What Spells don't have Manipulate?


Advice

Grand Lodge

So, yeah, the subject is the question:
Which spells, as of the Remaster, don't have the Manipulate Trait?

Anyone got a list or something of the spells without the trait? Because that new Magus Hybrid Study that will be coming in Rival Academies has got me in a Gish mood.


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Arcane spells that don't have Manipulate trait.

It probably doesn't include legacy spells that would also not provoke when cast directly.

Edit: Or it might instead be including legacy spells that would provoke because no legacy spells include the Manipulate trait. I'm sure someone can fix that bug in my search criteria. It's late and I am going to bed.

Grand Lodge

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Finoan wrote:

Arcane spells that don't have Manipulate trait.

It probably doesn't include legacy spells that would also not provoke when cast directly.

Edit: Or it might instead be including legacy spells that would provoke because no legacy spells include the Manipulate trait. I'm sure someone can fix that bug in my search criteria. It's late and I am going to bed.

...I had no idea Nethys could actually exclude things form searches. Thanks for sharing two big pieces of knowledge, Finoan.

Also, can confirm it's the later, as it is showing spells from "Secrets of Magic", "Dark Archives", and "Firebrands" at least.


If you are playing as elf there's Elemental Wrath too.

It allows to cast the old Acid Splash but with the energy damage of your choice and without somatic (manipulate) part.

It's just in a bit grey zone if it will still uses the Acid Splash as basis or if switch to Caustic Blast. You have to talk with your GM to decide. Each version has its advantages and disadvantage for remastered magus. But both won't trigger manipulate reactions.


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Here is an improved list that excludes both manipulate trait (for remastered spells) and somatic components (for legacy spells):

Arcane spells without manipulate traits or somatic components


Mortimer Houghton wrote:

Here is an improved list that excludes both manipulate trait (for remastered spells) and somatic components (for legacy spells):

Arcane spells without manipulate traits or somatic components

You actually have to also exclude spells with a material component or focus. they both have identical language. (the only example I see is befitting attire which has material and verbal but not somatic).

Material Components CRB p. 303 wrote:
A material component is a bit of physical matter consumed in the casting of the spell. The spell gains the manipulate trait and requires you to have a free hand to retrieve and manipulate a material component.

In remaster they replaced focus with loci. It has similar language as above about having a free hand but it does not say the spell gains the manipulate trait.

Arcane Spells without Manipulate traits, or somatic/material/focus components


YuriP wrote:

If you are playing as elf there's Elemental Wrath too.

It allows to cast the old Acid Splash but with the energy damage of your choice and without somatic (manipulate) part.

It's just in a bit grey zone if it will still uses the Acid Splash as basis or if switch to Caustic Blast. You have to talk with your GM to decide. Each version has its advantages and disadvantage for remastered magus. But both won't trigger manipulate reactions.

I'm not sure what you are getting at. Both Acid Splash and Caustic Blast have somatic/manipulate.


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Kelseus wrote:
YuriP wrote:

If you are playing as elf there's Elemental Wrath too.

It allows to cast the old Acid Splash but with the energy damage of your choice and without somatic (manipulate) part.

It's just in a bit grey zone if it will still uses the Acid Splash as basis or if switch to Caustic Blast. You have to talk with your GM to decide. Each version has its advantages and disadvantage for remastered magus. But both won't trigger manipulate reactions.

I'm not sure what you are getting at. Both Acid Splash and Caustic Blast have somatic/manipulate.

Elemntal Wrath removes the somatic component (and thus the manipulate trait nested in it) from acid splash. RAW there's nothing that let's you replace acid splash with caustic blast, though. In a home game, you can argue for spirit successors replacing their original versions, but that's entirely GM discretion. In, say, PFS, though, you are stuck with your (modified) acid splash, for good or ill.


Squark wrote:
Elemntal Wrath removes the somatic component (and thus the manipulate trait nested in it) from acid splash. RAW there's nothing that let's you replace acid splash with caustic blast, though. In a home game, you can argue for spirit successors replacing their original versions, but that's entirely GM discretion. In, say, PFS, though, you are stuck with your (modified) acid splash, for good or ill.

I never noticed that.


Squark wrote:
Kelseus wrote:
YuriP wrote:

If you are playing as elf there's Elemental Wrath too.

It allows to cast the old Acid Splash but with the energy damage of your choice and without somatic (manipulate) part.

It's just in a bit grey zone if it will still uses the Acid Splash as basis or if switch to Caustic Blast. You have to talk with your GM to decide. Each version has its advantages and disadvantage for remastered magus. But both won't trigger manipulate reactions.

I'm not sure what you are getting at. Both Acid Splash and Caustic Blast have somatic/manipulate.
Elemntal Wrath removes the somatic component (and thus the manipulate trait nested in it) from acid splash. RAW there's nothing that let's you replace acid splash with caustic blast, though. In a home game, you can argue for spirit successors replacing their original versions, but that's entirely GM discretion. In, say, PFS, though, you are stuck with your (modified) acid splash, for good or ill.

In the case of magus is for good once Acid Splash is a spell that uses attack roll while Caustic Blast uses basic reflex save. So you can take the advantage of faster proficiency progression of martial proficiency and use the weapon item bonus to hit.

Grand Lodge

YuriP wrote:
Squark wrote:
Kelseus wrote:
YuriP wrote:

If you are playing as elf there's Elemental Wrath too.

It allows to cast the old Acid Splash but with the energy damage of your choice and without somatic (manipulate) part.

It's just in a bit grey zone if it will still uses the Acid Splash as basis or if switch to Caustic Blast. You have to talk with your GM to decide. Each version has its advantages and disadvantage for remastered magus. But both won't trigger manipulate reactions.

I'm not sure what you are getting at. Both Acid Splash and Caustic Blast have somatic/manipulate.
Elemntal Wrath removes the somatic component (and thus the manipulate trait nested in it) from acid splash. RAW there's nothing that let's you replace acid splash with caustic blast, though. In a home game, you can argue for spirit successors replacing their original versions, but that's entirely GM discretion. In, say, PFS, though, you are stuck with your (modified) acid splash, for good or ill.
In the case of magus is for good once Acid Splash is a spell that uses attack roll while Caustic Blast uses basic reflex save. So you can take the advantage of faster proficiency progression of martial proficiency and use the weapon item bonus to hit.

...Except Elemental Wrath is legacy content.

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