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From what we've heard, Vanguard is unlikely to be a base class in the SF2e core rulebook. We know what six of the base classes are (soldier, mystic, envoy, operative, witchwarper, solarian) and while we don't know exactly how many classes they'll have at launch, I wouldn't hold my breath for the vanguard.
That said, though - like nanocyte, it is one of the cooler, newer, and "entirely Starfinder" classes, with its own identity and flavour, disconnected from existing PF/D&D classes! Thematically, it's kinda ascetic and esoteric with a focus on the physical form, which is certainly monk-ish, but - the "role" the class plays in combat is more like a tank/melee obstacle. In 1e, at least, it excels at protecting itself and allies. In that vein, it is not unlike a paladin/champion? I think it's got its own unique flavour and identity, though - but, if anything, that makes it more likely to be published in 2e sooner rather than later, since the StarFriends have specifically said they want SF2e classes to all have their own unique niches and themes, rather than just be "existing PF/D&D class In Space."
Being a specialist against certain environments sounds cool, but in my experience, those options are very niche picks. Like if you have to choose specific things to be good against (as with, say, Environmental Adaptation) then you'll either rarely use them, or you're in a tightly focused campaign, in which case it'll come up all the time and be overpowered. On the other hand, if you, say, have the ability to change what environments you're good against, then you'd be able to just always have it apply, in which case, why not just make it a flat "+2 against Environmental effects and hazards." I dunno, maybe there's something there - I'd worry about it sounding too much like a Ranger, though.
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SF2 is already giving me back my beloved 4e Warlords with Envoys, so the 2e Vanguard becoming an heir to 4e's most fun Defenders classes would be a real delight.
I have some very fond memories of playing a Swordmage.
I remember an interview when the devs said that they considered to give the precog treatment to the vanguard and fuse it with the solarian since the classes could be seen as close. I think an opportunity to see the vanguard will come, but later. In this way we will see a more unique (mechanically speaking) class.
Hmm, that would make sense. One of the reports from the SF2 demo last weekend said their version of the Solarian only did photon/graviton, but they were told there would be other options at release. Energy/resistance (from Tech Rev) obviously came to mind, but something like entropy/order or statis would incorporate Vanguard themes as well.
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(Huh, the Original Post was deleted...but top post I replied to was originally this one.)
I believe that those six classes are the whole roster of classes in the core rulebook; at least, that's the understanding I've gleaned from reading various comments.
This is probably correct, but, I think the door is still open for a seventh class on release. At least, a sapient can dream, right? :D
Hmm, that would make sense. One of the reports from the SF2 demo last weekend said their version of the Solarian only did photon/graviton, but they were told there would be other options at release. Energy/resistance (from Tech Rev) obviously came to mind, but something like entropy/order or statis would incorporate Vanguard themes as well.
This is really interesting to me: I agree that, thematically, Vanguard and Solarian have a lot in common - esoteric ascetic warriors who mystically draw power from obscure universal constants. Mechanically, they even have a decent amount in common: martial BAB progression, creating their own weapons, bouncing up and down a Class Point scale.
Lore-wise, I wonder what's more likely: create options for "vanguard-y" solarians that embrace the binary of Entropy and Order/Stasis/Homogeneity/Whatever? Or, make build options for "broken cycle" solarians which only draw power from one single element (instead of a pair of opposed elements) and have "just Entropy" be one of those options? Or, por que no los dos? There's lots of interesting ways it could go!
I don't know if this would actually be a good idea or not, but in a "maximum choice" version of the solarian, you could mix-and-match between:
- Binary opposed elements (classic) or single element (broken cycle)
- what your opposed binary (or single element) is: stars/black holes, electricity/resistance, or entropy/order (possibly more?)
- offensive build or defensive build
So you could build, say, a defensive 'tank' stellar broken cycle solarian just as easily as you could an offensive ranged Entropy solarian? I think I remember Thurston saying in one of the interviews that they were getting away with Solarians being locked into just a single solar manifestation: presumably that means you could put up your choice of a solar weapon, solar flare, or solar armour/shield, as desired?
Not sure I have a point, here, but - fun to think about!
This is probably correct, but, I think the door is still open for a seventh class on release. At least, a sapient can dream, right? :DI will dream as hard as I possibly can if it means mechanic is more likely to show up in the core rulebook :)
Not sure I qualify as sapient though, unfortunately.
I still say we'll be happier with the final result if we let both mechanic and engineer cook a bit longer. There's a clear arc in PF2 classes of the devs being willing and able to push them further into the strange and wonderful as they get more comfortable with the system... and both Mechanic and Technomancer seem like classes that would benefit from another cycle's worth of strange and wonderful.
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I'm not disagreeing, and honestly what I'm expecting/hoping is we get mechanic and nanocyte as the pair of classes in a very tech-focused book a bit later on, but I can also still WANT NOW while knowing it may not be the best path forward.I still say we'll be happier with the final result if we let both mechanic and engineer cook a bit longer. There's a clear arc in PF2 classes of the devs being willing and able to push them further into the strange and wonderful as they get more comfortable with the system... and both Mechanic and Technomancer seem like classes that would benefit from another cycle's worth of strange and wonderful.This is probably correct, but, I think the door is still open for a seventh class on release. At least, a sapient can dream, right? :DI will dream as hard as I possibly can if it means mechanic is more likely to show up in the core rulebook :)
Not sure I qualify as sapient though, unfortunately.
If SF2e has 2 player cores like the PF remaster then we could get all of the classes up front in 2 books in a fairly reasonable amount of time. Maybe have the vehicle rules in the first player book and the mech rules in the second with the more tech-oriented classes. Starfinder didn't have a GMG as part of its original core books so 2 player core type books could come out even closer together than they are in the PF remaster. No idea what will happen but having 2 player books out back to back could be a game change on how things get split up.