Toppling Tentacles

[Atalius]

Spell trickster seems like it has a cool feat at level 10 with Toppling Tentacles. Was looking for thoughts on this feat, is it better than Black Tentacles normal grappling effect?

[Blave]

It's not better or worse, just different.

Pros: Targets Reflex instead of Fortitude. Inflicts a -2 attack penalty on top of off-guard, so at least martial enemies are likely to waste an action standing up, which also trigger Reactive Strike and similar abilities.

Cons: Doesn't grapple. Immobilize is a harsh condition and getting rid of it doesn't only take an action (unlike prone) but will also affect the enemy's MAP. Grapple also potentially screws spellcasters.

[Atalius]

So what your saying is I should use Toppling Tentacles vs big bruisers and use the grappling variety vs casters.

Just noticed one significant difference between Toppling Tentacles and Black Tentacles, with Toppling the area is treated as difficult terrain.

[Velisruna]

One of the great things about the feat is you get to choose which option you use when you cast the spell. Being able to hit the right saves is critical for casters and having a single slot that can hit two different ones means it will rarely ever be a waste.

[Atalius]

Indeed, I'd say it's an upgrade from Black Tentacles because of the Difficult Terrain effect.

[The Total Package]

Since the Remaster unfortunately both the original Slither and Toppling Tentacles target Reflex. Which is a bit of a downer.

[Lia Wynn]

Also, Slither is not enemy only, so you may not get Reactive Strikes from allies when people stand up, since they likely do not want to be in the AoE themselves.

That said, Slither is a very good spell, and having an option to give it a variable effect would just make it better. Options do tend to be good to have.