This is a multi-part question, as I'm still learning the ins & outs on crafting to help my party.
If you craft a magical item and increase its caster level, does this also increase the cost from the listed price? If so, by how much? If it is a magical item that casts a spell, does raising the CL increase the spell's DC and/or duration?
Example A (Benefits):
If you craft a Profane Seal Signet at caster level 12, does this gives it the full benefit of the Wrath spell and the Improved Critical feat?
If crafting at CL12, does this increase the Signet's price? Or will it remain a constant 1,500gp?
Example B (Duration):
A Ring of Invisibility starts at CL3. If you crafted it at CL10, would that mean each use of the ring's Invisibilty lasts for 10 minutes? As opposed to 3 minutes from the base ring at CL3?
And again, does raising the item's level increase the price? Or will it remain 10,000gp to craft?
Example C (Save DC & Damage):
If you craft a pair of Vampiric Gloves at CL20, does the DC to resist its Bleed spell increase? Also, does its Vampiric Touch apply the full 10d8 damage from being at max level?
Does raising the item's caster level increase its price? Or is it always 9,000gp?
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link to relevant faq
link to magic item creation
you multiply by caster level, so a 12th level CL will cost 7x more than a 5th caster level
"For example, a 3rd-level wizard with Craft Wondrous Item can create a 1st-level pearl, with a minimum caster level of 1. He can set the caster level to whatever he wants (assuming he can meet the crafting DC), though the pearl's caster level has no effect on its powers"
Everyone always cites the pearl example when referencing an item's CL, but I must be misunderstanding the language of how that pertains to the inquiry.
Same with the Magic Item creation link, which I was told only pertains to custom-made magic items, not preexisting ones.
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Same with the Magic Item creation link, which I was told only pertains to custom-made magic items, not preexisting ones.
As soon as you change something, even the caster level, it is custom made.
From what I recall of posts by SKR and FAQs (currently I am too lazy to search the citations), an item's caster level (CL) matters if it changes the effect.
With the Profane Seal Signet, changing the CL makes a difference if you reach a new milestone. When you reach CL 6, the bonus becomes +2; when you reach CL 9, it becomes +3; and when you reach CL 12, you get Improved Critical. The protection part has a completely different pricing, as it is not CL dependent, but instead is based on the cost of a ring of protection.
The math would be fairly complicated depending on what combination of effects you want (+1 protection and CL Wrath is different from +3 protection and CL 6 Wrath) but, if the GM allows custom items, it can be done.
Update: Nothing I've found (on this site or others) indicate changing the CL of stock items alters the price in any capacity. Only its overall effectiveness changes, as well as any instance where certain items produce spells that need to overcome spell resistance. The formula guide is only used when accounting for crafting a custom item from scratch. Regardless of whether the default signet is crafted at CL5 or CL20, its price remains the same.
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There's no use in the rest of us engaging further in this thread. This is the Original Poster's argument:
The item creation rules tell you how to price an item when you are creating a brand new item, but nowhere in those rules does it explicitly and exactingly say "if you raise the caster level of an existing item, the price should raise accordingly." Therefore costing rules don't apply to published items! Therefore I can make an existing item at any caster level without changing the price, and get the benefits of that higher level for free.
We all know this is wrong, but the OP desperately wants it to be true so he's not going to be swayed by reason.
There's no use in the rest of us engaging further in this thread. This is the Original Poster's argument:
The item creation rules tell you how to price an item when you are creating a brand new item, but nowhere in those rules does it explicitly and exactingly say "if you raise the caster level of an existing item, the price should raise accordingly." Therefore costing rules don't apply to published items! Therefore I can make an existing item at any caster level without changing the price, and get the benefits of that higher level for free.
I asked a legitimate question and received nothing but your fatuous condescension as a response to my inquiry. I have absolutely no issue with getting a proper answer that breaks down and explains in full the details for pricing preexisting magic items (which as a reminder, someone else already noted there are MULTIPLE stock items that are not properly matched to the formula you so desperately want to hold up as gospel).
We all know this is wrong, but the OP desperately wants it to be true so he's not going to be swayed by reason.
And once again you'd be wrong. All I am looking to do is avoid confusion and misuse of a particular game aspect. So if you have a valid answer and can point to where exactly such details are laid out, I will gladly read and incorporate them into my table's future sessions.
But given how quickly you jumped to insults, it's almost a given you cannot provide said source. So Mr. Mind Reader, I will patiently await your citation.
There is a basic principle that is probably so obvious (at least in the minds of the writers) that it might not be stated explicitly in print: "more powerful items should be more expensive."
I guess/assume that something like 99.8452% of GMs just run the game as if that were a written rule, whether or not it is (I frankly don't know and don't care enough to hunt for a citation). If you (or anyone else) don't run the game with that basic principle in place then cool, you do you.
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Source
PRPG Core Rulebook pg. 549
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Not all items adhere to these formulas. First and foremost, these few formulas aren’t enough to truly gauge the exact differences between items. The price of a magic item may be modified based on its actual worth. The formulas only provide a starting point. The pricing of scrolls assumes that, whenever possible, a wizard or cleric created it. Potions and wands follow the formulas exactly. Staves follow the formulas closely, and other items require at least some judgment calls.
Higher Caster Level = More Powerful Item = More Expensive Item.
There are no 'hard and fast' rules for Caster Level here because there are a lot of judgement calls to be made: Boosting the CL on a Ring of Invisibility does make it a better item, but most of the time no one would really notice the difference, while boosting the CL on a set of Vampiric Gloves would be a major boost to both damage inflicted, temporary HP granted, and SR penetration chances. As such, the existence and pricing of non-standard items (including 'standard' items with higher caster levels) is left up to the GM*...
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Another thing to note is that some magic items don't follow any pricing rules. A handy haversack should cost 90,000 gp because it uses a 5th level spell (5 * 9 * 2000 gp), but instead they cost 2000 gp.
The Handy Haversack doesn't use a 5th-level spell. The requirement to make one is a 5th level spell, but the effect is completely different from the effects of Secret chest.
The content of the sack isn't sent to the Ethereal plane, nor is there a risk of things being lost if left in the sack for more than 60 days.In 3.0, most of the magic items, especially the legacy items, had a vaguely pertinent spell attached to them in the construction requirements, but the requirement is often questionable.
As a requirement for Handy Haversack, Rope Trick would be more appropriate. It creates an extra dimensional space, exactly what Handy Haversack does.
The pricing rule you cite is relevant only when the effect is closely similar to the spell effect and isn't superseded by other rules, especially the "compare the price to other similar items" rule.
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Pricing New Items
The correct way to price an item is by comparing its abilities to similar items in the Core Rulebook (see Magic Item Gold Piece Values on page 549 of the Core Rulebook), and only if there are no similar items should you use the pricing formulas to determine an approximate price for the item. If you discover a loophole that allows an item to have an ability for a much lower price than is given for a comparable item in the Core Rulebook, the GM should require using the price of the Core Rulebook item, as that is the standard cost for such an effect. Most of these loopholes stem from trying to get unlimited uses per day of a spell effect from the “command word” or “useactivated or continuous” lines of Table 15–29 on page 550 of Core Rulebook.
Getting a better effect of 0 extra gp is one of those loopholes.
Profane signet, C§L 12, adds the effect of casting Wrath 1/day at CL 12 while "subtracting" the effect of casting Wrath 1/day at CL 5.
Wrath is a 1th level spell, so the theoretical cost would be 1,800(command word) *1 (spell level) *5 (CL) /5 (1 daily use) = 1,800.
At CL 12 it would become 1,800(command word) *1 (spell level) *12 (CL) /5 (1 daily use) = 4,320, increasing the cost of the ring by 2,520 gp.
Still a bargain, as it essentially gives the effect of Keen Edge, a 3rd level spell, for 1 minute, on any kind of weapon, not only edged ones.