Each d6 is a point, the roll determines where it goes. So, if everyone rolls 10d6, everyone got 10 point buy points.
Now, higher stats require multiple points, if you have dice that rolled for a stat with more than enough for one score but not enough for the next higher score, those dice can either be shifted around, left alone so less points are needed to improve those scores from leveling up (admittedly specific my rules for this campaign), or if a few player choice points were allocated, then the player can allocate them to finish paying for the next higher stat.
In the end though, each die represents a single point buy point, NOT a full +1 to the score.
Example,
A player might roll this,
1s, 6
2s, 3
3s, 4
4s, 5
5s, 4
6s, 4
So strength is 8 plus six point buy, a score of 14.
Dex gets 3, con gets 4, etc.
Final scores: 14,11,12,13,12,12, a 26 point buy spread.
(As a note each point increase costs one point buy until you buy a 15 or higher, so it matters only if you get more than six dice to one score, which didn’t happen here. But if say, 7 dice landed on strength, that would be a 14 with an extra point that could be shifted to dex or con.
Ok so for example we have settled on 26 points, if we were to then roll would it look something like this:
1 Str 8+5 points 13
2 Dex 8+6 points 14
3 Con 8+5 points 14
4 Int 8+3 points 11
5 Wis 8+2 points 10
6 Cha 8+5 points 13
This might have the inverse problem of not swingy enough. Gonna run a few rounds to see what comes up.
1 Str 8+2 points 10
2 Dex 8+2 points 10
3 Con 8+6 points 14
4 Int 8+4 points 12
5 Wis 8+6 points 14
6 Cha 8+6 points 14
1 Str 8+6 points 14
2 Dex 8+3 points 11
3 Con 8+6 points 14
4 Int 8+2 points 10
5 Wis 8+7 points 14 one floating
6 Cha 8+2 points 10
1 Str 8+4 points 12
2 Dex 8+5 points 13
3 Con 8+3 points 11
4 Int 8+4 points 12
5 Wis 8+8 points 15
6 Cha 8+2 points 10
This might have the inverse problem of not swingy enough. Gonna run a few rounds to see what comes up.
** spoiler omitted **
Personally I think it works as is wonderfully for NPCs.
For PCs though, I had considered setting aside say 5 points, just for this reason. A player could give themselves a great score, remove all the “too low” scores, or boost a couple more important ones.
But the point is, these sets you rolled are A) all equal point buy, B) random or mostly random which can work for inspiration as well as being one of those “figure out how to work with what you got things,” and C) they look much more reasonable and plausible for actual people.
An alternative though, is to mix this method with the boon/bane method, select one score to be high, one to be low, then use this method with D4s to build the remaining scores.
There are tons of variations that can address various player concerns. In fact, our other brought up the only concern that simply can’t be addressed by any of my suggestions, a feeling of control. That’s a complicated subject that does not in fact require complete god-like control to resolve, but that’s a whole different topic.
Ok so moving past stat generation
Skills seem to be generated apart from class so are there no more class/cross-class skills?
Class skills just raise the skill rank cap by one, so they do still exist but it’s a more subtle thing than standard 3.x.
So feats, classes, spells and stuff are from 3.5Yes, or supposed to be anyway. Not sure where unchained rogue is coming from. Only one other player so I might allow the PF1 classes if everyone would prefer and there is good reason to like them.Sorry, spazz'ed... guess a Rogue? Or are we going further back... Thief?
I get confused around that switch to Unearthed Arcana >>> Pathfinder era. And if that makes no sense, it proves my point :)
How is your character coming along? Care to share what you have so far?
I didn’t previously think your point about going to thief was serious, but if it is, nope, we are using core 3.5 as a base plus my alterations, with some freedom to bring in a limited amount of stuff beyond that.
Ok next question Hit Die and Save, do we only receive HD and saves from class levels or do we receive them otherwise?
Also, human's additional skill points is that still every level?
HD is equal to Physical Power (Which is equal to Mundane Power unless you have a bonus specifically to physical power). Mundane Power starts at 1. The HD classes provide in the base rules still have some influence on the size of your HD.
Base Save bonuses still come from class levels but are halved. This is because Power is added to saves as well. (Note to self, mention the generally static roll bonuses under the stat descriptions)
Also, human's additional skill points is that still every level?
Yes. Keep in mind, skills don’t get more than one skillpoint per lvl.
Yes. Keep in mind, skills don’t get more than one skillpoint per lvl.Also, human's additional skill points is that still every level?
So... humans get twice as many skill points? 1 + 1 for being human (every level) or just every third level like with the INT modifier?
Everyone gets six skill points as a base, but they can only put one skill point in any particular skill each level. Or put another way, you can increase six skills by one skillpoint each level. Humans get an additional skillpoint and can thus increase seven skills by one point each level.
I phrased it differently in the document in an attempt to be clear on that. Basically it prevents players from dumping all their skill points into one skill.
With weapons now being tied to skills, how do feats like exotic weapon proficiency, weapon focus, weapon specialization ect work out?
So, when you say 8 ranks is fluency in a language... You mean 36 skill points?
Effectively, you must be level 36 to become fluent in a language?
Also, of you could give a skill point cost for increasing a base skill and specializing, that would be great. I'm not clear on specializing cost.
===============
Thought I'd posted this, a week ago... LOL
Not from the poles, half way to the equator.
Perfectly human with Low-Light Vision and Darkvision. It makes him the perfect sentinel or outrider.
10/10/12/13/13/15
10/10/13/14/13/15, +1 Int (level 2) | +1 Dex (level 5)
45 skill points, 36 +1 (level 1), +2 (level 4) from Int?
3 Athletics 2 (+2)
3 Acrobatics 1 (+2)
6 Perception 3 (+4)
2 Investigation 1 (+2)
3 Speech 2 (+4)
4 Bows 2 (+2)
4 Light Blades 2 (+2)
6 Dodge 3 (+3)
3 Handle Animal 2 (+4)
1 Ride 1 (+1)
6 Stealth 3 (+3)
3 Survival 2 (+3)
1 Use Complex Device (+1)
Feats: Combat Expertise (level 3), Improved Feint (level 6)
Class: Rogue 1 (level 6)
Saves: F +0 | R +2 | W +1
Alignment: LG
Well, I’m getting plenty of areas where my document needs restructured and clarified. :)
With weapons now being tied to skills, how do feats like exotic weapon proficiency, weapon focus, weapon specialization ect work out?
Proficiency basically was a matter of whether you count as trained with a weapon. But if you have a rank in a skill, then you are trained in that skill and if you have no ranks then you are not trained. Thus with a weapon, you are proficient with it if you have a skill rank that you would apply to rolls to use that weapon. Implicitly this means the proficiency feats don’t anything anymore, but proficiency as a term may still be used, such as in feat requirements, in which case, if you would add at least one skill rank to a normal roll for using a weapon (aka, the weapon is part of a weapon group you have the skill for or you just straight up specialized in that weapon), then you are proficient in that weapon. I will add it to my list of things to change in the document to address them explicitly.
So, when you say 8 ranks is fluency in a language... You mean 36 skill points?
Yea, but A) poor wording perhaps but that is supposed to be fluent like a native speaker not only in understanding words and sentences but catching all the little things a native speaker would find odd despite being a valid sentence or phrase, and B) it is one of the imperfections of the system. No matter how a system is designed, you will get artifacts that seem not right. This is one of them and if it ever comes up I’d make some rulings, but it doesn’t seem worth it to me (as things stand now anyway) to add complication to improve it. That may always change of course, but remember, mechanics are guidelines not binding contracts.
Also, of you could give a skill point cost for increasing a base skill and specializing, that would be great. I'm not clear on specializing cost.
3 points increase Perception to 2 ranks. It would cost 3 more points to increase Perception to rank 3, but only 2 points to increase Spot to rank 1.
Thus, +3 Perception would be 6 skillpoints.
And +3 Spot (+2 Perception with +1 Spot) would be 5 skillpoints.
Now imagine you have 2 ranks in Perception and specialized in both Spot and Listen getting a +1 each. This would cost 7 ranks total. Next, consider raising Perception to +3.
Well, it matters the order in which ranks are purchased.
If you have 3 Perception and +1 Spot and +1 Listen, the order you bought ranks matters. If bought Perception 2 first, then Spot and Listen, then bought Perception 3, that’s 10 points, but buying perception 3, then Spot and Listen is 12 points.
But there is value in a unified cost so it doesn’t matter what order the ranks are bought in. To achieve this, I add the additional rule that the cost to improve should always be the cost it would be if you bought all the base ranks (Perception in this case) first before buying the Specializations, and use that as the cost needed to improve rank, thus Perception 3, Spot 1 and Listen 1 will always cost 12 points no matter what order you bought ranks.
Specializing is cheaper in the short term or if you rarely improve the base skill. But if you are trying to get max ranks of a skill, it’ll cost the same in the end, but you have some strategy about how to get there.
Your game is such a deeply, fundamentally hacked version of 3.5 that I'm having a great deal of difficulty absorbing it from the point of view of '3.5 with the following adjustments...' The whole 3d6-plus-dramatically-more-incremental-advancement thing, plus combat ability being moved to skills and there being defense skills, plus magic being strongly tied to a fatigue mechanic, reminds me very strongly of GURPS to the extent that I wonder whether you might just want to run a GURPS Dungeon Fantasy game and not know it yet.
I’ve played gurps and it is the only other system that comes close to what I like about 3.5. And while it does a few things better, such as how you can build powers, I still like 3.5 better overall.
In the end, I’m creating my own system completely. Two in fact. One that is completely ground up and a second that is like something between my system and 3.5.
My current set of rules here are hacks to 3.5 because I’m trying to leverage the existing material and work to make it easier to get more testing of my ideas. It’s not really intended to be the permanent set of mechanics for all time. Thus the hacky nature of it.
Do you have a version of your Player's Guide that has some of the more heavily hacked rules rewritten with your version from the ground up, maybe with some examples- like an instance of a full character sheet of a legal starting character?
Not at the moment. That is a lot of typing, especially as I’m using a phone, hence me trying to leverage the existing 3.5 material.
I can work on getting better write ups as needed, but it’ll be a slow process. And I am obviously going to focus on the parts most in need.
How do 3.5 feats and PrCs with level, CL, skill-rank, or other prerequisites interact with your new system?
How does multiclassing work?
Clearly I need to clarify that better, but it is in the write up. (Better organization is on my to do list)
Character and class level use Power instead for most things. Exceptions should be rare enough to handle with rulings and common sense. A feat requiring fighter lvl 3 for example, would obviously still require fighter class levels because it doesn’t make sense otherwise.
Is it your intent that all 3.5 material, like Incarnum and Binders and Swordsages and stuff, is open to PCs, subject to your adjustments? Or are you envisioning it more along the lines of '3.5 SRD plus my stuff'?
Core rules plus my alterations, though I am open to include a small amount of other stuff on an ad hoc basis if a player is looking for something specific, but primarily core rules.
When you say that 'Circumstance modifiers will usually be advantage rather than flat +/- 2.', are you just talking about stuff that grants core-rules circumstance bonii, or are you taking a 5e approach where most sources of static modifiers will be Advantage/Disadvantage instead?
Just circumstance bonuses, and familiarity bonuses. But it is there for rulings as well and a general tool. But the largely the existing bonuses otherwise not affected by my changes will still be the same as they were, static bonuses.
Do kinds of magic that don't work on a Vancian spell-slot system, like shadowcasting or psionics or invocations, still cost fatigue points?
The fatigue system is the base system. All magic goes through that unless otherwise noted.
Now, being core rules and a homebrew setting, shadowcasting and invocations are unavailable entirely.
Psionics exist, but no mechanical options are available for using those right now. in any case, they are more of an alternate use of magic, and thus, like arcane magic, use fatigue primarily with a few special techniques to get past the limitations of fatigue.
Ok so first level my human fighter gets 8 skill points (6 base + 1 human + int) I spend them thusly, one point each:
Ride, intimidate, knowledge nobility, Athletics, Swords, Deflection, Specialization Bastard sword, perception.
All would be Rank 1, except Spec Bastard sword
At level 2 I increase all but Athletics
Spec Bastard sword increases to Rank 1 (2 points)
Athletics remains at Rank 1 (1 points)
All others remain at Rank 1 (2 points)
And if I were to attack with a Bastard Sword I would get to combine my ranks?
Specialization and base skill stack. However, specializations are capped at half the base skill and anything applying bonuses treat the specialization and base skill as a single skill, so you don’t get double the ability modifier etc. Because specializations are capped at half the base skill (basically a specialization can add up to 50% of the base ranks), you need Heavy Blades rank 2 to get Bastard swords to rank 1.
The weapon groups are the ones from 3.5 Unearthed Arcana, you can find the list here.
Also, note that single handed use of bastard swords still counts as exotic, so an extra skill point per rank for that (better than needing a feat, yes?) should you take that route.
So one handed bastard sword specialization would cost 3 points for rank 1
So one handed bastard sword specialization would cost 3 points for rank 1
If your Heavy Swords skill was rank 2, yes.
You would probably be better off taking Exotic Heavy Blades as a base skill if you wanted to go in that direction from the beginning of your build, or if you didn’t already have heavy blades. But if you had heavy blades and decided you also wanted just the one exotic use, then doing it that way works.
Exotic Heavy Blades is a base skill for all the exotic weapons in the heavy blade category.
Sorry I took so long. I thought I already posted this answer and hadn’t seen any other responses yet.
ok i fully don't get it, can someone help?Example,
A player might roll this,
26d61s, 6
2s, 3
3s, 4
4s, 5
5s, 4
6s, 4So strength is 8 plus six point buy, a score of 14.
Dex gets 3, con gets 4, etc.
Final scores: 14,11,12,13,12,12, a 26 point buy spread.(As a note each point increase costs one point buy until you buy a 15 or higher, so it matters only if you get more than six dice to one score, which didn’t happen here. But if say, 7 dice landed on strength, that would be a 14 with an extra point that could be shifted to dex or con.
Don’t worry too much. Early on I suggested a few options for generating scores, but that was settled to be just standard point buy, the 3.5 version with 26 points.
We were discussing the system though as a point of interest. If you are still interested, I can give an explanation later. If all you are worried about is making a character, just use 26 points to point buy.
At the moment, I’ll try getting some posts up this week to show the building on an example character.
Can I play a Warmage?
You could, but you’d only get the core rulebook spells, and need to find or “invent” any others.
I wouldn’t recommend it, but it is a viable option for bring in a supplement choice.
Just make sure you consider how the other rule changes affect things. For example, to wear armor, you’ll be spending skillpoints on that, which will be reducing spell failure chance anyway. The Edge ability is still good if you really want to focus on that damage, but I don’t do 15-minute work days so keep that in mind.
I'm not sure what the following means: "I don’t do 15-minute work days so keep that in mind."
is there like a replacement for removal of armor based on type...like adding mage armor.
I'd like to play it 'cuzz it's cool to play. I won't know how it interrelates to your new rules, Untill, I build it 3.5 then translate....but I was hoping for you to help me to fit it in. If it's to hard to do, then please let me know early.
The 15-minute workday is an old argument about how players would face only one encounter and then in complete safety rest up before the next encounter. This was a done, and a problem, because it allowed players to use what are supposed to be limited resources for several encounters all in one encounter for every encounter.
Because some groups just accepted the 15-minute workday, some would build characters that focused on blowing through all their spell slots and per day abilities in every encounter and that allowed them to turn spike damage into an every attack thing instead of it being used only at key moments.
It is one of the things my rule changes are trying to address, but how I run the also matters. For example, the world does not pause when the party goes to sleep, so things might attack you at night, especially in dungeons or when facing a large group of enemies.
The armor thing will be more clear with the example character build.
As for working in the warmage, it won’t be an issue, but I noticed a lot of non-core spells which is why I wanted to warn you that it would be core only spells.
I don't think that I'm autistic enough to understand this.
It’s one of those things that is quite simple when you get it, but hard to describe.
I’ll be including examples in the example character build.
Example Character Creation
Step 1: Concept
A young mage named Treeka with a talent for magic, but looking to be a delver has trained with a sword on her own time. She is from a small town and learns magic from a hedge witch nearby her town. She had to spend a lot of time helping her family with the bakery shop until her aunt come to live with them and helped out, giving her enough time to try to take on the local dungeon. Alignment is leaning heavily towards lawful since she needs the discipline and self-control to balance two such disparate and taxing elements of her life, plus the occasional self training with a wooden sword.
Race should generally be considered with ability scores because, as an example, an orc wouldn't really gain much strength from being a soldier as their natural strength allows them to rely on inherent strength to ba able to carry everything without tiring and fighting with full gear, while a human would need to spend time building up their strength.
In this case, Treeka is a kobold, but thankfully with all her time in the bakery, she managed to build up her strength, becoming decently strong, for a kobold.
With 26 points, I buy this array,
12,12,10,14,12,14
-4,+2,-2 apply Racial modifiers
8,14,8,14,12,14 and this gives her scores at level 1
Treeka is swift and lithe but like all kobolds weak and frail, though she is certainly stronger than most kobolds are. She is also smart and willful which has helped her greatly in studying magic despite spending much of her time helping out around the family bakery.
We are making Treeka as an adult character on the cusp of starting out on her own and no longer being a mere apprentice (what in normal DnD is called a level 1 character).
There is no class that really represents a mix of tradesman and mage (and while her swordsmanship is better than no skill, it still lacks formal training and isn't significant enough for a class level), but as there are no classes with tradesman related class abilities anyway, we can take a class for being a mage and represent the baker trade with skillpoints.
Her magic was learned from a hedge witch in the evenings, so her magic is learned with a spellbook and formulaic spells, though the spells she learned are varied and do not follow a central theme like might be learned from formal schooling, so I'll give her the wizard class as a universalist since she has learned a broad variety of spells across schools.
Wizard can be of any alignment, HD is a d4 which I'll note for later, and we can ignore the skillpoints and proficiencies since those are handled by the modified rules. The skill list is still notable though, as class skills have their skill rank cap raised by one. She gets only Will as a good save.
Thus Treeka has the Summon Familiar and Scribe Scroll abilities. In this case, to better fit the thematics of learning from a hedge witch, her "scrolls" are flavored as small fetishes, little bundles of herbs and goop and such wrapped to look like tiny dolls dressed in leaves and cloth with some writing on the cloth.
She has a spellbook labeled recipes, and is smaller to suit her small size and thus has half as many pages as a normal spellboook.
She gets all the common cantrips, but we'll choose master spells later.
Tier
As a PC, she gets to start with a Tier of 2.
Power
Power starts at one. Mundane and Magical power are subdivisions of Power, and physical/mental powers are subdivisions of mundane power. Just like how skills and saves can have conditional bonuses that only apply sometimes, the same is true of the Power stat, but making names for these certain uses of Power makes it much easier to handle conditional bonuses and determine when they apply. For example, a bonus to physical power starts with Power but applies only when Power is used for the character's physical capabilities, such as the Fort save or when abilities that are based on Power grant a bonus to Jump.
HD
Treeka only has 1 HD due to her Physical Power being 1 (her Power is one and no bonuses that only apply to Mundane or Physical Power).
Her only class is a wizard which sizes HD at a D4, so the size of her HD is a D4.
Fatigue
Treeka has a Con of 8, so every 8 points of Fatigue is a benchmark where she gains a stagger point.
Since Mundane Power is 1 (Power of 1 with no bonuses specific to Mundane Power), we take 1 and add 1 for a total of 2. Thus when Treeka gets 2 benchmarks of Fatigue, she gains the actual condition "Fatigued." At twice as many benchmarks, she gains the actual "Exhausted" condition.
If she casts magic or a similar large drain on her fatigue from using abilities, and it is higher than a certain amount, she will need to roll to remain conscious. The amount she can handle without a save is Magical power plus Cha modifier. (the DC for such a check if she did spend more than that many fatigue would be 10+the fatigue cost).
Benchmark: 8
Fatigued: 2 benchmarks
Exhausted: 4 benchmarks
Max fatigue cost without rolling a save: 3.
BAB
No longer exists, so we ignore it.
Saves
Her only good save is Will, and while she leans heavily towards law, she isn't exactly an extremist, so no good concentration save (I set the alignment as the determinant for a good concentration save as it made the most sense without going class-by-class to add it in).
Thus,
Fort 0 = 1 (physical power) + 0 (1/3 from class) -1(con)
Ref 3 = 1 (physical power) + 0 (1/3 from class) +2 (dex)
Will 4 = 1 (Mental power) + 0 (1/2 from class) +2 (good save) + 1 (wis)
Conc 1 = 1 (Mental power) + 0 (1/3 poor save) +2 (cha)
Size
Small, based on race, +/- 1 or sometimes +/- 4
Gaining levels has a three level cycle of something extra gained each level, and our starting characters are starting at level 6.
At first level gain extra skillpoints based on the Int modifier.
At second level, gain an ability score improvement point.
At third level, gain a feat.
Repeat these as levels are gained, thus fourth is skills, fifth is ability point, and sixth is a feat.
Sixth level is also when the first class level is technically gained, but we already picked it out.
So, for each level, I get to pick six skills, and at first level and fourth level I get to pick an extra two skills (because of my int modifier). Each of the skills chosen each level get one skillpoint that level.
I get a feat at 2nd and 5th level, which is pretty much as expected though skill focus is different from the book. I took Negotiator because in helping out at the family bakery, she often had to go buy supplies and deal with people in a business sense. Then I chose Spell Mastery since she wasn't expecting to get a spellbook from the hedge witch that trained her, since spellbooks are really really expensive, so she learned spells from her teacher's book well enough to not need a book to prepare them.
As for ability score increases, starting with your initial scores, they cost the same as skill ranks to improve, so since strength starts at 8 and dex starts at 14, it would take 6 points to turn that 8 into 11, or 6 points to turn that 14 into 17. I chose constitution for Treeka as her lifestyle is certainly tiring and would build up her endurance.
Thus:
Skills:
1st: Acrobatics, Athletics, Combat (Light Blades), Handle Animal, Trade (Baker), Magic (Abjuration), Magic (Evocation), Magic (Conjuration)
2nd: Acrobatics, Athletics, Handle Animal, Trade (Baker), Trade (Magecraft), Magic (Abjuration)
3rd: Acrobatics, Athletics, Handle Animal, Trade (Baker), Trade (Magecraft), Magic (Evocation)
4th: Perception, Speech, Trade (Baker), Trade (Magecraft), Magic (Abjuration), Magic (Evocation), Combat (Light Blades), Magic (Conjuration)
5th: Perception, Speech, Trade (Baker), Trade (Magecraft), Magic (Conjuration), Combat (Light Blades)
6th: Perception, Speech, Stealth, Trade (Baker), Trade (Magecraft), Trade (Apocathery)
Feats
3rd: Negotiator
6th: Spell Mastery
Ability score Increases:
2nd: Constitution
5th: Constitution
For reference:
Skill list:
Appraise
Acrobatics
Athletics
Combat
Handle Animal
Investigation
Know Language
Knowledge
Linguistics
Magic
Mechanics
Perception
Ride
Sleight of Hand
Speech
Stealth
Survival
Trade
Use Complex Device
Magic Schools:
Abjuration
Conjuration
Divination
Enchantment
Evocation
Necromancy
Portation
Transmutation
Advanced Magic Schools:
Calling
Charm
Compulsion
Creation
Ethermancy
Figment
Glamer
Pattern
Phantasm
Shadow
Summoning
Telepathy
Teleportation
Temporamancy
This is what I got done so far, have a look.
I realized that having needed to explain the skill specialization cost multiple times, that I should probably take that as a sign that I need to simplify.
On my drive to work, I realized exactly how I could do that with minimal fuss. So after I’m done with work today, I’ll put that up. Hopefully that will make things easier and better overall.
Note: You’ll notice I don’t have any specializations in the example character. I originally intended to post am example of doing that next, as advancing the character. Thus nothing has changed with making the example character.
Hi,
This is getting more complex than my brain is capable of handling. Thanks for your attention. Good game guys
I was just realizing I need to fix that. Sorry to see you go, but have fun.
The simplified version makes it a bit faster to hit the max ranks and specialization ranks, but it’s simpler.
Specialization ranks cost have nothing to do with base skill ranks. Thus the first rank of a specialization costs the same regardless of whether the base skill is at 2 ranks or 20.
However, Specialization ranks have double the cost of buying base skill ranks. So the first rank of a specialization costs 2 points, the second costs 4, etc. This helps how quickly ranks can be achieved a bit and makes Specialization more of a later build thing to improve ranks. Specialization ranks are still capped to half the base skill ranks.
I saw a video recently which gave me an idea for handling the new rules being many and possibly confusing… don’t tell the players the mechanics. Seems crazy at first, but the point of the mechanics is to model the world, not be a game unto themselves. One of the big things I seek is for players to make judgements like they do in the real world, and the video pointed out that simply having all the mechanics there leads people to establish expectations based on the mechanics instead of thinking in-character and establishing expectations the same way we do in the real world. Personally, I find myself an odd one out as I use the mechanics more as a language to describe the world yet still base my expectations on the world, not the mechanics.
Yet in this recruitment, there has been a lot of hesitancy based on expectations of mechanics, and that’s not really the desired outcome.
Thus, I figure I’m going to use the mechanics in the background, and have only a small number of mechanics shown to the players, such as the ability scores, and the skill list but just the points put into them rather than the actual bonus. Then play primarily through narrative description more like a freeform or rules light game, but with the mechanics in the background to keep things consistent, and to still allow dice rolls for many things, but many of the bonuses and penalties are handled on my end. Over time, I can slowly reveal mechanics one or two at a time to players, if they even have any interest in knowing.
Thus idea would allow things to just start quicker as well.
Thoughts? If you are still around, I think you are the only one, I think I’m going to make a new recruitment just for this simplified format, and you can join that, or if you still want to dig into the mechanics I can finish building your sheet and we can play with you learning the mechanics as we go.
Actually I thought you were gone, but you’re still welcome.
When it comes to rules though, I find the many times how hard they are often depends more on things other than the rules themselves, things like presentation, familiarity with similar concepts, and not least are the things that are easier to do than to explain. Thaco for example isn’t complicated, but it’s so different from what most deal with, that it seems complicated. There is another example, of a guy who came up with a dice mechanic that received a lot of bad feedback, complaints of how it was overly complicated, until the creator mentioned that it was basically a blackjack mechanic. Simply presenting this idea the others were familiar with turned many of them into supporters, because simply changing the way they looked at the mechanic made it seem way simpler and easier for them even there was no change in the mechanic itself.
A warmage though isn’t really a glass cannon. First of all, for actually soldiers, magic is more about buffs and utility, and attack magic a sidearm equivalent or a specialist situational attack, not a normal attack.
Sure you might get through a simple ambush attacking with magic, but any kind of longer term deal, like soldiers fighting in a war or more relevant to PCs, delving a dungeon, you can be a mage but you still need to keep in mind the resources. In my campaign, a first level character can cast plenty more magic than a standard dnd character, but it’s still not something they can do endlessly. It is more exhausting than melee.
Second, warmages are supposed to be a blend of a wizard and a fighter, not artillery, hence being able to cast in armor and such.
I think the actual class was meant to help those wanting to be casters but feeling overwhelmed by choosing spells to not worry about spell choice in character building, but that’s much less of a problem here as I am keeping things limited to the core books with only a few specific exceptions.
Thus I’m concerned that your expectations for playing a warwizard might not pan out as you expect in play.
Do you think you can describe what your character is and does without mechanics? And I don’t mean a simple gimmick like being a glass cannon, I mean something a bit more in depth.
Hello! I started out playing 3.5e D&D, and I love it still! I'm also a fan of the old-school, traditional dungeon-crawl (I enjoy reading modules from original D&D and AD&D).
If recruitments are still open, I'd be extremely interested in this game!
I'll try to come up with a concept by tonight and work out the basics.
Just checking, am I correct that this is using 3.5 rules?
This is Vellimir's concept, so far.
Araddun Copperblade, a dwarven mage known for his expertise in the healing arts, lives in the quaint village of Stonehollow, where he serves as the local healer and hedge mage. His services, though highly effective, come at a steep price, driven by his inherent dwarven greed. Over time, this insatiable desire for wealth grew stronger, leading Araddun to abandon the comforts of village life and become a delver. Now, he ventures into perilous dungeons, seeking the riches his blood compels him to acquire, all while utilizing his healing skills to survive the treacherous depths and ensure his continued pursuit of fortune.
Just checking, am I correct that this is using 3.5 rules?
Heavily modified, but recently decided to keep most of the mechanics behind the GM screen. Though if you read the document I linked in the OP post, you’ll get an idea of just how modified it is.
The basics are there though, so you’ll still get to roll dice from time to time and the basic combat structure will seem mostly the same to you even without seeing all the mechanics in play.
I’ve always seen the role of mechanics as being for communication, consistency, and adding risk without the gm deciding whether those risks pan out or not, plus dice can be fun. Except for communication, the mechanics don’t actually need to be seen by the players for any of that, and well, players tend to not use mechanics in any of these ways these days anyway.
This is mostly so I can see how these concepts work anyway, so keeping things out of sight allows me to make adjustments as needed without affecting the players, and also keep players focused on the world and not on their character sheet.
I am also looking to run this on discord so I can include a coworker in the game. Wasn’t my original plan, but once they expressed interest, I decided to go that way.
This is Vellimir's concept, so far.
Araddun Copperblade, a dwarven mage known for his expertise in the healing arts, lives in the quaint village of Stonehollow, where he serves as the local healer and hedge mage. His services, though highly effective, come at a steep price, driven by his inherent dwarven greed. Over time, this insatiable desire for wealth grew stronger, leading Araddun to abandon the comforts of village life and become a delver. Now, he ventures into perilous dungeons, seeking the riches his blood compels him to acquire, all while utilizing his healing skills to survive the treacherous depths and ensure his continued pursuit of fortune.
Seems good.
If you are fine with joining a discord game, buy stats (26 point buy, 3.5 rules), and pick six skills to be full invested in.
You can also trade one full skill for two moderately trained skills, or for six apprentice level skills.
You’ll need skills to cast spells, one for each school of magic you intend to use.
You also need to buy equipment, standard 3.5 rules will suffice.