Games and Geeks's page

Hey guys! I've yet to run my first game but I got the Beginner Box, the Bestiary Box, and all the free stuff from the Beginner Box page here on Paizo. However, I am thinking ahead and wondering which modules/adventure paths to consider for my group.

But first, some group info --- my group basically consists of my wife and two sons, aged 9 and 3 --- the 3 year old thinks he can do anything we do, so he will be our official dice roller for both the GM and one GMPC. Because of this, I have ruled out Rise of the Rune Lords as it is too violent and it seems like it deals with the 7 sins which is too "adult" by itself for me to successfully tone it down. I have just finished reading Crypt of the Everflame and it seems like I can run that with a little more kiddie-friendly mood.

As for myself, I have a little experience with CRPGs but even less experience actually GM-ing.

Anyway, my main beef with Crypt is that it seems to be set in a different town... the Beginner Box is set in Sandpoint; I don't even know where Kassen is in relation to Sandpoint. At the end of the adventure, it seems like the PCs are expected to travel OUT from Kassen to investigate other hooks like the newly-minted coins, where the bandits were from, etc.

I would like my PCs to be based out of one locale for the moment, as we are all new. It would save me tons of time too just having to learn one settlement and work from there, instead of having to learn 10 settlements that the PCs are only going to spend a few sessions in. Also, as a new GM, I would prefer to use a pre-made module or AP instead of making my own as I have no idea how to make one.

So I make this thread here in the PFRPG General Discussion forum --- is there a location in the PF world that is constantly used in the pre-made PF modules or adventure paths? Or is there a module or adventure path that revolves around a central location?

Yep, I got no problem of using the WBL when **creating** a character of a higher level; I just give them that value as their shopping budget, correct?

My confusion comes with having to track it for in-progress characters. A fighter with gear worth 8,000gp is fine, but how do you "keep track" of the consumables used up? That fighter may have 10,000gp a few levels later but the wizard who spent his gold on consumables like scrolls and potions may just have 6,000gp, the same as he had 3 levels earlier.

Wow, thanks for that post, The Block Knight! That put me off RotRL for sure! I can fudge a few scenes, but not if the entire adventure is chock full of them!

Can I get a quick gist of the Crypt, Mask, and City modules you guys recommended? I've read the blurb from the relevant module pages, but I've been clueless about RotRL up until your post just now, so I'd like to hear from guys who've run these modules if they are suitable for kids or at least easily modifiable?

Note that my 9 year old isn't really a horror/thriller buff, nor is my wife but she likes watching such movies.... then insists I go with her downstairs when she needs a glass of water or a bottle of milk or something, lol! So in as much as I can do scary stuff, I'd like it to be kid-friendly, like the "evil" Team Rocket in Pokemon :D

Ouch! I've not even considered consumables! Obviously a PC who buys such items and uses them wantonly will be "poorer" than others who buy armor or weapons and rely on spellcasters for healing and buffs.

The easiest way I see to use the WBL is when making a PC at a certain level, then that value is their "shopping budget." But how about for those PCs created earlier?

Another example: For example, a given WBL for a level 4 PC is 6,000gp. A fighter who buys only gear (weapon, armor, rings) and maybe spent 1,000gp on potions will still have 5,000gp worth of gear. How about those PCs then who buy loads of potions or maybe a wizard who always stocks up on some scrolls so he is not limited to only the spells he's prepared for a day? If he spent 4,000gp on these items, he only has 2,000gp worth of gear..... or am I expected to keep track of all the items spent/consumed/cast so as to "add" it in during a wealth-by-level-audit?

I know I can just handwave this and just make sure I generate a treasure hoard that is as "fair" as I can make it for all the PCs involved, but I'd really like to know this for future reference in case my PCs get creamed --- I'd like to be able to know/check if I've been giving them proper treasure.

Reading through the Hero's Handbook and GM Guide, there was some discussion about giving out treasure and PC wealth by level. Now if I give out a piece of treasure worth 1,000gp and the PC keeps it, that's fine but if the PC does not like it or does not find it useful and decides to sell it, it'll be "bought" for 500gp, correct? Does that mean later in the adventure I will need to give out another 500gp-worth of coins or useful treasure or another 1,000gp of not-useful-and-will-be-sold treasure?

Thanks!

The USPS has a 4-pound limit on International First Class parcels (and any cheaper service rates), so Priority really is the cheapest option. (The Bestiary Box weighs 4.25 pounds, and that's not including the weight of the shipping materials!)

Well, that certainly helps me make up my mind regarding these purchases! Thanks for the clarification!

Started to do some comparisons with buying the Bestiary Box locally vs buying from Paizo, but I can't choose any other shipping method except USPS priority which is costing an insane $51.35! No, thank you!

Why can't I choose any other shipping options for this box? If there was anything I'd be subscribing to, it was going to be these Pawns, but not if they ship at these prices!

Also, the Bestiary Box was just released on Wednesday, and it does sometimes take extra time for overseas retailers to get stock of new items.

Too slow! I wanted it last Tuesday!! Hehehe... I just found it on IGUK yesterday, woot!!

Thank you for the vote of confidence, The Rot Grub! I wish I was as confident as I sound! Haha!

I am curious about that E6 system; I am currently reading up on the link given by Space Titanium and so far I like what I read... low-level, low-magic, gritty, and more focus (hopefully!!) on the story and less on "I can't wait for the next level up!"

Higher-level monster statblocks: For abilities unique to a monster, there's a description right there and these are relatively easy to run. But as for generic abilities that require rules mastery, you as the GM can run this without the players having to. For example, you can play out the rules of swarm, incorporeality, and invisibility without the players needing to know them. Also, you will be experimenting as you go as to what rule subsets you'd want to exclude, such as Damage Reduction and Spell Resistance. Excluding these will give you less math to work with and the players a couple less things to worry about (such as needing to switch to a silver or cold-iron weapon, etc.), but it might skew with the game balance. That's why I say you'd have to "feel" your way.

Well, the Beginner Box has rules on Damage Reduction (skeletons) so I can deal with that. Same with Spell Resist, I think. As for that extra rules on the monsters, I think it'll be easy enough by using DIFFERENT monsters! Yay! See how I cheated right there?! Hehehe...

Spells and Spell-Like Abilities: You will need to read through spells when they come up, and decide to exclude them for being too complex or being balance-breaking for Beginner Box-style PCs. For example, if you are not giving PCs access to spells to buff before a big fight, you may want to lower the DC of a save-or-die spell, for example. Also, monsters that fly who have long-range attacks may need to be toned down.

This is exactly what scares me... I think my newbie-GM status means I won't know what my criteria is for including/excluding spells or monsters.

Class Progression:

*Looks at Pathfinder PRD*

If you're sticking to the BB classes, you reduce the complexity immensely. Not only are the 4 classes there because they're the classic classes -- they're also mechanically the simplest for players to grasp.

After reading a few posts, it seems like even with the 4 classes (or 5 if you include the barbarian), these were toned down even more for the Beginner Box.

At the very least, I am happy to know that the possibility of continuing the game on a Beginner Box rule set is possible. I wonder how long it'll take for them to get to level 5? The closer they are to that level, the more I would need to decide if we go the E6 system (which is probably simpler for us) or if we continue as normal but with me having to do a lot of input regarding which can and cannot be used in the game (which is scaring me no end!).

Oh well...

PDF of the pawns is awesome if you want to use a virtual tabletop. I've been making tokens to use in MapTool and d20Pro this week from it.

I was thinking more of being able to print my own pawns if the originals get damaged or if I needed more minion pawns... or maybe make tokens out of them.

I don't think there is a way to get the PDF free now, no. It was a perk as the book was out of all the subscription lines.

Nope. Only the copies you get via subscription get the free PDF. You would still apply the Pathfinder Advantage -15% discount to PDFs you bought of earlier volumes.

Ouch. Oh well.

OOOoooooo!! Thanks for the heads up on the Pawns... Now I wonder if the PDF is worth the extra VAT cost?

As for the hardcover books, I'm not too fussed at the moment since I don't see myself ordering very many for the near future, except maybe for the core rulebook and maybe a bestiary book and/or the GM guide book. My main focus right now is the Adventure Paths (basically and pre-made adventures I can run) and maybe some gaming aids such as the Pawns, maybe some maps or some of those dungeon tiles if Paizo does them.

G&G,

You only get the PDF free if you subscribe, not if you just order. So you're probably best off going local if you can get it.

I see... so I just get it free on a subscription.

Amd for the anniversary edition, whcih is definitely worth it, you needed to be a subscriber ito the Adventure Path line before the Anniversary edition came out which is obviously too late. You could still go for the really lush collector's ediciton in November but that's even more expensive and highly unlikely to be anywhere but Paizo.

I'm just looking at the Anniversary Edition... is there any way to get the PDF for free? Like if I subscribe on the current Adventure Path, wait for my first issue to arrive, then order the Anniversary Edition, will I get the PDF free since technically I am on a subscription?

While on this topic, if I do subscribe to the AP, then buy the back issues, do I get the PDFs as well for free?

It's slightly high owing to the doubling up of the AP, but gives you an idea of S&H costs on a monthly basis.

What do you mean "doubling up of the AP"? Did you order an extra one or do you mean two APs were released recently? That S&H of $16.41 looks like the cheapest option, is that shipping to the UK (you didn't say where you are located)?

Thanks for your post! At least I now have a rough idea how much funds I need to clear with she-who-must-be-obeyed if I decide to go this route. Hopefully she'll have enough fun with the game that it'll be easier once the "negotiating phase" starts! Hehehe...

Another "test purchase" of just one issue of an Adventure Path:
Shattered Star 1 - $19.99
Standard Postal Delivery - $6.54
Total - $26.53 = roughly £16.80

This same item from IGUK is £12.29 +£0.35 delivered First Class, but obviously without the PDF.

With a subscription, that's $6 (£3.80) which brings it to about the same as IGUK, but I get the free PDF. Now that's interesting, and a much more attractive deal! Anyone know how long shipping takes? A rough guesstimate will do.

The funny thing about the subscription and buying RotRL is that I need to have received my first subscription copy before I can avail of the 15% discount.... any item ordered WITH the subscription or BEFORE the first copy arrives does not get the discount. Bummer.

Anybody care to double-check my math? Seems like Paizo may be getting a new customer soon! I wonder if the numbers also even out with bigger/heavier items like hardcover rulebooks or the pawn sets that I'm really interested in.... unfortunately that item is not yet available here so I can't compare prices just yet.

Wow, that's quite a haul! Is that EVERYTHING that Paizo is putting out on October? I was hoping for just cost to ship one AP and/or one module --- obviously the more items roughly translates to cheaper shipping.

A quick check using:
Rise of the Runelords Anniversary Edition - $59.99
Shipping - $51.38
Total - $111.37 = roughly £70.50

I assume ordering from Paizo means I get the PDF for free, or do I have to order it separately? There is a cheaper shipping method for about $20 which brings my total to roughly £51.

Still, if I ordered from IGUK:
Rise of the Runelords Anniversary Edition - £35.09
Shipping - Free, or £0.91 for First Class (1-2 days)
RotRL PDF from Paizo - $41.99 = roughly £26.60
Total - £62.60 or just £36 if I don't get the PDF

Now when I start my checkout process, I get this message:

Pathfinder Advantage

Subscribe now and get 15% off suggested retail!*

Pathfinder Adventure Path Ongoing Subscription
Paizo Publishing, LLC
Subscription Price: 30% Off Cover Price + Free PDF

If I understand that correctly, that means I can get 15% off from my RotRL purchase taking it down to $50.99 or about £32.35 for a total of about £45 shipped.

*****

At this point, I'm only interested in getting the RotRL Anniversary Edition; the older single-issues are apparently out-of-print now and I'm not very good at reading material in PDF format so I'm out of options here. I think despite the "savings" of a subscription, it's cheaper for me to just get the book especially since I know little of Pathfinder to justify a subscription to the current issue. The dilemma now is do I get from Paizo and get the PDF saving £10 vs. getting it locally, or just buy the book locally and save £15 but no PDF.

AP subscription: 30% off the cover price, 15% off most everything on the site, free PDF of the AP including interactive maps (able to choose between player & GM views, grid on/off) when it ships, normally a week before the street date.

So 14 dollars for the issue, plus $6.54 shipping just for that.

Thanks for that info, but obviously shipping across the pond costs much more. I'd like to hear from subscribers here in the UK... I don't want to subscribe then find out later on that I ended up paying more than if I got it locally.

I agree with everything that was said about avoiding the Core Rulebook. I'm playing a game now with my wife and three kids (ages 13, 11, and 5), and I regret trying to introduce Attacks of Opportunity and some of the other mechanics, partially because I can't remember all the rules, and that's very confusing for the kids when I'm inconsistent, or say "I can't remember how it's supposed to go, so here's how we'll play it this time and I'll look it up later." As a point of comparison to your own experience level, I used to play in high school, but this is my first RPG in 20 years.

Ah, thank you for posting as well. Glad to see this is a "family friendly" game, lol! I remember AoO being a pain-in-the-@ss for my ranged PCs in Temple of Elemental Evil, so I'm not too fond of introducing it in my game. Now I'm glad to have a reason for avoiding it altogether; though at this point I am now curious about this rule... a quick read on the PRD just convinced me to stay off until such time as my players can identify and call for AoO. I don't want to be having to watch out for this by myself.

I don't own it, but I've browsed through a copy in a game store. If you're really interested, I suggest you do that too. Here's what I remember:

Again, I may be totally wrong here, but can't I just say the ogres are really mean creatures and started stealing the livestock in broad daylight and have even had the gall to cook the meat in big pots right in the town square... they've even raided the houses themselves and took all the pillows and blankets for their own use and now the townsfolk are in danger of starvation and/or freezing to death during the night. To make things worse, the ogres don't clean up after themselves which means the town is now very messy, with animal bones and hide everywhere.... it's only a matter of time before the livestock run out and the ogres start killing humans.... at this point the PCs come in to the rescue!

That's just how I'd deal with that scenario, although of course I don't know if any of the original gory details are required to progress the story or if it's just there to impose how "evil" the ogres are.

I have heard that the Pathfinder Society scenarios are often written to be a little more tame as far as kid-friendly material, because they are meant to be played in an open play environment where you never know who's going to show up.

I shall look into the PF Society scenarios then, thanks!

I'd steer clear of the Core Rules until the least rules-savvy member of your family starts to want to do more than the beginner box lets them. If you get into RPGs, you can always pick up the PDF for ten dollars and see if you think it will be too much for your kids.

Exactly my plan of action. However, I am thinking ahead for if/when we go past level 5, or when I am done running the adventures presented in the Beginner Box --- that is why I am asking which adventure/module is best to get and whether material written on the assumption of using the full rules will work with a game using just the Beginner Box rules. Again, as a new GM, I wouldn't know if my game was breaking apart due to rule problem/incompatibility and I'd just be left in the dust shaking my head and wondering where I went wrong.

I think the Pathfinder Scenarios are a good idea. Also some of the low level modules. There'll be a few parts that make you scratch your head (references to rules which arent in the beginner box) but you can literally just ignore those bits and nothing goes wrong. (Though it might feel a little odd the first time something like that happens - it's par for the course with tabletop RPGs).

Again, see my earlier post about being a new GM and no confidence in my story-editing/creating skills, so getting an advensture/module/scenario that requires minimal alteration plus getting one that is long enough to take the characters through a good few levels (enough for an overarcing storyline) I think is a good idea as it cuts down my workload. Or I hope it should. Shouldn't it?

Thanks for the module recommendations. I shall take a look into them, but are they "better" or "on par" with Rise of the Runelords? Again, I have zero experience with any of this so I can end up with a totally wrong module and won't realize my error until after I played a horrendous game. Obviously, I want to present a fun and exciting experience to my players so I want to be doubly-triply-quadruply sure that I am getting the right material at the right time for the group.

I'm in very nearly the same boat. I played Black Fang's dungeon with my wife, 9 and 7 year old. We followed that up with Crypt of the Everflame (which they enjoyed) and are now halfway through Masks of the Living God (which I've posted elsewhere as having just gone off the rails :-))

Hello! Boy, am I glad to hear from you. I will look up your thread after this and see how you did, but I'm glad to see that someone has gone through this path before me and come out unscathed.

I DID end up purchasing the Core Rulebook (and Bestiary and APG), but mainly just because I wanted to read them. There are some core rule mechanics (swarm, combat maneuvers) that the modules mention, but I ended up mostly hand-waving them away, or using with a lot of hand-holding in very specific situations.

I have said so before, and I think I don't have a problem with BUYING the core books. I like my toys and DLCs and mods for PC games, no reason why I should limit myself here. However, my main concern is being **forced** to use the full rules before my party is ready... hell, I wonder if I can skip using the full rules at all?

I dont think your next step after the beginner box should be the RotRL (Rise of the Runelords)adventure path. Its kind of an advanced player/GM thing and can take over a year to run, not to mention some of the scenes can be rather gruesome and possibly scary to a 3 and 9 year old.

Back in the day I GMed for a group of friends and a friends 9 year old sibling, and it gave them nightmares even though it was a pretty tame storyline.

Can you tell me more about this? I have not read RotRL yet, but can't I just tone down the gore? For example, instead of saying "you cut his head clean off with a swipe of your mighty sword!" after a crit, I can say "you strike him really hard and he yelps in great pain, then runs away into the darkness!" Basically just making it a "E" game instead of "Rated 18+" with a few description changes...

If you follow this path you will want to pick up the core rulebook, and a beastiary or 3 as the scenarios often reference these books. Though, you could just skip the books and use Paizo's free online reference at http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/

Thanks for the heads up on the PRD. I have no qualms about buying the rulebook or bestiary but I would like to keep the rules we use during play at the Beginner Box level. I know I would want/need the core books for more "toys" like equipment to buy, magic items to find, monsters to fight, etc., but I just don't think I want to use the full rules just yet.

Also, when you get the basics of the rules and storytelling, you dont need any other resources, just make up your own stories and monsters.

I'm not too confident of my story-telling or story-creating abilities just yet, hence the search for "additional resources" that I can use to aid me in playing and GM-ing the game, but with my "requirement" of keeping things in Beginner Box rules level even past level 5 plus my inexperience with tabletop RPGs and PFRPG, well, you can see the odds are kinda stacked against me for now.

First off, for more adventures and the like you can check out the extra free stuff on the site: Paizo Beginner Box

They've put out rules for the barbarian, some extra adventures, monsters and the like that you can download and print off.

*On second thought, I think you found these but I just want to make sure you have found the webpage.*

Yes, I have downloaded the free stuff from the Beginner Box section of the website. My apologies, I probably should've said that as well.

Based on the age of the kids I would stay away from the Core Rulebook for now. The Beginner's Box offers a stripped down version of the rules in the Core, so anything else in there can be considered "extra" and can be really confusing.

Exactly my point, plus new GM as well and I tend to get "information overload" rather quickly. Plus I want to run a quick and fun game, cinematic, if you will. After reading a few more threads, it seems like the Beginner Box rules do not include something called Attacks of Opportunity which I remember from Temple of Elemental Evil. Anyway, the gist of the thread was that even WITHOUT AoO, the game was fun, and faster! I am curious how long character-level-wise can I push the Beginner Box rules before I **have** to use the full rules.

Rise of the Runelords is held up as one of the best of Paizo's Adventure Paths, if not the best period. It screams traditional D&D, has been updated for the current ruleset, and seems to be better for young kids. However, if you are avoiding the Core you'll get through 1/3 of the AP and then will have to transfer over to the full rules.

Can you tell me why exactly will I have to "transfer" to the full rules? What do I lose if I keep to the Beginner Box rules? Or does the adventure simply break down if I don't use the full rules?

That said, a company called 0one has actually started publishing adventures based on the BB's rules - you can find them here. It might be preferable to getting the full rules.

Thanks for the heads up on that one.

I have two more ideas. First is taking the E6 system, essentially a game fixed at level 6, and adapting it for level 5 characters using the BB; make your own campaign and let the characters grow more slowly later on (the Bestiary would now come in handy).

I love the idea of E6 (still reading up on it) --- I always liked the "starting adventurers" idea and I remember reading a D&D book before, can't remember if it was 4E or earlier, about how player characters can then go to different planes and travel freely on high levels --- I didn't quite like that. I like the idea of the players being weak and unlikely heroes but with cooperation and luck, prevail against a mighty foe!

The Book Depository feels like Waterstones, again a hit-and-miss.

Is this the Leisure Games store you guys are talking about?

I am quite interested in getting some adventure paths/module subscriptions, can you guys go more into detail about what you're buying and how much it is costing you each month (or each time something gets sent out) with regards to item cost and shipping cost?

Thanks for the heads up on ISBN, unfortunately, I am hesitant to "order" from any store that cannot give me a set price and I don't want to feel obligated to buy from them later on since I "ordered" from them --- hence I am searching for a place that decently stocks Pathfinder here in the UK.

More to the point: has anyone actually been able to get any of the Pathfinder Pawns here in the UK? The website says the Bestiary Box pawns are available now, but can't find any here in the UK.

Hello guys!

I've had my eye on the PF Beginner Box for some time now and finally bought it the other day and got my hands on it today. First impression - wow!

I've read through and "played" through the demo game on the Hero's Handbook and I must say this is a very well written book, very easy to follow and understand. I am planning to play this with my two sons, aged 9 and 3 (youngest does whatever his older brother does, so he can at least roll the dice!) and my wife. However, this is the first time I will be GM-ing --- I've played CRPGs in the past such as Icewind Dale and Temple of Elemental Evil and Neverwinter Nights so I am somewhat familiar with the player-side of things. Any tips for a new GM to keep in mind? I will be tackling the GM guide tomorrow but have read a bit on the included adventure which seems to be simple enough yet still be awesome.

If things kick off and we really get into role playing, I want to keep things fun and cinematic and not too rules-heavy, so will it be advisable to get the Core Rulebook? I am worried that the stuff in it, specifically the post level-5 spells, rules, or monsters will be too much for a party that operates only on the basic rules presented in the Beginner Box. So basically, can we use the "core" books and monsters in a "extended Beginner Box rules" game? What will I need to change to make it compatible? I hope "transitioning to the full rules" is not a requirement to enjoy Pathfinder.

Next question, and I throw in the obligatory "sorry if this has been discussed before" line, what scenarios/modules (what is the right term?) would I want to look at next for my players? A quick read of other posts seems to suggest The Rise of the Runelords adventure is the most recommended, is this still true? And again, how do you think this scenario will play out with my "extended Beginner Box rules" game?

Thanks for reading, any help for a green-as-grass GM is greatly appreciated!

Amazon also stock the whole Paizo line, and is cheaper to get postage on. If you are looking for a RL shop, the Forbidden Planet chain stock them, and I have seen some in Waterstones. Probably some other local stores, but I'd have to know your rough location to tell you which ones...

Yeah, found some books in my local FP store, though again, only limited items. I think Waterstones is also a hit-and-miss. I actually found IGUK through Amazon, and they were selling the Beginner Box on their website for a few £££ cheaper.

I am in the Northeast UK, near Middlesbrough/Newcastle.

You can order direct from Paizo and they'll ship it to you, if you want. I've also had good results in the UK from Orcs Nest.

Haha... Not when they charge me $51 to ship a $31 item!

Thanks for the heads up on Orc's Nest... they're a bit more expensive and TBH I was not impressed with the website, but I'll keep an eye on these guys in the future.

Hello guys! I've just purchased the Pathfinder Beginner Box and I must say I am amazed at the quality of the product. Just read through the Hero Handbook and feel it is very easy to read and understand. I have bought this game for me and my sons to enjoy; eldest is 9 and the youngest is 3 --- old enough to roll dice!

I was wondering if anyone can help me find a reliable source of Pathfinder RPGs here in the UK. I got my box set from IGUK however they don't seem to extensively carry the Pathfinder line, specifically that new Bestiary Box. Or does the EU crowd just have their goodies a bit later?

Any help to find other stores would be appreciated. Thanks!