of-all-trades (use any skill) (Ex) You may use all skills untrained.
Lore Master (2/day) (Ex) Can take 10 on any trained knowledge checks. Activate to take 20 as a standard action.
Low-Light Vision See twice as far as a human in low light, distinguishing color and detail.
Manyshot You can shoot two arrows as the first attack of a full attack action.
Point-Blank Shot +1 to attack and damage rolls with ranged weapons at up to 30 feet.
Precise Shot You don't get -4 to hit when shooting or throwing into melee.
Rapid Shot You get an extra attack with ranged weapons. Each attack is at -2.
Versatile Performance (Acting) +20 (Ex) You may substitute the final value of your Perform: Act skill for Bluff or Disguise checks
Versatile Performance (Dance) +20 (Ex) You may substitute the final value of your Perform: Dance skill for Acrobatics or Fly checks
Versatile Performance (Oratory) +20 (Ex) You may substitute the final value of your Perform: Oratory skill for Diplomacy or Sense Motive checks
Versatile Performance (Wind Instruments) +0 (Ex) You may substitute the final value of your Perform: Wind Instruments skill for Diplomacy or Handle Animal checks


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Straight bard is far better in the support role. Exactly what is your party makeup and how are they regarding teamwork/coordination?

Have you considered Pheromone Arrows? Alter Self can be used to grant yourself Scent. And the arrows give a +2/+2 circumstance bonus if you possess scent.

RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16

Personally, I'd stick with bard for better spell progression and advancing your Inspire Courage.

Your stats seem... questionable. 11 Con? 7 Wis? Especially with no Cloak of Resistance, those lead to some abysmal saves, so you're just asking to get killed. I'd start with something closer to 12/17/11/12/8/14, and use your Belt of Physical Might to boost Con rather than Strength (or at the very least, grab the Ioun Stone for +2 Con for 8000 gp).

Your spell choices seem odd as well. You have several spells that require saves, but only mediocre Charisma. Likewise, Cure spells are seldom useful even on a cleric, but you've got them all. Cat's Grace and Fox's Cunning are also completely invalidated by your belt and headband (they don't stack), so those spells known are essentially wasted. Pick up buff spells like Heroism and Good Hope instead to boost accuracy and damage (and especially saves!)


I was starting to lean for full bard myself.

Apparently we're doing 25 point buy, so I have more stat flexibility than I thought.

Yeah, I'm a bit rusty, which is why I'm here. ;) I totally forgot about the stat spells not stacking with headband/belt bonuses.

The high Strength was to take advantage of the Composite Longbow damage, aiding to kill things faster so less healing in combat would be needed.

My party is probably going to end up a 3 person group, possibly under level for the content, so I may be trying to cover more bases than I should. It looks like we may have a Cleric and a Summoner as well.


As much as I love the idea behind arcane archer straight bard is often a better choice.

You don't need strength all that much. It's good, but not that important as you gain in levels. Lets say you are a level 14 straight bard with a +5 longbow.

16 str (1d8+17) ave 21.5
18 str (1d8+18) ave 22.5
It's only a 4.6% increase in damage. Not really worth it in the long run compared to making saves/skill points/health/Spell DC's.

Don't ignore it entirely, but it isn't as important to an archer as it is a melee (where it effects hit% and damage).


I made up a bard archer for our Carrion Crown group. I went bard 11 fighter 5 (picked up fighter 1 at level 12) and my archery is quite good now. It was passable even as a bard. I can easily throw out +5 to attack and damage to the group via inspire courage and good hope. Throw in haste if you're so inclined (we had a wizard and we agreed he would pick it up so I didn't).

Here is a link to my build progression. We used a 25-point buy. He has been a fun character. We are finishing up the campaign by playing through a modified version of A Paladin in Hell. The plan is to finish out the last 4 levels as bard. Good luck!
Rikko


Arcane Strike is excellent for archers, probably better than Deadly Aim for archers with 3/4 BAB. You can get Arcane Strike as a bonus feat if you take the Arcane Duelist archetype. You’ll lose some of the bard’s superb skill boosters, but you gain the ability to enchant your own bow and some other useful bonus feats.

You don't need Cure Light Wounds as a spell known--just get a wand. Liberating Command would be an excellent replacement, as would Silent Image, Saving Finale, Vanish, or Unseen Servant. Actually, dump all your Cure Wound spells and get lots of Cure Light Wands. Cat’s Grace doesn’t stack with a magic belt of dexterity and Fox’s Cunning doesn’t stack with a headband of intelligence, so dump those too. That will give you room for other excellent spells, like Mirror Image, Invisibility, Heroism, Glitterdust, Pilfering Hand, Shatter, Silence, Suggestion and Tongues. Consider picking up Confusion, Glibness and Good Hope; Dimension Door, Freedom of Movement and Modify Memory.

Make sure to put a Tuned Bowstring on your shopping list.

Good luck!


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Oh didn't check the spell list yeah I agree, drop the stat buffs and cure spells.

Spells I'd consider:
Grease
Vanish
Saving Finale
Allegro
Glitterdust
Alter Self
Silence
Confusion
Haste
Freedom of Movement


I will second arcane strike. Not only is it a fantastic damage booster, but riving strike makes it a fantastic debuff tool since it makes enemies take a -2 to saves vs spells for 1 turn.


Emmit Svenson wrote:
Arcane Strike is excellent for archers, probably better than Deadly Aim for archers with 3/4 BAB. You can get Arcane Strike as a bonus feat if you take the Arcane Duelist archetype. You’ll lose some of the bard’s superb skill boosters, but you gain the ability to enchant your own bow and some other useful bonus feats.

I'm going to second the suggestion of Arcane Duelist. I think it is the best single-class option for an "Arcane Archer" type character.

*Bladethirst does a good job of replacing the Arcane Archer's Enhance Arrow ability (although you will usually want to use Inspire Courage instead). Ghost Touch is a great situational enhancement while Distance and Seeking are often great archery options. Notice that you can choose to enhance either your bow or your arrows with this ability.

*Choosing your bow as your Arcane Bond lets you enchant it at half price, and you are the only class which can can use the bow hand for somatic gestures while holding a metamagic rod in the other. The extra spell per day isn't a minor ability either.

*Medium and then heavy armor makes you a less breakable "glass cannon."

*Getting Arcane Strike and Combat Casting for free is excellent since you would probably choose them anyway.

*Disruptive and Spellbreaker are usually only available to fighters. If you also get the Snap Shot chain of feats, you can really mess up enemy spellcasters with your arrows.

*Penetrating Strike and Greater Penetrating Strike are another pair of fighter feats. They come late, but at that stage being able to overcome some DR is priceless.

It is just a fantastic choice.

If you really, really want to make good use of Imbue Arrow, the Magician Bard with a two-level dip into Arcane Archer might work. Expanded Repertoire lets you eventually add 5 wizard spells to your spell list. You can use this to pick up some Area spells, including the grand prize: Antimagic Field.

It costs you Inspire Courage, which really hurts. Not "stub your toe" level hurt, but "passing a kidney stone" levels of hurt. But the casters in your party will be thrilled with its replacement - Dweomercraft. Their spells and spell-like abilities will rock! Personally I like stacking Magician with Sound Striker. Weird Words is excellent. (This FAQ is relevant.)


lemeres wrote:
I will second arcane strike. Not only is it a fantastic damage booster, but riving strike makes it a fantastic debuff tool since it makes enemies take a -2 to saves vs spells for 1 turn.

Yes. And if you wear Gloves of Arcane Striking then your arrows can basically deal some splash damage.


One last suggestion is to consider Half-Elf instead of Elf. Being able to select the Human FCB of one extra spell known is really great for a Bard, and you still have a lot of the Elvish flavor.


Can someone explain Arcane Strike a bit further? I was looking at that before I posted, but I assumed it wouldn't stack with a magical weapon bonus. Since it doesn't specify "Enhancement bonus" on the feat, is it assumed to simply be an extra +1 that can stack with anything?

Edit:
Assuming that's the case, I like it. Also tweaked based on some other points made. I'm focusing on archer more than spell caster, so I scrapped all the spells that are save-based. Changed race to Human to pick up Arcane Strike feat.

barcher:

Davan
Male human bard 14
CG Medium humanoid (human)
Init +8; Senses Perception +18
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Defense
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AC 23, touch 16, flat-footed 17 (+5 armor, +6 Dex, +2 natural)
hp 113 (14d8+42)
Fort +10, Ref +18, Will +13; +4 vs. bardic performance, language-dependent, and sonic
--------------------
Offense
--------------------
Speed 30 ft.
Ranged +5 adaptive composite longbow +18/+18/+13 (1d8+19/×3)
Special Attacks bardic performance 32 rounds/day (swift action; countersong, dirge of doom, distraction, fascinate [DC 19], frightening tune [DC 19], inspire competence +4, inspire courage +3, inspire greatness, soothing performance, suggestion [DC 19])
Bard Spells Known (CL 14th; concentration +16)
5th (2/day)—deafening song bolt[APG], greater dispel magic, greater heroism
4th (4/day)—break enchantment, cure critical wounds, greater invisibility, neutralize poison
3rd (4/day)—dispel magic, good hope, haste, remove curse, see invisibility
2nd (6/day)—allegro[UM], cure moderate wounds, delay poison, glitterdust (DC 14), heroism, mirror image
1st (6/day)—abundant ammunition[UC], cure light wounds, feather fall, grease, identify, unbreakable heart[ISWG]
0 (at will)—detect magic, light, mending, message, prestidigitation, read magic
--------------------
Statistics
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Str 18, Dex 23, Con 16, Int 16, Wis 12, Cha 15
Base Atk +10; CMB +14; CMD 30
Feats Arcane Strike, Clustered Shots[UC], Deadly Aim, Manyshot, Point-blank Shot, Precise Shot, Rapid Shot, Weapon Focus (longbow)
Traits reactionary, vagabond child (urban)
Skills Appraise +7, Climb +8, Disable Device +24, Escape Artist +10, Intimidate +6, Knowledge (arcana) +27, Knowledge (dungeoneering) +14, Knowledge (engineering) +14, Knowledge (geography) +14, Knowledge (history) +14, Knowledge (local) +14, Knowledge (nature) +14, Knowledge (nobility) +18, Knowledge (planes) +27, Knowledge (religion) +14, Perception +18, Perform (act) +19, Perform (dance) +19, Perform (oratory) +19, Ride +7, Sleight of Hand +10, Spellcraft +20, Stealth +18, Survival +2, Use Magic Device +19
Languages Celestial, Common, Draconic, Infernal
SQ bardic knowledge +7, jack-of-all-trades, lore master 2/day, versatile performances (act, dance, oratory, wind)
Combat Gear wand of cure light wounds, wand of gravity bow (50 charges); Other Gear +1 mithral chain shirt, +5 adaptive composite longbow (+5 Str), arrows (100), smoke arrows (5), amulet of natural armor +2, belt of physical might +4 (Str, Dex), bracers of archery, greater, cloak of resistance +3, gloves of arcane striking, handy haversack, headband of mental prowess +4 (Int, Cha), backpack, bedroll, belt pouch, flint and steel, hemp rope (50 ft.), ink, black, inkpen, journal, mess kit, mirror, pot, soap, torch (10), trail rations (5), waterskin, 409 gp
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Special Abilities
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Arcane Strike As a swift action, add +1 damage, +1 per 5 caster levels and your weapons are treated as magic for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.
Bardic Knowledge +7 (Ex) Add +7 to all knowledge skill checks.
Bardic Performance (swift action, 32 rounds/day) Your performances can create magical effects.
Clustered Shots Total damage from full-round ranged attacks before applying DR
Deadly Aim -3/+6 Trade a penalty to ranged attacks for a bonus to ranged damage.
Gloves of arcane striking Arcane strike bonus is added to aid another, and deals splash dam around hit foe.
Jack-of-all-trades (use any skill) (Ex) You may use all skills untrained.
Lore Master (2/day) (Ex) Can take 10 on any trained knowledge checks. Activate to take 20 as a standard action.
Manyshot You can shoot two arrows as the first attack of a full attack action.
Point-Blank Shot +1 to attack and damage rolls with ranged weapons at up to 30 feet.
Precise Shot You don't get -4 to hit when shooting or throwing into melee.
Rapid Shot You get an extra attack with ranged weapons. Each attack is at -2.
Versatile Performance (Acting) +19 (Ex) You may substitute the final value of your Perform: Act skill for Bluff or Disguise checks
Versatile Performance (Dance) +19 (Ex) You may substitute the final value of your Perform: Dance skill for Acrobatics or Fly checks
Versatile Performance (Oratory) +19 (Ex) You may substitute the final value of your Perform: Oratory skill for Diplomacy or Sense Motive checks
Versatile Performance (Wind Instruments) +0 (Ex) You may substitute the final value of your Perform: Wind Instruments skill for Diplomacy or Handle Animal checks

Edit Edit:

Still have some Cures on my spell list as I haven't decided how to replace them yet.


Ashes wrote:
Can someone explain Arcane Strike a bit further? I was looking at that before I posted, but I assumed it wouldn't stack with a magical weapon bonus. Since it doesn't specify "Enhancement bonus" on the feat, is it assumed to simply be an extra +1 that can stack with anything?

Yes. It is an untyped damage bonus so it stacks with anything. And it applies to every weapon that you use: melee, ranged, or natural. For a bard, it is usually better than Power Attack. It doesn't do as much damage, but it also doesn't have the 'to hit' penalties which hit you harder than they would a full BAB class.


Gisher wrote:
Ashes wrote:
Can someone explain Arcane Strike a bit further? I was looking at that before I posted, but I assumed it wouldn't stack with a magical weapon bonus. Since it doesn't specify "Enhancement bonus" on the feat, is it assumed to simply be an extra +1 that can stack with anything?
Yes. It is an untyped damage bonus so it stacks with anything. And it applies to every weapon that you use: melee, ranged, or natural. For a bard, it is usually better than Power Attack. It doesn't do as much damage, but it also doesn't have the 'to hit' penalties which hit you harder than they would a full BAB class.

Much cooler than I expected. Neat...


Ashes wrote:
Gisher wrote:
Ashes wrote:
Can someone explain Arcane Strike a bit further? I was looking at that before I posted, but I assumed it wouldn't stack with a magical weapon bonus. Since it doesn't specify "Enhancement bonus" on the feat, is it assumed to simply be an extra +1 that can stack with anything?
Yes. It is an untyped damage bonus so it stacks with anything. And it applies to every weapon that you use: melee, ranged, or natural. For a bard, it is usually better than Power Attack. It doesn't do as much damage, but it also doesn't have the 'to hit' penalties which hit you harder than they would a full BAB class.
Much cooler than I expected. Neat...

It can be even cooler. Since you seem a little unfamiliar with the feat, I'm going to draw your attention to the Gloves of Arcane Striking that I mentioned in an earlier post. Its first and third abilities enable you to boost your Aid Another actions, but it is the second one that is so good for an archer.

So imagine that you target an enemy who is adjacent to four of his comrades. If you hit him with an arrow, then he suffers damage from Arcane Strike. (Let's say you are 10th level so it is +3.) If you are wearing the gloves, then all four of his adjacent allies also take +3 damage with no additional attack rolls needed. So now Arcane Strike has dealt a total of 15 points just from that one hit. Between iterative attacks, Rapid Strike, haste/speed, etc. archers can deliver a lot of attacks in a round, so all of that "splash damage" from Arcane Strike can really start to add up.

Of course the enemy troops can just spread out to avoid this effect, but that just makes it easy for your group to use battlefield control tactics to divide and conquer.


And of course, as I've said before, riving strike is a feat that has arcane strike as a prerequisite.

It makes any enemy you hittake a -2 on saves vs spells for a turn. That is fairly similar to the evil eye hex.

So that means that, along with the gloves Gisher mentioned, you are doing damage, splash damage, and now debuffing. All from anywhere on the battlefield since you are an archer.

Sadly, the gloves don't truly cause arcane strike with the splash damage (it is just 'damage equal to your arcane strike'). That would make riving strike near broken since you would be doing area of effect debuffs along with your damage.

I must admit...I am super salty when the "SLAs as casting" ruling got changed, since I had a rather nice reach fighter that did great debuffing (a lot of intimidation stuff thrown in)


lemeres wrote:

And of course, as I've said before, riving strike is a feat that has arcane strike as a prerequisite.

It makes any enemy you hittake a -2 on saves vs spells for a turn. That is fairly similar to the evil eye hex.

So that means that, along with the gloves Gisher mentioned, you are doing damage, splash damage, and now debuffing. All from anywhere on the battlefield since you are an archer.

Yes, Riving Strike is great. Your fellow casters will love you for peppering the battlefield with lowered resistance. I was so excited that they made Arcane Strike into part of a feat chain that involved a debuff. I think it is worth noting that Riving Strike reduces saves against spell-like abilities as well as spells.

lemeres wrote:
I must admit...I am super salty when the "SLAs as casting" ruling got changed, since I had a rather nice reach fighter that did great debuffing (a lot of intimidation stuff thrown in)

Yeah, a lot of us lost great builds with that change. I finally had a viable Arcane Archer, and was working on a fun "reach Wizard" build using Eldritch Knight.


I wasn't familiar with the Arcane Duelist archetype, that's some handy stuff. I like it, thanks for the suggestions.

The Arcane Bond on my weapon saves a lot of money being able to enchant it myself, so I bumped back up to Celestial Armor, but now I've got 6k gold left I'm not sure where to invest. Just a pile of Wands maybe...


No mention of Discordant Voice? One of my favorite feats for a bard as it gives every ally's weapon an additional 1d6 sonic damage.


The Dawnflower Dervish archetype is extremely powerful at the cost of inspire courage only buffing yourself. You get Dervish Dance for free, so that you can use a scimitar as back-up if desired. Crossed with the Aasimar favored class bonus your combat potential is just ridiculous - by level 4, you can begin a +4/+4 battle dance as a move action and cast Allegro on yourself as a personal Haste in the same round. By level 8 you're at +6/+6.


Fourshadow wrote:
No mention of Discordant Voice? One of my favorite feats for a bard as it gives every ally's weapon an additional 1d6 sonic damage.

Nice catch! Very few creatures have resistance to sonic, and of course you count as your own ally.


Gisher wrote:
Fourshadow wrote:
No mention of Discordant Voice? One of my favorite feats for a bard as it gives every ally's weapon an additional 1d6 sonic damage.
Nice catch! Very few creatures have resistance to sonic, and of course you count as your own ally.

Yep. I love Discordant Voice with Manyshot and Rapid shot. If you have Verbose Performer, DV will have greater range (60' instead of 30').


I've given a lot of thought to a Bardcane Archer.

Firstly I wanted to go with voice of the wild. Having courage song but also ranger spells like gravity bow and arrow eruption? Incredible and you'll cast them way before all other classes.

But I decided on Archeologist. With Fates favored and heirloom weapon of longbow.

I reasoned I could get a scroll to turn the bow in master work. This let me be a human. One more feat.

Then because of Archeologist I could get rogue talents. This let me take a couple free weapon feats.

I figured at around level 13 I'd have a plus 3 bow and be an arcane archer. That's 1d8 + 2d6 +15.

Not terrible! Riving strike with aoe spells would make spells like glitter dust work really well.


Fourshadow wrote:
Gisher wrote:
Fourshadow wrote:
No mention of Discordant Voice? One of my favorite feats for a bard as it gives every ally's weapon an additional 1d6 sonic damage.
Nice catch! Very few creatures have resistance to sonic, and of course you count as your own ally.
Yep. I love Discordant Voice with Manyshot and Rapid shot. If you have Verbose Performer, DV will have greater range (60' instead of 30').

My searches on the PRD and SRD have failed me. What is Verbose Performer?


Cavall wrote:

I've given a lot of thought to a Bardcane Archer.

Firstly I wanted to go with voice of the wild. Having courage song but also ranger spells like gravity bow and arrow eruption? Incredible and you'll cast them way before all other classes.

But I decided on Archeologist. With Fates favored and heirloom weapon of longbow.

I reasoned I could get a scroll to turn the bow in master work. This let me be a human. One more feat.

Then because of Archeologist I could get rogue talents. This let me take a couple free weapon feats.

I figured at around level 13 I'd have a plus 3 bow and be an arcane archer. That's 1d8 + 2d6 +15.

Not terrible! Riving strike with aoe spells would make spells like glitter dust work really well.

Keep in mind this is without Adaptive, (a cheap boost) and strength. With even moderate increases that would jump up to 1d8 + 2d6 (1d6 sonic and electric )+ 18. Gravity bow wands would make it 4d6 +18. That's brutal hits combined with everything a bard offers too.

The Archeologist human in this example has 3 more feats than the OP. Almost 50% increase. Weapon focus and combat training as rogue talents pad out a lot of much needed feats.

At 13th level I worked it out to have
1 point blank
1 arcane strike
3 precise shot
4 weapon focus
5 many shot
7 rapid fire
8 riving strike
9 deadly aim
11 sonic damage 1d6
13 cluster


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Noticed a few things...maybe I am reading it wrong...

Manyshot requires Rapid shot and BAB+6.
And you will want Clustered Shot right after Manyshot. Unless you have a +5 bow. And you'll still want it anyway.


I'll reverse those two, but I'll take cluster when I feel it's due. More an nite to take it then when for cluster. Thanks though, I'll correct


Gisher wrote:
Fourshadow wrote:
Gisher wrote:
Fourshadow wrote:
No mention of Discordant Voice? One of my favorite feats for a bard as it gives every ally's weapon an additional 1d6 sonic damage.
Nice catch! Very few creatures have resistance to sonic, and of course you count as your own ally.
Yep. I love Discordant Voice with Manyshot and Rapid shot. If you have Verbose Performer, DV will have greater range (60' instead of 30').
My searches on the PRD and SRD have failed me. What is Verbose Performer?

It's in the Faction Guide (fantastic book, IMO). It is also on archivesofnethys.com (my search fu/link fu is not good at all, sorry). There is a heavy feat tax for Verbose Performer (you need Extra Performance and Master Performer--also in Faction Guide--which gives +1 to Bardic Performance bonuses!).

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