"Triple" Spellcaster

[John R.]

Is the following build legitimate? Has anyone tried it or something similar? Is it viable or a mess? If it is viable, is there anything else to fill in the rest of the feats to make it more ridiculous?

Class: Sorcerer
Ancestry: Anything that gives Multitalented
Lvl
1-
2- 1st Spellcasting Dedication
3-
4- 1st Basic Spellcasting
5-
6-
7-
8- 1st "Breadth"
9- Multitalented (2nd Spellcasting Dedication)
10- 2nd Basic Spellcasting
11-
12- 1st Expert Spellcasting
13-
14- 2nd Expert Spellcasting
15-
16- 2nd "Breadth"
17-
18- 1st Master Spellcasting
19-
20- 2nd Master Spellcasting

On a spreadsheet I got the following totals for spell slots at Lvl 20:

Cantrip: 9
1st: 8
2nd: 8
3rd: 8
4th: 8
5th: 8
6th: 8
7th: 6
8th: 6
9th: 4
10th: 1
Total Spell Slots: 65

Edit: Swapped 2nd "Breadth" and 2nd Expert Spellcasting

[shroudb]

you should really swap the "2nd Breadth" with the "2nd expert spellcasting"

at that level (16) 2nd breadth will give you 1 1st level spell, while expert spellcasting will give you a 4th, 5th, 6th level slot

[John R.]

shroudb wrote:

you should really swap the "2nd Breadth" with the "2nd expert spellcasting"

at that level (16) 2nd breadth will give you 1 1st level spell, while expert spellcasting will give you a 4th, 5th, 6th level slot

Good catch. Definitely smooths things out near the end. Changed.

[NECR0G1ANT]

Check out the Magaambyan Attendant archetype.

[Ravingdork]

It can get really crazy if your group is using the Free Archetype optional rule.

[graystone]

John R. wrote:

Is the following build legitimate? Has anyone tried it or something similar? Is it viable or a mess?

I've done it and it worked fine. I started with an oracle base. I LOATHE the curse mechanic, so I didn't intent to use it's focus spells or class feats so it was all good. Started with Bard MC then Sorcerer MC.

Feats went pretty close to yours except at 4th I picked up Hymn of Healing [to use those extra focus points and focus regen on] and pushed basic spellcasting to 6th.

Ravingdork wrote:

It can get really crazy if your group is using the Free Archetype optional rule.

That's nothing! Try Free Archetype on a Dual-Class character! Bonus point of you use Ancestry Paragon too. ;)

PS: with free archetype, you could add Eldritch Archer and Runescarred for 2 more cantrip-6th level and 1 7-8th level Cha based slots.

[Schreckstoff]

I was tinkering around with this idea but with Wizard as the base. Since there's 2 thesis that can do weird things with spell slots and also because their feats mostly suck.

The idea is fun I just didn't know if the investments was worth it in the end to skip lvl 20 feats for master spellcasting of another tradition.

[Ubertron_X]

Hm...makes me think about resurrecting some Cleric/Fighter/Magic-User from 2nd edition...

[shroudb]

Feat order aside, as far as my *critique* goes, I think that it is a viable build, if you want to do it for thematic/flavor reasons, but frankly i do not see the point:

with 2 spelllists you can cover pretty much everything you'll need from utility.

even with 1 extra spellcasting archetype you'd have access to around 50 spells/day, add staff, focus, class abilities, and it should be enough to be constantly spamming spells in and out of combat.

So the 2nd spellcasting archetype starts becoming redundant. While the actual high level feats of your class help make your pre-existing spells stronger.

Even simple things like having 1 free sustain every round is going to give you more power, while the question "do i cast a, b, c, d, e or f" changing to "do i cast a, b, c, d, e, f, or g" isn't going to have that many different outcomes.

[Gortle]

Yep. Go Primal/Occult or Arcane/Divine and you will have more than enough options.

[Dragonchess Player]

Alternately, starting with rogue as the base:

Human (Half-Elf) Bounty Hunter Rogue (Eldritch Trickster [Wizard Dedication] racket)
Starting 12 Str, 16 Dex, 12 Con, 14 Int, 12 Wis, 12 Cha
1st- Elf Atavism (Seer Elf), Nimble Dodge, Quick Identification
2nd- Magical Trickster, Expert in Arcana, Magical Shorthand
3rd- Ancestral Paragon (Natural Ambition [Trap Finder]), Expert in Thievery, Wary Disarmament
4th- Basic Wizard Spellcasting, Expert in Crafting, Magical Crafting
5th- 14 Str, 18 Dex, 16 Int, 14 Cha; Supernatural Charm, Expert in Stealth, Recognize Spell
6th- Basic Arcana (Conceal Spell), Expert in Nature, Natural Medicine
7th- Fleet, Master in Thievery, Quick Disarm
8th- Sorcerer Dedication (Fey bloodline), Master in Crafting, Inventor
9th- Multitalented (Bard Dedication [likely Polymath muse, but no real difference]), Master in Arcana, Quick Recognition
10th- 19 Dex, 14 Con, 18 Int, 16 Cha; Basic Sorcerer Spellcasting, Master in Nature, Oddity Identification
11th- Incredible Initiative, Master in Stealth, Swift Sneak
12th- Expert Wizard Spellcasting, Expert in Society, Streetwise
13th- General Training (Incredible Investiture), Master in Society, Hobnobber
14th- Expert Sorcerer Spellcasting, Expert in Intimidation, Lasting Coercion
15th- 16 Str, 20 Dex, 19 Int, 18 Cha; Toughness, Legendary in Arcana, Unified Theory
16th- Basic Bard Spellcasting, Legendary in Thievery, Intimidating Prowess
17th- General Training (Expeditious Search), Legendary in Crafting, Craft Anything
18th- Master Wizard Spellcasting, Legendary in Society, Legendary Codebreaker
19th- Intimidating Glare, Master in Intimidation, Battle Cry
20th- 18 Str, 16 Con, 20 Int, 14 Wis; Trickster's Ace, Legendary in Intimidation, Scare to Death

You don't get to cast quite as many spells, but you do get a boost on blasting, combat, and skill effectiveness. Note that going with Wizard Dedication first over Sorcerer Dedication means you can learn more spells, even if you can't cast as many. You could also start with Bard Dedication (Polymath Muse) instead of Wizard Dedication for Eldritch Trickster (swap Int and Cha, as well) and replace Basic Arcana (Conceal Spell) with Basic Muse's Whispers (Esoteric Polymath) to learn even more spells (replace Sorcerer Dedication/Spellcasting with Wizard and Bard Dedication/Spellcasting with Sorcerer in the progression above).

[RPGnoremac]

I think you can add a fourth archetype...

2 take dedications

4 take basic spellcasting

6 take random feat

8 take dedication

9 take multitalented

10+ take any combinations of spellcasting/breadth feats.

This can of course work for any class. So even a Martial can have a lot spell slots by level 12+.

Would I do this build? I might do this as a martial but probably never as a caster. Casters pretty much can cast quite a bit of spells already in most normal adventuring day.

It is nice that PF2E gives the option.

[shroudb]

RPGnoremac wrote:

I think you can add a fourth archetype...

2 take dedications

4 take basic spellcasting

6 take random feat

8 take dedication

9 take multitalented

10+ take any combinations of spellcasting/breadth feats.

This can of course work for any class. So even a Martial can have a lot spell slots by level 12+.

Would I do this build? I might do this as a martial but probably never as a caster. Casters pretty much can cast quite a bit of spells already in most normal adventuring day.

It is nice that PF2E gives the option.

it's not that you can't pick up dedication feats, it's that you wont have enough actual class feats to get the spellcasting ones for all those dedications.

just taking the expert and master spellcasting for 2 archetypes takes 4 out of 5 of your level 12-20 feats (and you need to spend the last remaining if oyu want Breadth on the second archetype as well)

so that means that if you add a 3th dedication you will be getting a cantrip or two from the base dedication and nothing else spellwise.