Using an item while its in Gloves of Storing


Rules Questions


So, I've read the entry for Gloves of Storing multiple times, and I can't figure one thing out: Does an item stop functioning while being stored?

My character just got a Rod of Splendor, but doesn't want to openly carry it around all the time. He also just got a Gloves of Storing.

The Gloves read:

Quote:
This device is a single leather glove. On command, one item held in the hand wearing the glove disappears. The item can weigh no more than 20 pounds and must be able to be held in one hand. While stored, the item has negligible weight. With a snap of the fingers wearing the glove, the item reappears. A glove can only store one item at a time. Storing or retrieving the item is a free action. The item is shrunk down so small within the palm of the glove that it cannot be seen. Spell durations are not suppressed, but continue to expire. If the glove’s effect is suppressed or dispelled, the stored item appears instantly. A glove of storing uses up the wearer’s entire hands slot. The wearer may not use another item (even another glove of storing) that also uses the hands slot.

Please note, it says that the item is shrunk down, not stored inside the glove in any extra-dimensional sense. It also specifies that "Spell durations are not suppressed, but continue to expire."

The Rod of Splendor reads:

Quote:

The possessor of this fantastically bejeweled rod gains a +4 enhancement bonus to her Charisma score for as long as she holds or carries the item. Once per day, the rod garbs her in magically created clothing of the finest fabrics, and adorns her with furs and jewels.

Apparel created by the magic of the rod remains in existence for 12 hours. However, if the possessor attempts to sell or give away any part of it, use it for a spell component, or the like, all the apparel immediately disappears. The same applies if any of it is forcibly taken from her.

The value of the noble garb created by the rod ranges from 7,000 to 10,000 gp (1d4+6 x 1,000 gp)—1,000 gp for the fabric alone, 5,000 gp for the furs, and the rest for the jewels (maximum of 20 gems; maximum value 200 gp each).

In addition, the rod has a second special power, usable once per week. Upon command, it creates a palatial tent—a huge pavilion of silk 60 feet across. Inside the tent are temporary furnishings and food suitable to the splendor of the pavilion and sufficient to entertain as many as 100 people. The tent and its trappings last for 1 day. At the end of that time, the tent and all objects associated with it (including any items that were taken out of the tent) disappear.

Only the first sentence of the description matters for my purposes, specifically the part that says "...for as long as she holds or carries the item." As far as I understand the item I can have it strapped to my back and I still get the +4 CHA.

So, understanding these two items, if I put my Rod of Splendor in my Glove of Storing do I still count as carrying the item? Does it turn off while shrunk and stored?


I would argue no you don't count as carrying something when it's in any extradimensional space; that said, while the glove isn't technically an extradimensional space, I'd argue it does also act like one as there is no mention of the super tiny shrunk item fitting into the stitching or still being held in the palm (it is likely just floating a few micrometers away but that is still neither held nor carried). Secondly, if you can just have it hanging off your belt, why do you need it in an extradimensional space?


AwesomenessDog wrote:
I would argue no you don't count as carrying something when it's in any extradimensional space; that said, while the glove isn't technically an extradimensional space, I'd argue it does also act like one as there is no mention of the super tiny shrunk item fitting into the stitching or still being held in the palm (it is likely just floating a few micrometers away but that is still neither held nor carried). Secondly, if you can just have it hanging off your belt, why do you need it in an extradimensional space?

1) I don't want it in an extradimensional space.

2) I don't want people to know that I have (and am using) a Rod of Splendor. Its a very recognizable, insanely expensive magic item that increases your charisma.
3) I don't want someone to simply be able to steal it off of me, thus losing the +4 CHA I get from it (The character is a bard/Swashbuckler, every ability works off Charisma).
4) its not small, or light weight.
PRPG Core Rulebook pg. 484 wrote:
Rods weigh approximately 5 pounds. They range from 2 feet to 3 feet long and are usually made of iron or some other metal.

5) I want the item somewhere where it won't hinder the character's ability to move, or talk to people (preferably hidden), and I can't just put it in my backpack as that is a Handy Haversack, and I know it being in an extradimensional space means I don't count as carrying it.


Have you tried a headband of charisma then? Lighter weight, less obvious exactly what it does by verisimilitude of the slot and not otherwise being visually distinct like a rod, and above all else cheaper if you only care about the charisma.

If someone was going to steal or otherwise take away your ability to use a rod hanging from your belt, they would have so many other equally or more valid options.

This entire thing is starting to sound like a min/maxer's overreaching into the game design. 5lb isn't nothing but it's not significant for a bard/swashbuckler who wears light armor and have no other major kit pieces besides a sword (and buckler), unless you dumped strength. A paranoia that someone will ruin your build by taking away +2 stat modifiers, let alone instantly recognize you/what you're carrying to even have the idea to do so is a little absurd.

And even if someone does recognize your rod of +2 social skills, that doesn't inherently make you less trustworthy or would otherwise hinder your social situations in the opposite direction. Sure if you lie to people all the time, they will eventually become untrusting of you, but that's because they have caught you in lies before, not because they see you with a rod of +2 lying (and other things).


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It isn't noted as being an extradimensional space, and you are tying up an extra item slot and the use of the glove to stash the rod? I see no fine print or balance reason to not allow the rod to to function while stored.


AwesomenessDog

You can believe that I'm a min/maxer if you want. I didn't ask for a critique of how I play my character, I asked about how a rule works.

Since it seems you care though...

My character has a rod of splendor, he does not have a headband of charisma. Both the rod and the glove were treasure we acquired. They are what I have to work with. I can't simply exchange one for the other.

Do you know how sealing works as a combat maneuver?

Advanced Player's Guide pg. 322 wrote:
You can attempt to take an item from a foe as a standard action. This maneuver can be used in melee to take any item that is neither held nor hidden in a bag or pack. You must have at least one hand free (holding nothing) to attempt this maneuver.

If I have the rod on my side, there's no reason for someone to *not* attempt this even if they don't know what the rod is, as it is described as a "fantastically bejeweled rod " and is worth 25,000gp with a strong magical aura.

The rod gives my character 2 spell slots (one 3rd and one 4th), +2 DC on all his spell saves, +2 uses of panache per day, +2 to his charmed life ability (Charisma to saves as an immediate action), as well as +2 to all his charisma based skills. That's not a tiny amount of abilities, and even though they are what I mentioned in my last post, social skills are actually bottom of the list.

Liberty's Edge

You can carry the rod in a backpack, or in a quiver (it will use up about the same space as a single arrow) and it will still work.

While it is stored in the glove it is shrunk to a fraction of its normal size, I am not really convinced it will still work as normal.

If you store a lit torch, it will continue to shed light and it will burn down until it is consumed?


since the gloves use shrink item spell to craft and work a little like the spell (which can even transform burning fire int oa cloth etc) i was going to say the item is not itself or even there while shrunk but then i noticed that:

- "While stored, the item has negligible weight" - it is not in an extra dimensional space.
- "The item is shrunk down so small within the palm of the glove that it cannot be seen" - unlike the shrink item spell which say the item not only can be seen but can even resemble a piece of cloth (as in it changes it's form) - so it's not seen, but still there.
- "Spell durations are not suppressed, but continue to expire" - the item's magic seem to continue to function without any time distortion.

all in all it seem the item is still there right in your hand (unlike shapeshifted items which are absorbed into the form) but are stored into the glove more akin to in a pocket, still function (even items absorbed while shapeshifting continue to give their constant magic effect. this one should more so do so) and should prove to be very hard to notice and steal. it's not invisible or shapeshifted. it's shrunken to small and stored which mean revealing spells like true seeing wouldn't show it. and stealing abilities would have to be ones that can steal from magical closed pockets. (although stealing the entire glove should still be possible to any effect that can normally strip and steal gloves)


Diego Rossi wrote:

You can carry the rod in a backpack, or in a quiver (it will use up about the same space as a single arrow) and it will still work.

While it is stored in the glove it is shrunk to a fraction of its normal size, I am not really convinced it will still work as normal.

If you store a lit torch, it will continue to shed light and it will burn down until it is consumed?

the shrink item spell which mention the fire actuality is a transformation spell which change it into a piece of cloth. of course at this form until it changes back the fire won't bun down. but here it's only shrunk and stored. nothing call out for it to transform into something else. more so the pointed out weight being negligible and spell duration to continue seem to point out it's still there and function.

and even if you say it does change it's shape (into a cloth and then stored) it shouldn't work less then other shape changed items that continue to give their constant effect (more so since it is still carried\stored in the glove)


Diego Rossi wrote:

You can carry the rod in a backpack, or in a quiver (it will use up about the same space as a single arrow) and it will still work.

While it is stored in the glove it is shrunk to a fraction of its normal size, I am not really convinced it will still work as normal.

If you store a lit torch, it will continue to shed light and it will burn down until it is consumed?

Just noting I mentioned it earlier, but my character has a handy haversack. So he can't put the rod in his backpack, it will be in an extradimensional space.

As far as a quiver, its much bigger than an arrow. This isn't a wand, its a rod (usually 2-3 feet long and 5 pounds)


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If your GM rules against the glove of storing working for this try rolling the rod up in a ragged bedroll and hanging it off your haversack, should make it less of a theft risk.

Liberty's Edge

Nuclearspatula wrote:
Diego Rossi wrote:

You can carry the rod in a backpack, or in a quiver (it will use up about the same space as a single arrow) and it will still work.

While it is stored in the glove it is shrunk to a fraction of its normal size, I am not really convinced it will still work as normal.

If you store a lit torch, it will continue to shed light and it will burn down until it is consumed?

Just noting I mentioned it earlier, but my character has a handy haversack. So he can't put the rod in his backpack, it will be in an extradimensional space.

As far as a quiver, its much bigger than an arrow. This isn't a wand, its a rod (usually 2-3 feet long and 5 pounds)

A normal arrow is about 3 feet long. I will weigh less, but the rod is made of metal. The rod will have a larger diameter than an arrow (about 1" instead of 1/2"), but it will stay in a quiver (probably it will fit better if you put the head of the rod toward the bottom of the quiver).


An Efficient Quiver counts as an extra-dimensional/non-dimensional storage space.

Also, my rule of thumb is that an Efficient Quiver can store wands in the arrow section (max. 60), rods in the javelin section (max. 18), and by RAW it can store staves in the bow section (max. 6).

Liberty's Edge

Bellona wrote:
An Efficient Quiver counts as an extra-dimensional/non-dimensional storage space.

I didn't say "efficient quiver", simply "quiver", the mundane item.

.


A normal, mundane quiver (or any other normal mundane wearable container which it could fit in) could definitely work.

Use of a different container doesn't negate the question though. There's no need for my character to find a place to buy a quiver (he doesn't own one, or a bow) if the glove works.


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I'm afraid there is too much ambiguity to this, folks here have their ideas, but you just have to talk to your GM to know how it will work for you.


Java Man wrote:
I'm afraid there is too much ambiguity to this, folks here have their ideas, but you just have to talk to your GM to know how it will work for you.

That's essentially what I'm gathering.

So, thank you to everyone who's responding. I will show the thread to my GM, as it is ultimately his decision regardless.


Okay think of it like this. You activate a magic item and then place it on your backpack, the item would still be working right? Well the same thing is happening here.

I would treat the item as if it were stored in an easily accessible place. But the item would not be "wielded". The magic would still continue, but you would only really benefit if it is a "slotless" or "aura" item.


Nuclearspatula wrote:


Do you know how sealing works as a combat maneuver?
Advanced Player's Guide pg. 322 wrote:
You can attempt to take an item from a foe as a standard action. This maneuver can be used in melee to take any item that is neither held nor hidden in a bag or pack. You must have at least one hand free (holding nothing) to attempt this maneuver.

If I have the rod on my side, there's no reason for someone to *not* attempt this even if they don't know what the rod is, as it is described as a "fantastically bejeweled rod " and is worth 25,000gp with a strong magical aura.

If you carry this along with other level appropriate gear, no thief in his right mind would steal from someone as powerful as you.

Unless a campaign specifically involves you going up against a thieves guild, then worrying about items being stolen is a non-issue. Strap the rod to the bottom of your pack like a bedroll and go about your stuff.


Rod of Splendor [none] $250000 CL 12th.
Glove of Storing [hands] $10000 CL 6th.

yes, the Rod will operate while in the Glove but it cannot be activated while in the Glove (as it is not visible) and it requires daily activation or use.

The Glove can be stolen(and the stored item along with it), the Glove can be suppressed {Dispel Magic}, etc.
Your GM should take note of Armored Coat and the last lines in the description.

Advice
Mr. Sultan, this is a rather expensive & convoluted way to +4 enhc Cha along with a bunch of roleplaying opportunities and automatic™ theft detection.
--> you could just get a headband and make it easy.
if someone steals a gem and likely leaves the area of effect(your square) the whole thing collapses. see Emperor's New Clothes, so wear your nice bloomers!

There are several ways to make the Rod secure(not stealable) or unnoticeable while an effect lasts. I'm not sure I want to enable that and you should discover the spells on your own as that's part of the Fun! *my hint is the rod is a weapon and there are spells that affect weapons*


Finally the other sensible people arrive.

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